03 injector problems 30,000 miles

[Dr_Crane]

As this is my first post I hope you all will bear with me! First I would like to thank everyone here at the Diesel Page for your never ending supply of information. Anyway... here we go, back in May I noticed engine taking too long to start(3-4 seconds). In June starting to take 3-9 seconds longest on hot start after sitting for 30 to 60 min. Did search here and found sdaver had exactly same problem (injector flowing too much fuel to return side). Brought truck back to dealer they said it needed test port fitting! :rolleyes: And it would take a week to get! I said yeah right figured I'd bring truck back when I felt like it. Two weeks later truck wouldn't start, towed to dealer. Went there asked tech if he did return line volume check, he said yes..I asked if he got same amount of fuel from each head, he said no... I said he needed to remove rocker cover from side with more flow and test flow from each injector and replace the bad injector.... "But I don't want to tell you what to do you're the mechanic" he said it sounds like you know what you're talking about. I said I got this info from an internet site called The Diesel Page and from the service manuals. He said oh I know I'm a member! I said great!! do a search on long crank time and all will be good! Five days later I get truck back with new fuel manager and new return line(cracked) no new injctors. Truck seems to be OK but three days later problem is back, so back to dealer. Meantime I here about another local dealer with an 03 with same problem.. took them 3 weeks and $14,000 worth of warranty work before they finally replaced all 8 injectors. I relay this info to my dealer and strongly suggest that I get new set of injectors ( got that deer in the headlight stare again!) He said GM won't authorize all 8, I said no problem.. just fix the truck!!!! Stopped at dealer yesterday (9-22) and talked with tech... he said he replaced #1 injector and that side returned equal amounts of fuel...but... GM tech assistance advised him to re-test return amounts from both sides again and now too much fuel returning from other side (two more bad injectors) he went to order more and was told injectors no longer available until Jan 04!!! Tech was able to find 7 more at another dealer truck might be done Wed!! smile.gif Sorry for long post I even left out the amusing parts!

[dmaxalliTech]

Dr Crane, Welcome. Talk about a humbling experience, when the owner has to tell the tech how to daignose. Good Job! That injector back order thing is the latest in a line of not good news for people with problems... we are fighting to hold on to our remaining stock. The return volume test needs to be performed after EVERY injector replacment to make sure more arnt bad... Tell Niles Hello... :D

[Dr_Crane]

Dmaxallitech: it appears I might be in need of additional fuel filtration but it looks like I need about a week to read all the info here. What are your thoughts in a nutshell? Don't know who Niles is I'd rather not say tech's name he'll join in if he wants.
Also I have a theory: I think the reason they replaced the fuel manager is because the were diagnosing a NO START problem and when hand primer wouldn't build pressure (due to bad inj) service manual said to replace fuel manager. By the way this is about the time the truck decided to start.... but that's just my theory .. not going to ask dealer, they just lie anyway!!!

[ 09-23-2003, 06:13 PM: Message edited by: Dr_Crane ]

[FirstDiesel]

DR_Crane

Don't watch TV, huh?? Dmaxallitech was making a joke! smile.gif

[akrockhound]

Just want to add that on two occassions I too have had to get my mechanic on the right track with information I obtained from the diesel page.

[Dr_Crane]

First diesel: I tend to be a little slow at times...and only watch satellite stuff no locals or network feeds... can't stand Frasier but I actually do have a dog named Eddie!!! redface.gif

[dmaxalliTech]

Fuel filtration is an excellent idea, in a nutshell, get some. Lots of choices, pre-vs-post install, mounting locations, filter media's... blah blah blah....

I will tell you what I run, I wont make recommendations. I use the MEGA filter from Kennedy (http://www.kennedydiesel.com) and have also installed 2 or 3 other ones and have over 35000 combined miles with out a hiccup. Install is easy and filter is easy to get to. There are also kits from Racor, Cat and some others.. Read and make the choice that works best for you.

[RocketsDmax]

Whats with all the fuel return tests(vary lenghty), Checking the balancing rates w/tech2 tells you the condition of injectors in a fraction of the time! At least you can advise the customer a little better about posible length of repair. Just my .02, and ofcourse not all dmax problems are the same, Thats for sure....LOL!

[dmaxalliTech]

Originally posted by RocketsDmax:
Whats with all the fuel return tests(vary lenghty), Checking the balancing rates w/tech2 tells you the condition of injectors in a fraction of the time! At least you can advise the customer a little better about posible length of repair. Just my .02, and ofcourse not all dmax problems are the same, Thats for sure....LOL! While balance rates can for sure be an indication of trouble, thats also the exact reason that 99% of the dealers out there arnt fixing these trucks properly. They dont want to go through all that testing. Once you have then engine apart to replace the proven bad injector(s) by using balance rates, it dont take long at all to hook up the hoses and check return volume. Thats a much much more accurate way of testing them and they will show problems with that test before they will show up on balance rates

[Dr_Crane]

Todays update: Got call from service manager this morning telling me my truck won't be ready today because one high pressure line from common rail to injector won't seal :( :( Wondering if this sealing problem is common because the dealer with the $14,000 warranty problem also replaced lines? When the truck first started having problems I expected it to be at the dealer for 2-3 weeks monday will be day 20 so at least I'm too upset.....YET!!!!!!! Dealer seams to bo doing the best job they can based on the number of Durmaxes that have come in for repair (not many) and the amount of help (not much) GM tech assistance has been.

P.S. Hope someone else can relate to how much it pains me to have someone else work on my truck when I've been doing my own repairs since I was 15!!

[ 09-26-2003, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: Dr_Crane ]

[hapaschold]

i feel for you dr crane,
my d max has been in "sick bay" for 5 weeks now, waited 2 weeks for dmax tech to come back from vacation, 2 weeks for 2 injectors, then another week for 1 more injector, engine still has a vibration on acceleration, and doesnt run as strong as it used to. so, it s off to the "glue factory" for mine, traded yesterday on a new ford van. did diesel fuel make it s way in your crankcase?? best of luck with yours,

[Dr_Crane]

Hapaschold:
No fuel in crankcase as of yet however I feel that will be next. Planning to check oil weekly from now on.

[Dr_Crane]

No injector line in near future, I was told I need to wait for one to be made or for one to be pulled from assembly line!!!! How long does truck need to be at dealer for lemon law to take effect???? :mad: :mad: :mad:

[dmaxalliTech]

Crane, email me with what cyl they need the line for, might be able to help
Eric

[Dr_Crane]

Good news!!! Fuel line came in today and I picked up truck at dealer. Bad news.... crankcase 2 qts over full and smells like fuel. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: Will check oil level tomorrow afternoon and see if it gains more. Need to go back to dealer AGAIN for oil change at least. (better be free!!)

Eric: thanks for the offer, I do have a bunch of questions for you though, hope you don't mind if I e-mail you with them.

Mike

[DinoMax]

Dr Crane, sorry to hear about your problems. I would not run that thing very long w/ the fuel diluted oil. Nothing but bad can happen there :eek: I would call dealer and have them tow it in. If you think its been in the shop for a long time now, try waiting for a new turbo or engine rebuild. Hopefully, fuel is from original line problem & is now corrected. IMHO, dealer should have checked crankcase & changed oil before you picked truck up. Good Luck, and keep us posted. DinoMax :D :D

[dmaxalliTech]

Mike, Email away. I am just a click away

Eric

[hapaschold]

dr crane,

i had the problem over and over will fuel oil in crankcase, after picking up truck last saturday and driving 1 hour, i took 21 qts out when i got home, this monday am, i dropped the oil off at dealer, the service manager s comment,"the diesel fuel is like oil so dont worry about your engine". :eek: oh well !!!!!

[Dr_Crane]

Drove truck to work (20 miles), let idle for 3 hours and drove to dealer (10 miles). Checked oil level at dealer no noticable increase. Looks like fuel might have been there from before or from running diagnostic checks. Took truck right in (service manager actually greased the truck himself!) meantime I struck up a conversation with the parts guy and got the skinny on the long lead time for Isuzu parts. Seems Isuzu decided it was too costly for them to ship stuff overnight so they send parts regular ground freight and when they get around to it! He also told me that the tech did in fact order new sealing washers for the internal return lines.(I just had to know in case this might be the cause of the excess fuel in oil). I will continue to monitor the oil, order me a mega filter kit, and keep my fingers crossed!! All in all Carter Chevrolet has been very pleasant and easy to deal with and I feel that they did the best job they could based on the amount of help they got from GM.

Can't help but wonder how much this would have cost, I'm guessing around $10,000. Let you know if I find out.

Also, I got a survey from GM about my first service visit (7-31) I'm on page 4 of my letter in the comments section!!!! smile.gif

[Bigwheel]

GM better get on the ball, or maybe join in the current fun with the 6.0 psd..... :rolleyes:

[NETMINDER]

Posts like these scare me. It makes me feel like I'm in the Ford 6.0 forum. :confused:

[Dr_Crane]

Truck is not gaining oil as of yet! Looks like it just might be fixed!! smile.gif Just developed squeak in steering column though. Guess I'll figure out how to fix it here on TDP then go to dealer.

[dmaxalliTech]

Originally posted by NETMINDER:
Posts like these scare me. It makes me feel like I'm in the Ford 6.0 forum. :confused: I think alot of the scary posts we read on here are a direct result of the dealer more so then the truck we drive. No matter how bad the problem is, if the dealer can fix it in the first visit promptly, it makes the worst problems seem minor.

[NETMINDER]

ahhh. Very True

[hapaschold]

i could nt agree more about the dealer, but i my experience, the auto manufacturer also do not provide the support that dealers need to fix problems quickly, and get the customer back on the road. .
3 weeks for me at shop, 3 injectors, and crankcase still filling up with diesel fuel, not good..

[dmaxalliTech]

Originally posted by hapaschold:
i could nt agree more about the dealer, but i my experience, the auto manufacturer also do not provide the support that dealers need to fix problems quickly, and get the customer back on the road. .
3 weeks for me at shop, 3 injectors, and crankcase still filling up with diesel fuel, not good.. There is a great deal of support that I have found, of course it could be better, but you have to want to have it. Most dont go out of the way to get it. Gets back to the tech again IMHO

[RocketsDmax]

You know the best Tech on the planet cant fix the car right the first time if he cant get the parts he needs! GM and Izuzu need to pull there heads out again, GM was to have taken there time with this diesel iron out all the bugs make it right the first time, Well it pains me to see all the same problems that were had in the past havent been worked out. I feel for your common customer cause we as tech's will have no real worries when we have problems, we expect them, we see them every day, Customers just see a big hassel with there $40+ vehicle collecting dust in our service dept while the payments keep right on comming! Thanks for the vent time I had to try and explane to another customer and even to a tac consultant the meaning of the word back-order when it comes to dmax filters and injectors, Some times I just dont know what they are thinking. Thanks again for the time...RR

[Dr_Crane]

Just a little more good news. Ever since dealer changed oil now my "tick" is back!!! They also used that junk AC filter. I should have just changed it myself!! Don't know what they use for oil but it sure does stink! Worse than synthetic!

[Dr_Crane]

I really hate to post this, but one of my friends from the next town over just had his 02 dmax (60,000mi)towed to dealer. So far three bad injectors and dealer can't get any. I really hope I didn't start a trend east of the river!

[dmaxalliTech]

Good luck gettin them jectors, I am waiting for 24 and all are spoken for :eek:

[Tough Guy]

TTT


Da Boy ;)