Duramaximizer -vs.- Edge Juice -vs.- BD EZ Amp

[3TV]

Which of these is best for towing power? What are the differences between them? Why should I choose one over another? Which is going to help most for power, mileage, and be most trouble free?

Thanks.

3TV

[ 08-18-2002: Message edited by: 3TV ]</p>

[afp]

I have been asking the same questions. Here is a quick summary of what I've found:

EZ Amp is the same as the Juice. They increase power by changing timing (still well within safe limits) and fuel pluse width. The power comes on immediately from idle. (I drove a Juice equipped truck last night.) They are easy to install and remove. There have been various versions (starting with something like 3.0) that have addressed the bugs. Some of the bugs have been: when starting, it takes a few more turns of the starter for the truck to start, "fishbite" (truck jerking under certain load conditions), stalling under certain situations, difficulty in programming. The latest versions seem to have corrected all these problems. Any version can be sent back to the factory for the latest update free of charge.

The DMaximizer increases fuel pressure slightly (still well within safe limits) and doesn't alter timing. The power doesn't come in until 1/2 throttle. It's harder to install, but does provide infinite in-cab adjustability via a control knob. It is very smooth, doesn't increase smoke, and there have been virtually no complaints--except it makes 100 ft lbs of torque less than the Juice and the power doesn't come in until 1/2 throttle.

Most folks who have tested both are going with the Juice. I think this is because the DMax needs more response off idle, and the maximizer doesn't give you that. Of course, you could intall both......

Blaine

[GMC-2002-Dmax]

IMHO the "Juice" is it.

I have the latest version and it works flawlessly. No problems to date and it makes lots more power.

GMC smile.gif

[stretch]

I say go for broke, buy them both !!!! tongue.gif

[3TV]

Has anyone that tows heavy loads regularly with their Duramax/Allison had ANY transmission problems what-so-ever after adding an Edge Juice?

I want to wipe that smug grin off of my father's face in a bad bad way, and he owns a stock Powerstroke Ford. And it cannot be even close when we put these two powerhouses up against each other, we're talking about the need for total humiliation here :cool: . I've listened to his Ford crap for far too long now, LOL.

3TV

[SoCalDMAX]

OK,

So this is a grudge thing, eh? Here's my suggestion:

1. Air filter
2. EGT and Boost gauges
3. Juice or EZ amp, same thing
4. Kennedy's 4" or 4" to 5" exhaust system
5. Duramaximizer

Set Juice to level 3 in normal mode hot summer driving and 4 in cooler weather. Level 2 in T/H mode. Dial up Maximizer according to air temp and desired power/kill/smoke levels. Keep an eye on gauges.

Important: Do not gloat at the dinner table. Sometimes those old farts can move faster than you think... ;)

Regards, Steve

[Silver Bullet]

I came across Quadzilla this weekend. I think they are out of Ft. Worth. They have a JUICE look-a-like for the Duramax. I say look-a-like b/c it looked like the JUICE sittin' on the table in their booth at the huntin' show last weekend. Anybody know anything about their product?

[Black Dog]

3TV, you don't need any mods. Just beat him stock to stock. Any type of pulling or acceleration contest.

[FrozenAKJoe]

Thanks to everyone for this thread. I was wondering the same thing myself.

[stretch]

If its ONLY humiliation you are looking for, the "Juice" is sufficient. If its TOTAL ANNIHILATION you are seeking you gotta stack-um!!! tongue.gif ;) :D

[Silver Bullet]

I found the web site for Quadzilla...quadzillapower.com. There is a good explaination about how the unit works.

[FightinTXag]

If you click on products and then GM Duramax they show a 70hp/160ft-lb chip. If you click on pricing they show prices for a 70hp chip and a 120 hp chip. Assuming the torque increases proportionally to the hp the 120 hp chip would give ~275 more ft-lbs. :eek:

It would be interesting to see if the numbers are accurate. I'm also still wondering about the long-term effects of these chips and their additional power on the engine and the rest of the drivetrain particularly the Allison.

[imported_]

Quadzilla is the same as the vanaaken box....you have been warned..... too much rail pressure... hello leaky injectors

[afp]

I just got off the phone with "Quad," the main guy at Quadzilla. They have many styles of boxes. One is a 90 hp/250 ft lb like box the Juice (but seems to have had less growing pains), another has a switch actuated 35 or 70 hp/160 ft lbs box that increases fuel pressure a couple thousand PSI (which is well within factory limits), another is a 120 hp/ approx 200 ft lb box that increases fuel pressure something like 4,000 psi over factory (still within limits) and he's got some very powerful boxes in the works.

He does a lot of business in Texas, and hasn't really embraced Internet advertising yet. There are dealers in the DFW area that install his boxes. He says he's been in business for a year and a half. He recommended I try the 70 HP box for 30 days, and if I didn't like it, I could send it back and trade for another. His boxes have a 2 yr warranty. His prices are competitive.

Like JK, Quad doesn't think increasing fuel pressure a little is unsafe. He also works with Ford and Dodges. He spent a lot of time with me on the phone discussing pros and cons. He was a fountain of info. His phone number: (888) 842-6572 or (817) 842-6572.

Blaine

[mackin]

Wonder why they only show the "guts" of the box, no wrapper......Could it be ??????? Ask how long they have been in the development process.......Or did they let someone else do it and they do a little spray painting??????This guy had a line of BS too,but he at least said it was the Juice Box=&gt;http://www.dieselmax.com/...... I never dealt with them, Quadzilla, but buyer beware.....The four often mimicked and sold in different packages are Van Aaken,Bully Dog,Duramaximizer and Edge products......Did I forget any?
=&gt;http://www.vanaaken.com/duramax/index.html
=&gt;http://www.edgeproductsinc.com/
=&gt;http://www.duramaximizer.com/
=&gt;http://www.bullydog.com/ I see they don't sell the fuel pressure module now but they sell the JUICE with their sticker ...HHHHMMMM.....See what I mean?

So if you look good and hard you will see a resemblance,to one of these .....Say a gutted Van Aaken as mentioned above?.......


MAC :D

[ 08-19-2002: Message edited by: mackin ]</p>

[hdmax(mike)]

I would also like to know the real answer to this question. Looking at the Duramaximizer web site makes one think that the Juice is very bad.
Reading here tells me the Juice is the best.

What`s a guy to do? But both? ;)

[3TV]

Thanks for the replys everyone. I ordered an Edge "Juice" and a 4" exhaust system today.

Now, ... where to buy gauges?

3TV

[3TV]

I can't believe this, my truck is SIX DAYS OLD!

I'm a sick, sick man.

3TV

[mackin]

hdmax(mike) ,

Go with the opinion on the street.......Tried and TRUE REAL time tested......The consumer tells the honest truth......The JUICE is where it's at not to mention it is researched developed and tested by EDGE products that stands behind it 110% no matter where you bought it........No BS.......


MAC :D


3TV,

Your on the slide,can't stop and there is no sence in looking back .....Right SOCAL...... :D

[ 08-19-2002: Message edited by: mackin ]</p>

[afp]

I have some more info of the Quadzilla's.

The 70 HP box has two settings. The switch is an in cab, two position knob. The 35 HP setting is just a timing increase, the 70 HP setting is timing and the 2000 psi increase in fuel pressure. Nominally (according to both Quad and the DMaximizer folks), the stock DMax fuel pressure is around 22,000 psi.

The 120 HP box also has two settings. The 60 HP setting adds mainly timing and a little fuel pressure--less than the 70 HP box. The 120 HP setting adds timing and 4-4500 psi, which brings the fuel pressure to about 26,500 psi.

The 70 and 120 hp boxes do not greatly increase EGT. The 90 HP box (timing and pulse width like the Juice) does. The increased fuel pressure will obviously puts more wear and tear on the injector pump, especially if you run the 120 HP box at full and get on it all the time. Conversly, the timing style boxes put lots more heat into the turbo and exhaust system, even at lower power settings. This increased heat WILL shorten the life of those components. What none of us know is which is worse--more work on the injector pump or more heat into the turbo. I bet in a few years we'll all know.......

Mackin,

I do not disagree with you. It's "buyer beware" with ANY aftermarket system or component. None of these products have been around long enough on the DMax to really give me the "warm fuzzy" and confidence I have when I buy an Edlebrock intake, a Crane Cam, Leupold scopes, or Leica binoculars. There have been many many "growing pains" with the Juice. Hopefully, they are sorted out, but none of us will really know for a while.

Quad makes no bones about what he's doing. He takes Van Aken harware and burns them with his software. He also has been very candid about the problems he's experienced. A person or business who's not what they say usually don't admit to problems in such a candid manner. I have talked to the DMaximizer folks, the Juice folks, and Quad. None of these folks strike me as phony. Quad has been the most candid with me, followed by the Juice guys. We all will "connect" with different folks and pick certain products. I especially like the part that Quad is close enough for me to drive up and visit in an afternoon. When you add a 30 day money back guarantee and trade-up/down policy. I don't see where there is any more risk with him than the Juice folks.

Blaine

[PBR]

i am also the very proud owner of a new '02 chevy D/A rig and i am looking to "juice" it up but i have a few (basically stupid) questions.
- what are the long term affects of the "juice"?
- in order to change levels do you have to shut the truck off?
- this truck is my daily driver and i was wondering what levels do you guys run in just cruising around town or going to work?
- is it a pain in the a** to change levels?

this truck already has way more power than my old gasser but i don't want to risk doing any damage to get more power out of it. any advice/answers would be great.
thanks, ollie.

[GMC-2002-Dmax]

PBR,

Long term effects?? Don't know - I guess it's what you treat your truck like. If you beat it to death you will kill it. If you take care of it , it should last.

To change power you must be not running, but it's really easy and it has a confirm feature in v3.61C later. Mine is v3.61C. I have never had any problem changing levels.

I run my truck empty most of the time. Empty meaning a toolbox in the back with maybe 100 lbs in it and another 500-1000 lbs. of tile or whatever.

I run L4 in normal and L4 in T/H unless it rains then I shut it down completely. I will most likely remove it for the winter as well or just disable it.

If I tow I will run T/H in L2.

It really wakes the truck up especially off the line. From what I have read it defuels during full throttle shifts to protect the Allison. I am going to go out to 100K miles on the drivetrain only w/ an extended warranty just in case.

I am not expecting any problems, but ya never know.

GMC ;)

JUST BUY IT!!!! YOU WON'T REGRET IT. JUST ORDER GAUGES AND A BETTER AIR FILTER WITH IT. ;)

[ 08-19-2002: Message edited by: GMC-2002-Dmax ]</p>

[ChopperBill]

TV: How did you get the wife to let you pop for the Juice and the pipes? I had to beg for the nerfs and the mud flaps after signing the papers for the truck. :rolleyes:

[SoCalDMAX]

3TV,

Congrats on the truck, the Juice and exhaust! Give Kennedy a call for gauges, or if you're looking for a different brand, try DIS, or Summit Racing or Jegs...

MAC,

Yup, it's a very slippery, steep slope... ;) I'm hoping to hit bottom soon...

PBR,

My theory (and I'm open to other ideas) is that the life of the engine is affected by many factors: driving style, loaded or unloaded driving, proper lubrication, terrain, proper cooling, defective components and many others. If 2 perfect engines were given perfect lubrication and perfectly clean air and both driven on the same 5% hills towing 14,000lbs at 55mph, but one was Juiced, I honestly think the Juiced truck might last longer. It will pull in 5th vs 4th and turn lower rpms for a given distance.

If the Juiced truck were pushed to 75mph on those same hills and was near max load and EGT for a significant portion of it's life, it would definitely last a shorter lifespan. IMHO, it's more a matter of the owner's common sense and driving style than whether it's bombed or not. I think an improperly fitted air filter will kill a diesel faster than anything else (short of total coolant or oil loss.) Having said that, I'm pretty sure most of you are going to get a lot more miles from yours than I'm gonna get... ;)

ChopperBill,

It was very easy, he's using the old "It's easier to ask forgiveness than permission" technique. A couple of nights on your knees, some flowers, maybe dinner, and all's forgiven! :D

Now if we were married to DmaxDiva, it would be followed by a winch, grill guards, bigger tires/rims, driving lights, bigger stereo and more power! Ah well, a guy can dream... ;)

Regards, Steve

[ALLIMAX]

I run both the edge box and the duramaximiser. I usually just use the edge in level 2 for reg. tranny and level 4 for T/H mode when empty. I back it down to level 2 in T/H when loaded. I leave the duramaximiser off most of the time and do not use it at all when towing. I have found that turning the maximiser up to about 1/2 when running the edge box is best for speed runs. I have never had exhaust temps over 900 running this way. I also have a Kennedy exhaust and guages. You do feel a bit more with the maximiser turned on with the edge box also on.

[DMAXDiva]

Well Steve, me thinks that one "bombardier" per household is sufficient...one can only imagine the chaos that would surely ensue if both partners shared "the sickness" :eek: ...

Having said that, I will admit that I have been guilty of a foot-stamping fit before over something my hubby did that I didn't approve of...low and behold, it landed me those Ranch Hand bumpers...tee hee!!! ;)

[afp]

Well, afetr looking hard at everything, I am once again leaning toward the Juice. Reagrdless, I just ordered gauges from JK. I need to get a baseline before installing any performance box.

Blaine

[George Gozelski]

Don't know if this will help you or not but here goes! I had one of the first "new" Duramaximizers that would allow it to work in cruise control. The installation was a pain in the a_ _! Anyway, I finally got the thing installed, so here we go for the test run. Well, I really wasn't impressed when I "hogged" down on Blackie's accelerator pedal (so named by my 11 year old girl). I mean it did take off, but only after you really got into it. Next, I tried driving it with the cruise control on and all seemed okay. I clicked the cruise control on and off a couple of times and then it happened! It started skipping, fishbiting and jerking. So, I go back home to my driveway and pop the hood. I instantly smell diesel fuel coming from the top of my engine which was never there before.

I went on a big trip down south (from Alaska) and the thing really started messing up and I was in real trouble on I-5 in Seattle. Fortunately for me, I was able to pull over and "unhook" that #@%&$%&)(*_)*&*)*( thing!

One of the good things was, I just happened to have a brand new EZ-AMP (3.5)from B.D. Performance sitting under the back seat! Well, back at my friend's place in Seattle, I installed the new EZ-AMP. No problem in setting it up, went right to level 4! Wow, how simple can this be in comparison to the Duramaximizer!

Now for the test drive. My friend and I head back out to I-5 and holy %%$#@$^%$! When I hit the merge lane on I-5 guess who saw me and tried "crowding me out"? Some guy with a new looking Powerjoke! Well, when I stuck my foot into "Blackie" I'm here to tell you that I was leaving some serious real estate in my rear view mirror!

Now, I naturally had to let this guy in the Powerjoke catch back up to me. He was trying "real hard" not to look over at me at which time I made a lane change and left him in the dust!

So, there you have it. I tried both "boxes" and I like the EZ-AMP (same thing as the Juice) better than the Duramaximizer. I'm not here to sell or rate either manufacturers product, just relaying my own experiences.

Propane and exhaust are next!

[JOEDURAMAXIMIZER]

George,

After testing your unit, we found one of the gold terminals damaged in its connector... when a connector is intermittent - this was indeed causing your truck to cut out since it is one of the main data control wires communicating with the your PCM. This is not representative of the new Duramaximizer, and highly unusual.

If I can be of any further assistance please feel free to contact me at 714-985-4825 or joe@pacificp.com