4,000 Mile Trip towing on Veg-Advice

[sk8rdi16]

Here is my situation: 1995 Suburban 4.10 2wd, 320k, only ~150k on new motor. New radiator from GM. Converted to WVO with Greasecar.com 2 tank setup.
I will be taking a trip from MS to SoCal at the end of next week. I will be pulling a friends car and ~275 gal of vegetable oil. I figured I have over 5k in cargo.
My question is, can my suburban make it through the heat out in the Arizona area? I have not done any of the 'normal' mods most here do as in cooling, exhaust, etc. I do have the TurboMaster due to vacuum pump failure.
Could I just get an off the shelf 1997 water pump and bolt it on? I have a 195 Tstat that I think I will switch for the 180.
This will also be my first "heavy" towing experience.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!!

[markrinker]

Interesting. The 5K towed load + 275 gallons of veggie is within a safe weight range, however the variable I am wondering about is how much aerodynamic and rolling friction drag will be created by the car in tow. What kind of car is it? Will it be on a trailer, tow dolly, ???

Alot has to do with the how the air flows over and around your truck. Another factor is what tires are on the car, and what is spinning when its being towed. If you can remove a driveshaft on the towed vehicle to reduce drag and wear, do it! Make sure the towed vehicle tires are aired properly, and that its towing straight, and it shouldn't be much of a pull. Don't load the car with any extra stuff, put it in the truck if possible. Keep towed load as light as possible.

Do you run any gauges? EGTs are important, and a function of boost and fuel delivery, which you are modifying by burning WVO. If your boost is set too low OR too high, you could have problems. Don't tow "in the dark" !!!

As for the cooling mods, in a perfect situation you would convert to the later dual thermostat setup before leaving. Its that much better. I run it on truck #2 and the difference is dramatic.

If you can't upgrade to the dual thermostat system, get a heavy duty fan clutch installed before you leave, and de-bug the radiator. I'd also remove the thermostat altogether for max flow in the summer time, if you run the stock single t-stat system.

I run truck #1 this way in the summer with an otherwise stock cooling system and stock fan clutch. It runs ~20 degrees cooler unloaded or under tow, which correlates to 'alot' in cylinder head temps. It used to get over 210 towing boats and will run 180s all day without the t-stat limiting flow.

Be ready to slow down in Arizona and plan your trip to avoid mountain passes if possible. Consider driving at night through the hottest parts. Stay south and hook north after you hit CA.

Good luck! Let us know how it goes!!!

[ 07-09-2005, 04:58 PM: Message edited by: Mark Rinker ]

[dslpwr]

As long as your fan clutch is working 5k should be no problem. EGT gauges is a must.

[sk8rdi16]

The car we will be towing is a '96 Toyota Camry. The only way I can see to get the grease and the car over there is to use atleast an 18' flatbed trailer with the grease tote at the front and the car towards the rear.
I would love to do the dual thermostat and HO water pump, but my finances being a college student don't think its such a good idea!

Where is the best place to get the EGT gauge, this is just a Pyrometer correct? Where should it be placed in the exhaust flow? Would I need to tap the exhaust pipe?

Thanks!

[GMC Hauler]

EGT is a pyrometer. I think the easiest place is on the driver side in the crossover pipe, just below the exhaust manifold. Isspro makes a nice gage. I got mine through US Diesel, which is an advertiser on this site. You will also need a gage pod. You need to think about this. You may want more gages in the future, in which case you should buy the currect gage pod now.

[DChristie]

Will you be burning the WVO on the trip or just hauling it? I towed my '64 chevy home burning WVO a while back, it ran great. My.02$ if your kit doesn't have one, add a temp gage for the WVO just before it enters the IP. I fried one IP :( (no pun intended) on WVO because I let the WVO get too hot.
I'm not sure how the greasecar kit heats the oil, but if it uses engine coolant, and your engine temps start to climb above 200deg switch back to diesel. As long as your engine temps are roughly 185 195deg's you'll be ok.
I built my system, and am still working out a more closley reliable 160 deg regulator. :D

Enjoy the WVO, don't let it get behind your ears.
OH, btw running on WVO put me off of fried foods for a little over a year. :D

DChristie

[markrinker]

A good dual axle trailer with tall 15" or 16" tires will pull/roll as easily as the car would have, it just adds more weight.

I have a used pyrometer that you can have. It works fine, but will occasionally stick and you simply have to 'flick' the face of the guage and it will return to proper operation. Does not include the sender. Are there any other DP members out there who will donate a sender to this college student?

In order of importance to your motor's survival, here are the mods I believe you should consider before embarking on the trip:

1) Gauges - EGT and boost. These will let you know when trouble is brewing, before it gets out of hand. Setting your Turbo-Master properly for the load will make a big difference in driveability and EGTs. You may need more or less boost on WVO than diesel.

2) Fan clutch / high flow water pump / dual t-stat water neck. IF YOU DO NOTHING ELSE - clean the bugs out of your radiator and in-between the condensor, oil coolers, etc. Remove the thermostat and run without. (Don't forget to replace this fall...)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46096&item=7984799055&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

[ 07-10-2005, 05:26 AM: Message edited by: Mark Rinker ]

[sk8rdi16]

That gauge would be great!!! I would really appreciate it!
About the boost levels, would I just need to turn it down if I saw the EGT getting too high? I have read there is a debate about the exact temp. Most people say anything under 1200 is ok?
You can email me at pat at heidingsfelders.com

Thanks all!!

[markrinker]

Not that simple. Too low boost can cause high EGTs as unburned fuel exits the cylinders. Too high boost stresses turbos and engine internals.

Another BIG variable is your right foot and expectations regarding towing speeds. 60mph expectation could mean a suceesful trip. 70mph expectation could mean a blown engine and ruined trip. Your 4.10 gears are helpful. What size rubber do you run?

Email me your name and mailing address and I'll drop the gauge to you UPS Monday. mark_rinker@hotmail.com

[ 07-10-2005, 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Mark Rinker ]

[GMC Hauler]

Just the opposite. You want to turn boost up to keep temperatures down. Don't allow boost to go above 12# steady state without intercooling. The boost has a cooling effect. If, after you have your boost set at 12# and EGT's are still getting too high, you need to slow down. What gear you drive in is also important. Do some more searching, but basically, third gear (direct) will tow better than second gear (as far as EGT's go), and overdrive will tow better than all of them. The difference in EGT's between the gears is noticeable. If you have time and $5-10, you could install a mod that locks the torque converter in second gear (this is only usefull on hills like mountain passes). here is the link: Cheap TCC Lock (http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005187)

Not to overload you, but something not so related but could be is a way to increase line pressure to the transmission to increase its holding capability and shift firmness. Click the link in my signature line to see how to do this real cheap. You may not need this right away. Now that i have it, I wouldn't drive without it.

[MTTwister]

GMC - do you use this WITH the TCC lockup?
How do you determine when to switch?
How do you know what switch position you're currently in?
Does it matter? ie - could a guy just wire up a "mid" pressure level resistor set and leave it at that?
Thanks -- Nice documentation, BTW.

[GMC Hauler]

I do not use the shift kit switch with TCC lockup. I think it puts the transmission at max line pressure already.

The knob has a pointer. 270 degrees is off, 90 degrees is full on. In between are 4 positions. I usually use the second position, which is 45 ohms. You could wire in a resistor permanently and forgo the switch.

I use more resistance for non towing situations, and more resistance for towing situations. Less resistance provides more line pressure, which increases holding capacity of the transmission and prevents slippage.

The TCC lock I use only on steep hills. Read all the posts in the page for advice on how to operate the TCC switch. That's what I did.

I used a pushbutton switch from Autozone that surface mounts. It has two LED's, one for off and one for on. That switch module turns on and off a relay that puts the resistance on the TFT (Trans fluid Temperature sensor). I didn't make any posts of that because it is covered pretty good in the page, but if you wish, I could put something together.

[97SubK2500]

Well, how did your greasecar.com conversion work for your trip?

--Ian