PMD Warranty issue

[waynep]

Hello All:

Just returned from dealer. Said I need a new PMD, codes P1216 and P1217. Said PMD is not covered under extended warranty. Is this true??
Also, how hard is it to change. Does one have to remove the intake manafold. All advice appreciated.

Thank you, Wayne

[Kennedy]

PMD is part of the pump and should be covered by the special policy bulletin.

[ANXIOUS-SUBMAN]

Search result (one of many)

http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=004759

[waynep]

Hello All:

Just called the 800 number and they said that the PMD is not covered under warranty by itself. There has to be a failure in the injection pump to get the whole assy covered, but not just the PMD. Help, what next. Any assistance appreciated.
Regards, Wayne

[CoachWagner]

The intake needs to be removed. I wasn't too bad of a job if you are ok with a wrench.

[charliepeterson]

Try another dealer for the PMD failure. As stated above it is covered by special policy #00064D.

[chickenhunterbob]

So far as I know, the PMD is covered under the special policy.

This depends on the date you truck in service, as the policy extends to 11 years (anytime on or after July 6, 1994) or 120,000 miles (193,000Km)

The previous owner of my truck had the PMD alone changed under the warrant, perhaps I'm thinkin' they maybe should have changed the pump and all, but they didn't and it still runs fine.

What to do? What I would do, is maybe go back to the dealer, or a different one, with a copy of special policy #00064D, I think copy in the member section, and also some tips on dealing with the dealer, on this and other matters.

Good luck!

[markrinker]

If you do strike out on the warranty claim, you can remote mount a new PMD (also referred to as FSD or Fuel Solenoid Driver) on an aftermarket heat sink elsewhere under the hood using an extension harness. Some even mount it behind the bumper for better air flow. The heat on the injector pump shortens the life of a PMDs electronics.

No need to remove the intake with this well proven retrofit. Search the rest of the site for more info. Kennedy Diesel and other advertisers here sell the whole package you'll need, FSD/heatsind/extension harness. Installation is 15-30 minutes rather than 3-4 hours.

[Kennedy]

Yes, at the risk of sounding like I am just trying to sell something, I could suggest my Deluxe FSD pkg and in 30 minutes or so you'll be on your way. Would be nice to have the dealer warranty it though...

[waynep]

Hello All:

Well I am calling GM again but no luck so far. I have a full copy of the latest TSB, #00064F and it clearly shows on page ten thet there are three possibilities for repair or replacement:
1. Replace diesel injection pump
2. Replace Electronic Shut Off Solenoid
3. Replace pump mounted driver
It seems pretty clear to me that then PMD is covered by GM said otherwise?? The trouble is that no where else does it specifically say anything about the PMD. I have less than 120K and 11 years. Options???

[waynep]

Hello All:

I can't believe GM. I called again and they said that the PMD is only covered if the injection pump caused it to fail. The dealer said that the injection pump did not cause it to fail, thus no warranty on the PMD. I asked that if the injection pump caused the PMD to fail, then would it be covered under warranty, and GM said yes, they would cover the PMD and replace only the PMD. I said that this does not make any sense, replacing only a PMD on an injection pump that caused it to fail. They said that this is the policy and I have no recourse. HELP, any suggestions appreciated. Regards, Wayne

[JohnC]

So lemme see if I have this straight. They will replace the FSD if failed and the pump is OK, but only if the pump caused it to fail? Anyone see a flaw in this?

And how do they determine that the pump caused it to fail, anyhow?

[BrentN]

Waynep,
When I had my stalling on my 99 a few months ago my dealer tried to balk...not badly, but he claimed that the pump needed to be exhibiting the failure for him...it was intermittent for me, not totally dead, but we all know it is a matter of time.
I told him that I am a reasonable man, however, I said, we both know that this pump & pmd have problems..since GM issued the 120k/11 year warranty.
I told him that I understood that he really needed it to be failed, but I said the symptoms are well known and that they are documented, it will fail eventually.
I said, my vehicle is within the warranty period, and that if he didnt want to repair it now, until it went totally dead, I told him that I would need him to document that for me.
I then added the hook, I said, as a representative of your dealer, and GM, be aware that should the vehicle stall, where injury or damage to my vehicle, family or others occurred, I would make sure that my insurance company would get a copy of all the documentation of the problem and Chevys refusal to fix it at this time and that they should seek reimbursement for any losses they paid for from GM. I added that at that point I would also be suing for negligence.

He also agreed that he wouldnt want to have his wife and kids riding around in it. He said he would have his mechanic take a second look!

Later that day, he called and said he was able to get the pump authorized.

I dont like to take people there, but when backed into a corner, you can usually make people see reason with a well structured argument. (especially when the threat of litigation is real to them...I am not a sue happy person, just an engineer who lays the data out as I see it.)

Give your dealer another try. Then try another one, making sure you have hard codes and a Check engine light on when you deliver it.

Good luck!

Later that

[ucdavis]

I'm a little confused on the diagnosis. 1216/1217 are fuel solenoid repsonse. That's a part of the IP, but controlled by FSD. How do ya tell which one is causing the failure? I don't know of a way.

Another approach would be to "repair" the FSD, or take a crack at it anyway. Have to remove it from the pump & either reinstall or put it on a heatsink. More info on "repairing" and more FSD poop than a body can stand @
Thread 1 (http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005199#000000) and
Thread 2 (http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005013#000000)

[waynep]

Hello All:

Believe it or not this is exactly what GM said. If the pump caused the PMD to fail then the PMD is covered under warranty, and they would replace only the PMD. But, the delaer said that the pump did not cause the failure, thus no warranty.
Any suggestions on how I can get the required codes in order to get it fixed under warranty? I hate to be so un resonable about this but they really are being stubborn about this. THis is the samre dealer that tried to charge me $100 last time for the last pump replacement.
Regards,

Wayne

[JohnC]

If your truck has a fuse labled "Fuel Solenoid" pull it and see if you can start it ;) Otherwise, as a diagnostic test, of course, unplug the optical sensor and start it.

[waynep]

Thank you JC for the disgnostic test suggestions.
I appreciate any and all input.

BUT, I think that I have found a dealer that will replace the PMD under warranty. I called and told them my saga and he said that he hears this all the time and of course the PMD is covered under the pump warranty. He also said that underhood temps are what kills the PMD.
I called GM again and they said that they totally rely on what the dealer says re the warranty. Also that the special policy is "absolute" and that if you are 1 mile over the limit, they will not cover it. Bottom line, you have to "dealer shop' in order to get the warranty honored.


Also, I appreciate any and all suggestions on what it takes to set the proper codes so they will replace the pump too. The dealer that I talked to said that it is best to replace the complete pump, but that htye need the proper codes to be set to do so. Suggestions appreciated.

Also, the new dealer said that they would set my TDC offset learn to whatever value that I wanted. Is -1.92 still the accepted best value??

Regards,
Wayne

[JohnC]

Originally posted by waynep:
Also, I appreciate any and all suggestions on what it takes to set the proper codes so they will replace the pump too. That's what the "diagnostics" are for!

[BUZZ]

I had a brand new remote mounted FSD in a cooler. Started throwing code 35 in less then 6 months. I did the duty of checking all gnds and connections. Replaced the FSD with one on my spares, code left. This replacement driver is one that likes to shut down without warning. I bit the dog and bought a Sol d. I stated to think about the FSD. Over the years the IP has been improved to overcome problems. I wonder if the fuel distribution solenoid has been upgraded as well to a beefier unit. If this is the case has the FSD been upgraded to carry the additional load? I don't know, but I do know this. My Sol d has 1500 towing miles on it and not a single problem, nothing, squat.
I have FSD cooler for sale.
Buzz

[gmenor]

I went round for round with Stanadyne on this issue only to get more PO'ed. The dealership that I deal with told me that the FSD has a warranty "if" it is installed by a certified Stanadyne mechanic for 12 months or 12,000 miles within a year. I know this is off your issue but, it is an FYI. Additionally, it has to be mounted on the IP.

[waynep]

Hello All:

Saga continues. New dealer, really excellent diesel mechanic, said I have all the codes for a total pump and FSD replacement under warranty.
Thanks to all for their help. GM could have gotten off with just a PMD/FSD replacement, but by being difficult, they end up replacing the whole assy. under warranty. Oh well.
Mech. also found that a bolt had broken off on the pass side exhaust manifold that was causing exhaust blow by. So that was what all that ticking was coming from from under the turbo.
Also said I need a new harmonic balancer. Is that a big job? Thanks again, Wayne

[waynep]

Hello All:

Picked up the truck yesterday and it is running better than it ever has. New pump and driver under warranty. Excellent diesel mechanic. Let's hope this one lasts longer than the last one, 35 K miles till dead. Only 5 k left on the warranty. I wonder if GM will ever extend it beyond 120 K miles?
Regards,
Wayne

[surfbeetle]

Originally posted by waynep:
Hello All:

Picked up the truck yesterday and it is running better than it ever has. New pump and driver under warranty. Excellent diesel mechanic. Let's hope this one lasts longer than the last one, 35 K miles till dead. Only 5 k left on the warranty. I wonder if GM will ever extend it beyond 120 K miles?
Regards,
Wayne Yes they will, you may only have 5k left on the original vehicle warranty, but you have 12 months or 12,000 miles left on the pump warranty. I know because I got a new pump at 117,000 and then 11,000 later, got another new one covered under warranty. I have a black sub and according to the history, it's had seven pumps since 1997. Heat is definitely an issue and black is the worst for that.