Synthetic - I am convinced.

[slagona]

For the last 8 years, I've been contemplating running synthetic at least during the winter. Never made the leap. Never had a no-start during the cold weather - so I wasn't overly concerned. However, when I had my '95 low compression pennisular diesel, I made sure I went out at lunch and started it each day during cold weather.

Then came the $12.84 walmart semi-synthetic Rotella-T. I don't get to walmart very often - when I did the shelves were always empty. 8 weeks ago, the shelves were full and I bought 2 jugs. We've had plenty of cold weather the last 2 months. My garage has been full - so the suburban has been outside. No problem starting at -1*F with 15W-40 Dino Rotella - but not cranking nearly as fast as I'd like. It was finally time for the oil change - and this morning at -4*F was the first cold start on the Synthetic. The engine spun like it was 90*F out.

I am converted. I can't believe I didn't switch earlier. I highly recommend going with the synthetic - especially during the cold weather. If you have been considering it as I was - DO IT. You won't believe the difference.

--Scott

[rjschoolcraft]

I second that. However, the Shell Rotella T 5w-40 synthetic is a fully synthetic oil. It's good stuff.

[slagona]

Opps - yes, mis-spoke there....... Thanks for the correction...... Also, it's $12.84 a gallon.....

[GMCfourX4]

I'm also in agreement, and I'd like to add that the amount of noise from the engine on those REALLY cold days isn't as bad with the synthetic.
As a side note, I believe the Rotella T Synthetic is a conventional oil that is processed to be like a synthetic... If I'm remembering correctly what I read about different types of oils. Dr.Lee???

-Chris

[rjschoolcraft]

Quoting from Shell's website:

"The proprietary Shell formulation meets virtually every advanced OEM specification. Because it uses the Shell synthetic base oil technology, ROTELLA

[slagona]

I believe the progression of Walmart's supply went from Dino only to Dino and Synthetic Blend and then finally to Dino and Fully Synthetic (fully is according to Shell's website). That is what I was trying to convey on my original post. When Walmart first stocked it - I believe it was the blend. They are now stocking fully synthetic. If it wasn't walmart - then members were getting the blend elsewhere before there was talk of Rotella Fully Synthetic.......

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

I've been running the 5@-40 Synthetic Rotella in everything I own for (I think) more than a year now. I always had wanted to run synthetic, but couldn't justify the cost. At $12.84/gallon, with my daughter's WalMart employee 10% discount, it was just under $3/quart. That was good enough for me. I don't get the discount anymore, but only stocking one oil for everything works for me.

Most folks are unaware that you can order as much of this as you like from your local WalMart. At least three times now I've called or visited the auto dept. manager & told him I want another five cases. In a month or two he calls me back & lets me know that four or five cases are available.

I always tell him to order five cases because I want him to know I'm serious about my order, & I maintain so many vehicles.

I'm pretty sure making this work would involve some relationship-building. This auto dept. mgr. has been real good to deal with; with some others it might take a couple cycles of this to make it work.

[JohnC]

Until last year I lived in the flatlands of Massachusetts. 15w-40 worked out fine. The number of nights where the temperature dropped below zero could generally be counted on the fingers of one hand. Last year, in the mountains of upstate New York, with one of the coldest winters in recent history (must be global warming...), I wished I had put in thinner or synthetic oil. This year I did. Well worth every extra penny it cost. I just wish I'd put it in the tractor too... (I'll do it next year...)

[jbplock]

Originally posted by slagona:
... Then came the $12.84 walmart semi-synthetic Rotella-T... It's my understanding that Rotella T 5w40 “synthetic” is made from Group III basestock.

Other Synthetics like Delvac-1 (Mobil-1 Truck & SUV) and AMSOIL are made from Group IV PAO basestocks.

Both types are excellent choices for our Diesels (IMHO).

Here is a quote from a BITOG post by G-Mann-II (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=006801#000003) that summarizes the difference.

“Group IV is PAO, polyalphaolefin. It is produced using a catalyst, hydrogen, heat, and pressure. The feedstock (the raw building blocks) is ethylene gas, and these small gas molecules are "built up" to form larger oil molecules. This is called polymerization. As you pointed out correctly, Group II and III are produced by a catalytic process, too, but the feedstock is the VGO (vacuum gas oil from the crude oil distiller), and the catalytic process used to produce these base oils is not polymerization, but isomerization. The oil and other molecules contained in the VGO are converted into fully saturated hydrocarbon molecules, yielding a chemically pure base oil.

Group V is esters and other base oils that don't fall into any other category. Some additives are esterfied, but generally when we talk about Group V, we are talking about ester base oils”

More info:

Group III: Better, but still not PAO (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=008656)

Evolution of Base Oils (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000042)

smile.gif

[ol9465er]

I've been contemplating synthetic oil now for a while but diesel mechanics I've talked warned against it because of the possibilty of leaks in an older engines. Comments?

Also, it seems all the posts suggest that everyone is running 5-40 all year round (even in the summer) - Comments?

Cheers.

ol9465er
Stock 94 Chev 6.5 (except for SOL-D)
280,000 Km's

[More Power]

Way back when (late 70's) Mobil One was first introduced, I read about the advantages, and decided to run it in my new Yamaha XS750 street bike. Within a few hundred miles, every rubber seal and gasket began leaking like a sieve. I disassembled the engine and changed all the gaskets and o-rings myself. I didn't have a high regard for synthetic oil for quite some time.

Times change and so did synthetic oil. Mobil recognized their synthetic oil didn't have the seal swelling qualities it needed, and changed the formulation. I've run syn in several engines since the mid '90's without a problem. Lil Red has Mobil Delvac 1 in it right now.

MP

[MikeC]

My Burban had 62K on it when I bought it. I have no idea what oil was run in it prior to my ownership. One of the first things I did was to put synthetic in it after running the Amsoil engine flush.

The only leak I have had was the weaping oil lines which are a known issue.

I run the Rotella synthetic in everything from my 6 hp lawn mower up to my Burban. Now if I could only figure out how to get them all to take the same filter(s) but, I don't know where to mount the bypass set up on the push mower :D

Mike

[ol9465er]

MP/MC Thanks for the info. I'm getting more convinced.

I've been doing more reading though and now wonder about oil changes with synthetics. Some manufactures recommend 2 or 3 times the normal interval. Are there any recommendations from TDP members in-the-know.

Also, what about oil filters changes. The oil manufactures I read recommended still changing the filters at the normal intervals for normal oils.

ol9465er
Stock 94 6.5 3/4T EC LB 280,000 KM's
(except for SOL-D)

[More Power]

Synthetic oil helps provide a better piston ring seal, which reduces the amount of soot deposited in the engine oil (and it also reduces oil consumption). The soot load is the primary factor determining drain interval. With synthetic oil, you should be able to increase service intervals by 20-30% over a conventional oil, but an engine oil analysis provides the best info on oil status and soot load.

A not quite so accurate way to determine oil status is to look at the oil on the dip stick. If it's opaque (like black paint), it needs to be drained. If there is still some transparency to it, even though still dark, it's likely OK for a while yet.

MP

[jbplock]

Originally posted by More Power:
... an engine oil analysis provides the best info on oil status and soot load.

... A not quite so accurate way to determine oil status is to look at the oil on the dip stick... I've been running synthetic oil in my Duramax since 3kmiles... Oil on the dipstick always looks clean and the UOA's are good too.

http://thumb3.webshots.com/s/thumb1/6/68/83/74166883ZQtfsc_th.jpg
Oil On Dip stick after 3kmiles of use (http://community.webshots.com/photo/65003591/74166883ZQtfsc)

http://thumb5.webshots.com/s/thumb4/4/48/15/101944815PzvgOr_th.jpg
Oil after 5kmiles of use (http://community.webshots.com/photo/65003591/101944815PzvgOr)

http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/16/16/0/87/39/229808739UoqnFU_th.jpg
Used Oil Analysis Report (http://community.webshots.com/photo/65003591/229808739UoqnFU)

smile.gif

[Diesel Don '98]

The lighter weight synthetic oil gets up to the turbo bearings faster on those cold mornings,too.

[More Power]

We produced an article about engine oil analysis a few years ago, but the information and recommendations expressed are still valid.

Click HERE (http://www.thedieselpage.com/members/features/oilanal.htm) to see this member article.

MP

[Lug]

I was going to run the synthetic rotella in my 95 but the owners manual says 15w 50 only. Any reason why GM chose to limit the oil.
Justin

[ace58]

I ran Mobil 1 in my 1999 Suburban for 150K miles without any problems, oil related. After the block cracked and the engine was disassembled, I was amazed at how little wear the bearings, rings and even the cylinder walls had.

[Wheat Whacker]

I too am a believer in the synthetic oil. I ran Rotella 15w-40 dino the first year I had my 6.5L and the next year I switched to Amsoil 15w-40 syn and what a difference in winter starts escpecially anything below 0 degrees and the 20 and 30 below 0 that we get here it is a great advantage in cold starts. The oil pressure seems to come up a little faster when it is cold.

[Scooby]

We all know how opinions are, but I still feel I must say my vote goes to AMSOIL. I am amazed how much better all my vehicles run since converting 2 years ago. I was a hard sell on the synthetics, due to the cost, and my NEED to change oil to keep it clean. Amsoil makes quality filters with extended service intervals, and that was the ticket to get me to switch. Filter the oil well, and I will let it run longer. I have been doing my 6.5 every 5000 miles. I havent tested the oil, so I dont know if this is too long or not. Amsoil is very competitivly priced, especially if you become a preferred customer (wholesale prices), which you can do on their website. Many of the other synthetics are NOT made from true synthetic base stocks. POE is the way to go.
PS- my 94 Astro van had 190,000 miles when I switched to synthetic, and I had no oil leak trouble. Amsoil does offer an oil with reduced service life for older vehicles if someone wanted to go that route. I use the 25000 mile oil (in gas engine), and the filters are rated at 12500. I change both at 12500 and still save over my old 2500- 3000 mile changes.

[fastcat800]

Who's running 5W-40 Amsoil year round? I changed oil as soon as I got the truck home after I bought it a month ago and it starts great even when it's cold out (-15 to -20F). I park in remote areas when snowmobiling for 2-3 days and need to know it will start when I return and there is no help close by. Does it maintain the same oil pressure as good as 15W-40 does at crusing RPM. Mine holds 40 PSI on the gage at 2000-2500 RPM. In theory it should hold the same pressure when warm as 15W-40 a be thinner when cold. The first number is viscosity at 0 degrees F and the second number is the viscosity at 212 degrees F.

[Kidd]

I run Exxon 0W-40 full synthetic year round. Temps here can run from -48 to +17 C on one oil change.. that was the range in the last 2 weeks.
I like the way I have oil pressure almost instantly on a cold start. I do oil changes on the same interval as the old Dino lube, oil is cheap compared to a new engine.
K.D.

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

I run 5W-40 Rotella Synthetic in everything. Both the pickup & Sub show no change in oil pressure vs. 15W-40 Rotella.

Blessings!

Brian Johnson, # 5044

[Dimsdale]

FYI: At my local WallyWorld (WalMart), the synthetic Rotella was clearance priced at $11.00/gal. This was last weekend. I have no idea how long the sale will be going on, but it seemed that they were making the winter/spring transition.

Had to snag four more gallons!

[morgan]

I bought my truck from the original owner with 158,000 miles and with Royal Purple / Longrider synethetic in the oil pan. I mail order RP from the producer (no local vendor in Upstate SC) and for 210,000 miles now. No problems. Love it.

[wfyehl]

I too run 5W-40 Rotella Synthetic, but only in the 96 Sub. I bought enough to use in the '94 Olds, but the Olds started burning oil and developed a couple of leaks. I switched the Olds back to Mobil One, and the leaks and burning oil went away. The Olds van has had Mobil One in it since 25K miles. I've run the Rotella Synth in the 96 Sub since I bought it (138K miles). The previous owner ran Mobil One in the Sub, but I cannot find the Mobil Delvac One. WalMart does have the truck SUV oil, but not in the convenient 5 quart containers. I might try the Delvac One the next oil change, but I do like the Rotella for the Sub.

Bill

[Marty Lau]

Originally posted by Lug:
I was going to run the synthetic rotella in my 95 but the owners manual says 15w 50 only. Any reason why GM chose to limit the oil.
Justin Justin;
My owner manual say to use 15W-40 or 30W in cold weather. I'm in Montana too and this the 3rd winter I have used the Rotella 5W-40 and have no problem. When our trucks came out there was very little Diesel rated synthetic oil. The shell oil exceeds standards for our engines so I don't worry about, plus my favorite Diesel Dr. (Dr Lee says it okay. I run the stuff year around and will do so unless I can't find it any more.

[ol9465er]

All....

I want to try synthetic oil and have been searching out oils but in my location the only one that is readily available is Mobil 1 15W-50, however, my manual calls for 15W-40.

Any comments on whether this would be good, ok or bad move....

ol9465er
94 Chev 6.5TD SOL-D, LWB, 4X4
284000 KM's (177500 Miles)

[DmaxMaverick]

ol9465er

That 15-50 is NOT rated for the use you need. You must have a C rated oil (the 15-50 is SJ rated--S=spark, C=compression). The latest rating is CI-4. You can use CG-4, CH-4 or CI-4 in your 6.5, but I recommend the latest rating for best performance.

The viscocity can be dependent on your ambient temps. 15-40 is recommended above freezing, and 0/5-40 is recommended below. 0/5/10-30 is not recommended for the 6.5.

If you use Mobil, make sure it is DELVAC, and check the API rating or compatiblility.

If you have a supplier that carries Mobil, they can probably order the Delvac 1 15-40 for you, or you can have it shipped to you from various suppliers. Shop around, starting with The Diesel Page advertisers. There are also other good synthetics available, like, Amsoil, Redline, etc.

[ol9465er]

DM...

Thanks for the post.

The Mobil 1 oil that I am looking at in Canadian Tire and Canadian Superstore is CF rated. Below are the ratings on the container:

Mobil 1 15W-50 meets or exceeds the following industry specifications: ACEA A3,B3,B4
API SL,SJ,CF

Comments?

Thanks
ol9465er

[Barry Nave]

If I were to change to Synthetic using the duel bypass, filters from JK,you know what filter he likes. I have a case of each. How long can I go before I can change oil in miles?

[DmaxMaverick]

Originally posted by ol9465er:
DM...

Thanks for the post.

The Mobil 1 oil that I am looking at in Canadian Tire and Canadian Superstore is CF rated. Below are the ratings on the container:

Mobil 1 15W-50 meets or exceeds the following industry specifications: ACEA A3,B3,B4
API SL,SJ,CF

Comments?

Thanks
ol9465er CF???

That's an old formulation. Like 1980, or something. I wouldn't use it, especially in a 6.5. 50 weight oil it too heavy, and NOT recommended by GM, or AMG. Was there a lot of dust on the bottles?

[Barry Nave]

Went to Wal Mart today but they only had case's of the Rotella T Heavy Duty.
So I'll give it a try @ $7.00 a Gal.
Had been using Mobil Delvac 1300 Super.
Good change or bad?

[DeezlStinson]

I too am running Shell Rotella syn. I have a 94 K2500 Suburban 6.5, a VW Jetta TDI and a John Deere F935(Yanmar diesel) mower. THey all get Shell 5W-40!

I have recently aquired a 1955 FORD F600 truck and when I get finished with the restoration (and 6.5L/ZF 6speed + GearVendors install!!) I'll run it on 5w-40 syn too!

If I couldn't get Shell Rotella 5w-40 I'd use Mobil 1 truck 4x4 (Delvac1 5w-40) oil also available at Walmart!

If I really had a diesel in my Stinson....I'd run it in the Stinson too! (Franklin engines like AeroShell 100 (50w) )


Cheers,

Rick