heath ecm & h2o injection ready to install

[matt-max]

any tips from those that have gone before?

plan is to get baseline info from g-tech then install turbo-master instead of boost controller and retest.

then change ecm and retest

then add h20/alcohol and retest

goal is to have all dialed in for dyno time in indy at end of month

matt

[Turbine Doc]

Matt,
I'm mid stride in my testing of Heath ECM & TM still crunching #'s, are you gauged, or intercooled. (dumb question I see you are adding WMI)

My truck seems to run best all round driveability with spring length at 1 7/8" . but I'm intercooled
shorter than 1 7/8" spring compression not much gain probably worse non IC.

Go into it cautiously start at 2.5" shorten spring as your gauges say it's safe to, you have any way to read IAT, too high a IAT and PCM starts cutting fuel plus you are working engine harder/hotter. (Answering my dumb question above your IAT with WMI should be low enough to
play some more) I did go to 1.5" but up there when on hard acceleration heavy boost drift, I suspect fuel clipping, PCM not happy with some parameter out of range.

Also playing with fitting to read backpressure, working turbo too hard against system head might also be causing some problems. JD data is coming it's been crappy weather over here.

[AndyL]

I am really interested in Bill's new ECM program, what do you think so far? How is the seat-of-the-pants feel? What boost are you running with those listed spring lengths?

[computer monkey]

Any updates or info to add?

[GARY PAGE]

I will have one next week and will take some pics of the install and publish the results in a couple of weeks. I don't see using it with no-load but when towing the camper 8600 LB up a grade I expect to see a reduction in EGT and sustained power. We shall see. PS I plan on mounting my tank under the bed.

[Barry Nave]

Matt
Your in Indaina as I. Wish I could show you H2O system I have been using now for over 3 years.
When you have the right pump,nozzle and add ALKY to this system look out ;)
There are a few of us guys,some have gotten band and others are still thinking Water!intercool?
I dont push the H2O any more though I know what works, Hey Bill H is doing it :D

[Turbine Doc]

I've been hanging out over at the VW TDI forums got a sick 2001 TDI NB finally got it figured out with help over there, just waiting on parts now.

Those that have a VW TDI the EGR system sux, carbon/coke gets 1/8" thick in the intake from CCV (similar to CDR on 6.5) venting, and can restrict anti-shudder valve from opening, engine can't run if closed, all air blocked off to engine. IC also had much oil in it to add to the gunk and no drain provisions.

Hey wrong forum. Check it out on http://www.tdiclub.com/ 1.9 A-4 TDI maint. Post engine starts but no run by Turbine Doc

Heath's reflash worth every penny, turbo master works as advertised. Bill Heath one fine guy to work with. Only testing thus far has been empty distance runs no tow tests yet much improved low end grunt over stock program I have data from Snap On scanner but don't know if I can post XCel sheet here.

[AndyL]

Originally posted by tbogemirep:
Heath's reflash worth every penny, turbo master works as advertised. Bill Heath one fine guy to work with. Only testing thus far has been empty distance runs no tow tests yet much improved low end grunt over stock program I have data from Snap On scanner but don't know if I can post XCel sheet here. Could you Email the Xcel to me?

longblock454@netscape.net

Thanks

Andy

[computer monkey]

Can you email it to me also please at computermonkey@valornet.com

Thank you

[TurboDiverArt]

Originally posted by computer monkey:
Can you email it to me also please at computermonkey@valornet.com

Thank you You could email it to me too but I wouldn't know what to do with it.... :)

Really just trying to TTT the thread To The Top for any additional information.

Anyone know if the 1998 and 1999 stock programs are the same? Wondering if the gains that people with a 1998 see would also be seen on a 1999. I know the 1999

[matt-max]

sorry for delay in replying. i slipped on ice outside my garage and rebroke my right elbow so have been unable to do as much as i would like.

currrently water injection is hooked up to the tahoe with 2001 3500hd L65 programming, -1.94 pump timing and turbo-master set to 13ish psi

have not towed with it, just zipped around on cold days, and it is a very light vehicle running programming for a medium duty truck, so can't tell much except that it seems to improve performance noticeably. have not tried alcohol yet. bill says towing is where the difference comes in, especially on hot days up hills

ran the heath programming for a half day without water injection until it set a code and performance fell to below 2001hd programming. bill felt the problem was the -1.94 timing not being 'understood' by the computer because they were not done together at the same time in the same vehicle

tahoe ran way quicker than stock (very briefly until the ses light came on) including spinning both rear 17" michelins on dry pavement for a good distance and hitting 70mph in a pretty short stretch of road. then the ses came on and it was all worse than stock from there

should have the reflashed ecm back and dyno'd again soon and will let you know how it goes

thanks
matt

[Turbine Doc]

Turbo D,

The 98 and 99 stock programs are different, more fuel delivery on my 99 junkyard PCM vs the 98 one it came with; so I make the assumption it is the HD program, that said the difference may also be L65 in the 99 vs. L56 in the 98 but I think I remember from an old thread the 99+ was the HD program.

[JoeyD]

Matt, How was the H2O install? I have the kit awaiting install. How was the install on the turbo housing?

[matt-max]

not positive as i didn't do it myself. my shop foreman did it and said it was well engineered and fairly easy but involved to install.

only complication was having to pull the upper intake for some reason...can't recall as the pain pills were wiping my memory clean pretty effectively at the time.

think it took a full day maybe a bit more

still waiting on the ecms to come back....
matt

[JoeyD]

Did you get it back yet? I just ordered mine and hope to see it shipped out at the end of next week.

[GARY PAGE]

I agree with your shop Forman it

[matt-max]

still waiting..............

definitely need to mount the pump in the engine bay as it is pretty damn noisy while on. found room on the driver's side front fender well next to where we have the fsd coolers on the other trucks. (tahoe still on stock pmd)

looking for a baffled vertical water tank as the metal horizontal tank takes up way too much room in the hatch, esp with the spare back there too

let you know when i know more......good thing i'm patient....

matt

[G. Gearloose]

tbogemirep,

Are running the Heath ecm, vacuum wastegate, and JK's boost controller at the same time? If so, any thoughts on that combination you can share?
thanks

[Cowracer]

I know its listed as a fuel tank, but check out this.

http://cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jhtml?id=0001124&navAction=push&navCount=2&indexId=cat420004&parentId=cat420004&parentType=index&rid=&_DARGS=%2Fcabelas%2 Fen%2Fcommon%2Fcatalog%2Fpod-link.jhtml_A&_DAV=MainCatcat21276 (http://cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jhtml?id=0001124&navAction=push&navCount=2&indexId=cat420004&parentId=cat420004&parentType=index&rid=&_DARGS=%2Fcabelas%2Fen%2Fcommon%2Fcatalog%2Fpod-link.jhtml_A&_DAV=MainCatcat21276)

I am thinking about the 600 series 18 callon tank. it even comes with a sending unit!

Tim

[Marty Lau]

Tim;

I was think along the same lines :cool:
It would be nice to be able to gage it so you know when to fill and 18 gallons ought to last awhile, I'm not shure how many gallons/hour the thing pumps if your go contious, but I'm got a 26 gallon fuel tank, I wouldn't think that you would run out of water before fuel.
and if you only use it on grades PIECE OF CAKE.

Another option might be the 800 which is 18 gallons also but 6"Wx14.5hx58"L that could be mounted along the front bed bulkhead and only take up 6 inches. Kewl couple options there.

[ 03-25-2004, 10:11 AM: Message edited by: 16ga SxS ]

[matt-max]

sorry been out of town with no internet for the last 10 days

yes, that 'fuel' tank looks great. especially if i can get it mounted in the back of the tahoe and still get it filled and have room to stuff whatever else i need back there

have not run any of our 6.5s with the electronic boost control and the mechanical boost-master, always one or the other

and still waiting on the computers.......

matt

[Turbine Doc]

Gearloose,

Still gathering data, I made a small tow this past weekend 3-28-04, 1500lb trailer pull I ran it 2 ways Heath PCM, Turbo Master & JK boost control set to a 78 kPa baro setting, also made same run without JK Boost control, if the theoretical torque calculated by my Snap-On scanner is valid, I made more torque with Turbo Master and no JK control, baro reading using no modded (JK Ctrl) MAP sensor input was 103kPa.

But since the JK is really set up for vac control I'll need to swap back to the vac system to judge which is better set up. Going out of town for work tomorrow; so it will be at least another week before I can do more experimenting.

I'm getting some pretty good data files from my scanner snapshots; I'm working with Bill Heath just to make sure it's good data before posting what configuration I wind up with, with the JK control and GM 99 L65 PCM I was able to hit boost in excess of 15 psi.

Max so far I've gotten with TM has been 13psi, I don't know how much more spring compression is possible before damaging the spring, current compressed length is 1.5", as spring is compressed boost goes up.

I'm intercooled and with the scanner am fully instrumented and running a test; any readers out there don't try experiments on your own without full knowledge of what the results are of your adjustments, and be judicious with what you are doing. I have not run the Heath reflash with vacuum control yet, when I do I'll post results.

[Turbine Doc]

On the fuel tank I was going to build one similar out of Aluminum or Stainless, with a baffle on the the bottom to slope fuel to the fill side of the truck and a simple line and valve plumbed to the fill neck and at about 1/4 tank on my fuel gauge open the valve and let gravity do it's thing. If I needed the extra bed space it would be small enough to take out if needed.

[G. Gearloose]

Thanks for sharing, tbogemirep!
Look forward to hearing more.

[GARY PAGE]

Here are a few more pictures of the switches and 16 gallon tank mounted in the tool box. The system is working and I will get some results on my April camping trip hauling the RV. Had more pictures; but lost them, will re-take... So far so good. System was calibrated for flow and 12PSI cutin. I feel that some hystresis may be needed in the control system and I did put a 35uF cap across the relay to stop chatter, works fine, chater stopped. Need more time to document job is keeping me busy as it should@#$%


http://home.comcast.net/~garsu/switches.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~garsu/tank1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~garsu/tank2.jpg

[rj]

Gary, I'm pretty slow on the electrical end of things - know just enough to get myself in trouble - what electric component did you install to stop the chatter on the pump relay and where? Thanks.

[Marty Lau]

Gary nice set up give us the full report when you get back. I talked with Bill Heath today and he said that one of his customers add the water injections sytem and took off the Intercooler he had and won't go back. The Fella also said he did a Dyno test with & with out the water and claims he got like 38 h/p at the wheels increase from the water. Plus lower IAT and EGT. I going to go this route I still looking at a way to mount a tank under the truck I don't want to take up bed space if I can help it. I have short box and use it .

[Cowracer]

Gary,

Could you give the particulars on the pump you use? P/N GPM and PSI is what I am most interested in.

[GARY PAGE]

That is the Bill heath pump mounted on a 16 gallon sprayer tank, exact mounting system, that should tell you something. Tractor supply tank. The pump is rated at 2.1 GPM@30 PSI, 3.5 amp draw, FlowJet Model 2100. The capacitor was attached across the coil of the relay to stop the chatter. Some would tell you the cap may cause high contact currents in the switches which pull in the coil, true they are; but it's for milli second stuff and ESR on the cap ain't 0 ohms for sure...any who it don't rattle no mo! I don't know about the 38HP stuff it's allways over rated to excite the reader. This is just for real hard pulls in my application with the RV which loaded is close to 9000 LB and to keep the EGT down while pouring the fuel to her, we shall see. I like cruse control.

[matt-max]

well, i am a paitent person but my patience has reached its end. i cancelled the orders for the ecms through heath diesel and have ordered from a different source instead. went straight to the source actually.

should be here shortly and i wil post results then.

matt

[JoeyD]

matt, e-mail me the info if you don't mind.
jdecampo@rcn.com

[matt-max]

ok joey

email headed your way

matt

[jspringator]

For Suburban owners who use water injection for towing only, it occurred to me to mount the water tank on a front mounted hitch cargo carrier with lp gas quick release hoses. In fact, why couldn't you use the front hitch with a bike carrier, and somehow use a fuel or water bladder attached mount or the bikes for the water supply? I am starting to like this idea!

[Spindrift]

I know an Excursion owner who mounted his tank along the frame rail.