RV ruminations.

[DickWells]

Like I've mentioned, elsewhere, the Seneca is fairly lux, but. --- Though it has some pretty classy stuff, like a huge microwave/convection oven over the stove, and a piano hinged toilet door, with 11 SS screws on each side, making it the most solid door I've ever seen in an RV, that doesn't mean that poopieness can't occur. Like the micro wave falling down onto the counter on our maiden voyage! Or, like both pocket doors that separate the lav/shower room from the bedroom and the kitchen coming loose, waaay back in the pockets!

Just dealt with the pocket door issue; the microwave having long-since been fixed. The pocket doors turned out to be accessible from inside the toilet, but it meant removing the cabinet over the flush, and cutting out two layers of wall behind it to do the BR side door, and cutting a section out of the wall on the kitchen side of the toilet wall. Wonder that the door track didn't fatigue and fracture inside the pocket on both doors. Got lots of experience, now, running a Ryobi 18V up-side-down.

As with most RV's that I've had any kind of experience in, the Seneca is a wiring nightmare. Little rhyme, nor reason to it, and no kind of diagrams to help yuh. So far, I've by-passed the original main slide switch and doped out the wiring and used a momentary two-way toggle switch. I've given up on the outside radio, which I wouldn't use, anyway. It looks like the Jayco factory used a whole lot of suitcase connectors under the kick-panels in the cab, and under the switch plates for the interior lights by the front coach door. The main awning control is wired the same way, in that same mess. Don't know about you, but I hate suitcase connectors.

Suppose I should consider myself lucky that I didn't burn the whole she-bang to a crisp within the first 2 weeks that we had it. Hadn't bought the Wells Cargo trailer for the Miata, yet, and was using a soft car cover. Went away, one day, and wadded up the cover and shoved it into the smallest basement cubby for the day. Came home and went to get the Miata cover. Smelled smoke and opened the door to find it billowing out the opening. Yanked the cover out and found a smoldering gap that proved to fit right over the driver's side windshield. Stamped out the glow and went back and checked the bin. The side-mounted 12V light fixture had a melted lens, and the bulb had blown when the plastic melted to it, but, apparently still glowed for a while. I disabled that fixture, and resolved to never stuff something into any of the bins. There's a light fixture in each of all 9 storage bins, plus one under the water-works/waste door. The switches are rockers, and easily turned on. The bulbs will get real hot if used too long, especially if you stuff a lot of insulation around them, like I did.:o Changing to all LED's when I can.

The Seneca is proof that one has to plan on just as much attention to up-keep as you would a permanent dwelling. God help you if you don't have some tools and skills, if you're gonna do any RV'in.

[Robyn]

Sorry to hear of the mess.

Having done a bus conversion and been around a few factory high end bus builds I can tell ya that anything less than the high end stuff can be a nightmare as far as wiring goes.

Hope ya get it all figured out....

[DickWells]

Not a great problem, really, Robyn. Just a matter of doping out 1 lead at a time as each issue occurs. Something like tracing any trailer wiring problem that all of us who have had to do with any trailer with lights. Huh; never will forget the U-Haul 2 wheel car dolly that I rented in Fa, many years back.The tech who checked me out insisted thst no ground wire was needed! No? Guess who had to buy a piece of wire and hard- wire my Blazer to the thing to get any lights for the trip to Vt? I still meet people who believe that a trailer ball will furnish a consistent ground.
Reminds me of a little issue that my son and I had at home for a few years, back when he kept a few geese. Think a goose won't hurt your a$$ with it's beak? Dang birds'll strip wire faster than I can with the best tool I've ever owned!
I'll bet you diagramed your wiring on that bus as you went forward with the project? So far, all I've ever seen with our rv's, will be manuals for each appliance, but nothing from the appliance to/from the source.

[cowboywildbill]

Trailer lights have problems ? LOL. I tell the wife that the RV is our home when we're in it.
So that means, if she does the house work then she fixes it. That would include changing flat tires !
You know I'm kidding.
I've bought brand new high end trailers and had to fix wiring problems on the first trip.
One time was an intermittent bad ground. What a fun thing to trace. I had to run a new ground wire almost the length of the trailer. Couldn't get to the spot where it was faulty.
So just ran the whole thing from the converter to the switches.
Then one time in our brand new 48 foot living quarter horse trailer while on our first trip we made it five miles from our ranch and the now full 100 gallon fresh water tank fell down from under the front of the trailer onto the road.
The factory only had 3 of the screws make it into the frame from the strapping holding the tank. They used self tapping screws. What a fun day that was.
Yep if you're going to go RV ing you better have tools and skills.
Happy New Year to everyone.

[DmaxMaverick]

Yep!
Those who RV complain a LOT less about their automotive electrical problems. As bad as they are (all brands), they don't hold a candle to any brand of RV. If you're fortunate enough to find the wiring diagram, good luck actually making sense of it, or matching it to reality most of the time. At the very least, you'll expand your 4-letter vocabulary.

[cowboywildbill]

When we had the Mercedes, I had to learn German cuss words !

[DickWells]

Bill. I don't know much about German, concerning car language, but I just remembered a funny little thing I learned from owning SAABs. The start position on the ignition was called FART! Just naturally came to mind, after reading yous and DM's posts.
I think the Mennonites who wire RV's just string wire without regard to any stsndard of uniformity, even among units of a particular model. I know I've found fuses and breakers mis-marked on the panel covers of brand new trailers.
Found out early- on, that most new trailers hit the road needing alignment. Toe, caster, and camber have all been off on several trailers that Ive been involved with. My little Wells Cargo 18 ft.trailer that carries the Miato has been a welcome exception. Tracks great and hasn't shown any undue tire wear and it's always loaded to just about max.

[Yukon6.2]

I bought a 1970 MCI bus that has been converted.Po's spent a small fortune on this bus and i picked it up for a song.:D
I have found a couple of bits of wiring diagrams,and was dreading trying to decipher the wiring. I guess that had i bought a newer fancy factory RV i would not be any better off.:confused:
This ole girl is going to be my spring project if time allows.I am hoping to get it functional and cleaned up enough to park it somewhere for the summer and rent it out as summer accommodations till i am free enough to road trip.

[DickWells]

Betcha gonna love your new RV. No better feeling than something you've put a bit of youself into.
Been using my phone for all my posting lately, and have to apologize for the many typos. Note the Miato in my previous post. :( Usually it's a's and s's, but it seems like anything can happen. I'm bad enough on the laptop, but just plane awful on the phone, with my farmer's fingers.

[arveetek]

I've been in the RV business going on 24 years now (parts & service). Do you know what RV stands for? Ruined Vacation

:D




I have found a couple of bits of wiring diagrams,and was dreading trying to decipher the wiring. I guess that had i bought a newer fancy factory RV i would not be any better off.:confused:

There are very, very few RV manufacturers who actually produce a wiring diagram, plumbing schematic, etc. Winnebago and Airstream are two who seem to know what they are doing. Almost every other RV builder simply assembles their rigs from components they got the best deal on that day. It is not uncommon for an RV to be less than a year old, and already have parts that are no longer available, since most RV builders don't actually build anything in their factories; they simply assemble them from parts supplied by other vendors. Those vendors come and go, and there might be running changes on the assembly line, and then the OEM doesn't log that change anywhere, and it's anyone's best guess what part they actually used on that rig.

I had a customer come into our Keystone and Forest River dealership asking for a plumbing schematic for his 10 year old coach. He got rather upset because he assumed I was lying to him that we didn't have access to anything like that. He assumed that as a dealer, we should have that kind of information. I sure wish we did! Keystone is getting much, much better, using color coded wiring and such, but that only applies to recently built units.

Oftentimes when I need to order a part, I have to take a picture of the item and then email the OEM and say, "Send me this!" Then I cross my fingers, since there is a 50/50 chance they will still send me the wrong item after waiting 4 - 6 weeks.

If you want a specific non-appliance part for an RV built more than 10 to 15 years ago.... good luck. It's either unavailable, or the OEM didn't have computer systems keeping track of what they built! Or that OEM has been purchased by another company, and all records were lost. Can you imagine walking into a Chevy dealership and asking for a widget for your 2009 2500HD, only to be told it's been discontinued and is no longer available?

I still love the RV lifestyle, but the industry as a whole has a got a LONG way to go to keep up with consumer demands and expectations. It's gotten so bad, I'm really contemplating getting out of the industry altogether, since every day leads to a new frustration.

Casey

[Bigshankhank]

I don't like to resurrect dead threads but this one made me chuckle as I am restoring a 1984 Champion Rv with a 6.2 in it. I did manage to find the wiring diagram, which was literally drawn by hand. I did manage to scan it and add colors to all of the lines in an effort to make it easier to use, but yeah when I stumbled upon it in the bundle of paperwork the PO gave me with the van I almost burst out laughing.

[DieselDavy]

My daughter's in-laws own a business that create wiring harnesses for high end motor homes. She works in the engineering dept. They send a separate thumb drive containing the schematic for each wiring harness shipped. Allegedly, the thumb drive goes with the finished product. She says they used to send paper schematics.

[cowboywildbill]

I've been in the RV business going on 24 years now (parts & service). Do you know what RV stands for? Ruined Vacation

:D




There are very, very few RV manufacturers who actually produce a wiring diagram, plumbing schematic, etc. Winnebago and Airstream are two who seem to know what they are doing. Almost every other RV builder simply assembles their rigs from components they got the best deal on that day. It is not uncommon for an RV to be less than a year old, and already have parts that are no longer available, since most RV builders don't actually build anything in their factories; they simply assemble them from parts supplied by other vendors. Those vendors come and go, and there might be running changes on the assembly line, and then the OEM doesn't log that change anywhere, and it's anyone's best guess what part they actually used on that rig.

I had a customer come into our Keystone and Forest River dealership asking for a plumbing schematic for his 10 year old coach. He got rather upset because he assumed I was lying to him that we didn't have access to anything like that. He assumed that as a dealer, we should have that kind of information. I sure wish we did! Keystone is getting much, much better, using color coded wiring and such, but that only applies to recently built units.

Oftentimes when I need to order a part, I have to take a picture of the item and then email the OEM and say, "Send me this!" Then I cross my fingers, since there is a 50/50 chance they will still send me the wrong item after waiting 4 - 6 weeks.

If you want a specific non-appliance part for an RV built more than 10 to 15 years ago.... good luck. It's either unavailable, or the OEM didn't have computer systems keeping track of what they built! Or that OEM has been purchased by another company, and all records were lost. Can you imagine walking into a Chevy dealership and asking for a widget for your 2009 2500HD, only to be told it's been discontinued and is no longer available?

I still love the RV lifestyle, but the industry as a whole has a got a LONG way to go to keep up with consumer demands and expectations. It's gotten so bad, I'm really contemplating getting out of the industry altogether, since every day leads to a new frustration.

Casey
Amen! I worked for an RV dealer part time for about 4 years. Doing repairs you name it wiring hitches etc.
And also pulled new units from the Fleet wood Manufacturing plant in Winchester,VA back to the dealer.
Watching the trailers being put together is an experience. Workmanship was lacking in my opinion. Just seemed like putting out as many units in a certain time frame was all that mattered, miss some screws "NO big deal". LOL In my opinion they ain't built with care like I would if it was mine, "Just saying"
As for wiring, you are spot on. I have had two or three of my own trailers that had gremlins in the electrical system especially in the 12 volt system which is most of the wiring. Things like intermittent grounds and such, things that drive you crazy trying to figure out. And not to mention that most of the wiring is put into the panels and walls before they are attached, making it fun to snake a new wire later.