broken starter bolts/cracked mount

[GSE2SCHMIDT]

My wife called me from Arby's. Said that truck would not start and was just making a wierd noise.

She said that it started doing it a little the day before but did not want me to worry.

So I look underneath and a starter bolt is missing.

So looking for the quick fix I check to see if the outboard bolt is tight.....I turn it and snap!

After I get the truck flatbedded home I look and find out that the other "inboard" starter bolt is broken up inside just like the outboard I tried to tighten up

I was able to get the first "inboard" hunk of bolt out with a reverse drill bit

The outboard was a different story, broke 2 taps off and finally got it out, but the slug must have been bent and the threads were chewed up from the removal process.

I got a helicoil(name brand)got my drillbit out and had some fun. Unfortunately the tap they give is not a bottoming tap.

After much driving around and only able to get a bottoming tap for a 10mm 1.25 pitch not the 10mm 1.5 pitch that the starter has. I would have gone to a 1.25 bolt but was unable to locate one longer than 75mm.(Keep in mind these taps are an off size for the acual helicoil, not the bolt).

I put my standard tap in my vice and smaked it with a hammer. Luckily it broke off pretty evenly and I was able to sand it down by hand at the kitchen table after an hour and about 10 pieces of medium grit sandpaper. I tapered the flutes of the tap so it would gradually go to full thread after a turn and a half.

I had already started my threads and marked the depth of my bit with tape so I didn't bottom out.

When I was cutting my last half thread.....damn I always have to give it that last little bit....I noticed a crack on both sides of the bolt hole running from front to back.

When I pulled the tap out the crack closed back up....but the damage is done.

Everything is back together for now till I find a true fix.

What is the best way to have this fixed?

Even if I take the engine out and have the block worked on I would have to pull the internals out of the engine.....correct?

The engine has 190K If I pull it apart it will just need a rebuild anyway, don't really want to go the replacement route either.

If the cracked piece should fall off I could just PC7 or some other majic block fix stuff.

I don't think the outer bolt takes as much abuse as the inner bolt so maybe the stress won't finish it off.

Anybody out there have a problem like this?

What should I do?

[azblazor]

I would ask a mobile welder to lay a bead on it. Some guys can weld cast iron blocks (some pre-heat). Worst case would be that it might not hold. I do believe that some engine rebuilders weld broken blocks at the starter bolts.

[JohnC]

The starter bolts are "special" and I'd be leary of replacing them with a different part.

Do you have the bracket on the back of the starter? Most broken starter bolts are on starters without the bracket...

[Dvldog 8793]

Howdy
Support bracket! Make sure it is tight and in place.
Starter bolts, Make sure they are TORQUED I dont remember the value(65lbs is in my head but look it up)
Crack, If you have the time get it welded. I have welded blocks in place(both Aluminum and iron) The iron in the 6.5 is pretty good stuff and welds really nice. If you wait for chunk to break out, then you will be in trouble as you'll have to build up a new boss and redrill. If you could see the crack moving under install I would bet yopu are far from breaking it out. ESPECIALLY under the load and vibration these starters live in. Find a GOOD welder that knows how to TIG weld cast and isn't affraid to do it in place. DO NOT USE any super wonder holds-everything weld-in-a-tube epoxy stuff! This stuff will get into the pores of the cast and make almost impossible to get a nice clean strong weld. It's hard enough to get all the oil out without having to worry about that other "stuff"
Hope this helps!
L8r
Agree on the trying different bolts. Make sure that the welder you have do the work is experienced with welding cast and PREHEAT/POST heating it properly. If you dont it is very likely to make the crack worse.

[GSE2SCHMIDT]

The bracket bolt was loose, I got a new bolt and it is tight now. Hard to believe that a 8mm bolt makes the difference....but it must.

I agree with the starter bolts being special stuff. I wish there was other options.

It seems the inboard bolt takes the brunt of the load, maybe why it broke. I torqued it to 40 foot pounds....65 is the way to go...im scared. Should I use lock tight(red or blue)?

I hope I can find someone out there willing to weld these things in place, it seems hard enough to get a starter on let alone weld on. The crack seems to start at the bottom.

Should I just get someone to weld the machined surface and then grind it smooth or go for the sides. If I go for the sides I will need to remove paint and degrease. If I go from the bottom I might get lucky with a little brake parts cleaner up into the hole and cracks.

I have been contemplating removing the engine and going over it. I noticed a freeze plug weeping. Turbo drain lines leaking

It's a little scary the engine has almost 190k and still has original harmonic balancer, injectors, glow plugs, water pump, timing chain.....and might have had possible injection pump work at 80k(green tag pump) but that might be original too.

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

[i]

[Dvldog 8793]

Howdy
I doubt that going over the face of the crack and then grinding it will help much. I am welder ny trade(among other things) and I think a good welder with a small tig torch should be able to get in there and weld it for you. Welding it would be the easy part, cleaning before the welding would be the hard part. If you have been thinking of checking out the motor and replacing some of the things you listed then by all means pull her out! It really isn't that hard and many other things can be done while it's out. When I replaced my engine I think I spent 3x the hours doing other STUFF that needed to be done.
Good luck!
L8r
Conley Janssen