Banks turbo bearing noise? [Archive] - TheDieselPage.com Forums

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 15:05

I have a 1986 M1031-K30, 6.2, Banks turbo and 700R4 conversion. When my turbo starts to make boost, usually in 3rd gear, at moderate throttle I hear a nasty screaming noise that sounds like bearing failure. It drops off and dissapears when the trans hits 4th gear and the boost pressure falls.

At first, I thought the belts needed to be tightend as these trucks have two alternators, and maintaining belt tension has always been an issue. I tightend the belts, but it did not resolve the problem. Could this sound indicate a bearing problem? Would I need to check the end play with a dial indicator or can I detect it by hand?

As I said, it sounds like a bearing to me, but it might be the turbine making contact with the housing, making a metalic chafing noise. If that's the case, I would assume the bearings are failing and causing the turbine shaft to move. Any input would be helpfull. Thanks, Wayne.

mrwilecoyote

01-12-2013, 15:58

DO NOT DRIVE IT !!.
Pull the turbo and inspect. There is no intercooler so if that turbo handgrenades , All the shratnel is going into your motor.

sctrailrider

01-12-2013, 17:08

You better at least take the rubber boot at the turbo off and see if there is any play in the blade/shaft, I bet that your blades are touching the housing meaning the bearings are gone... IF that is the case, both blades should be replaced and balanced...

Like said, do not crank it again until you check that... if no play, you might take the belt off and see if you hear anything while it's off...

let us know what you find..

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 17:13

Thanks mrwilecoyote, I'll take the intake pipe off and see whats going on in there. I searched for Banks rebuild kits. No luck. I'd hate to get a used turbo from flea bay an end up getting one in the same condition or worse than mine.

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 17:25

Yup, i'll do that tomorrow, The turbo is only a few years old and not really a lot of miles on it. I may be miss diagnosing the sound, good idea with taking the belt off. I do not hear the noise through the straight pipe stack though, but the boost pressure has been inconsistant. Thanks, Wayne.

mrwilecoyote

01-12-2013, 17:31

who says it has to be a Banks turbo. I am not familiar with Banks Sidewinder but AFAIK it's T3 flange so you may be able to put an HX40ii knockoff on it if it physically fits and you can do a little fab work. Heck a GMx turbo might even fit. I'd atleast look into that. I don't think the Banks turbos were all that great anyway. Or maybe a real HX35. Not sure.

sctrailrider

01-12-2013, 17:32

No need to resort to fleebay, get what ya need from Banks, if blades are needed, and if they did touch the housing AT ALL you will need them, they can balance them for you .

mrwilecoyote

01-12-2013, 17:35

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 18:08

No need to resort to fleebay, get what ya need from Banks, if blades are needed, and if they did touch the housing AT ALL you will need them, they can balance them for you .
Thanks Chris, What a PITA! It will take forever for them to receve it, fix it, and send it back to me. I guess that's my only option. Again, thanks for the info.

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 18:25

If it's not the turbo, yes CUCV's are notorious for belt problems. The proper thickness belt is no longer made(Gates 8 series) and the 7's IMHO burn up. Also CUCV's don't have a torsional damper although I never bought into that being the cure. I had plenty of 6.2 with Belt squeal that had the torsional pulley. Gates made a 5725 Hi Perf belt that worked better but it was for Civvy models. I converted mine to 12v and serpt belt. Best thing I ever did but you'll get a ribbin' over at Steel Soldiers for it...
A ribbing is an understatement, LOL. I have considered the Roscommon conversion as I have by-passed the GP controller and resistor. Even if i did the roscommon conversion, I would not admit it over at Steel Soldiers. It may be #2 alt bearing as I have to tighten the belts to almost guitar string tension. Thank you, Wayne.

mrwilecoyote

01-12-2013, 20:23

Look into other turbos too. There are way better turbos out there, just not sure about clearence .

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 21:00

Look into other turbos too. There are way better turbos out there, just not sure about clearence .
You read my mind, I believe I would have to change everything to do that, and I like the 3in single exhast I have with the Banks setup. If the cost of the repair is equal to or more than what I can get a 6.5 setup for, i'll go with the 6.5. they are more common and readily available.

I really don't like where the Banks is mounted as it is tucked in close and lower to the head than the 6.5 setup. Along with the gigantic military battery in the rear, it makes nearly impossible to get to the injectors, glow plugs, or the fuel pump. Im sure I could fab up some kind of flange to retrofit another turbo to the exhast manifold, but if I don't have one in front of me, it would be difficult to choose which one to use. Any thoughts?

mrwilecoyote

01-12-2013, 21:51

I'd try a Holset hx35 if you can get your hands on one to try. I am not sure how tight it is with the way the banks mounts. When I used the 6.5TD setup I had to move my rear batt to drivers side.
I should really redo my CUCV thread over here. It had alot of good info.

wpdozer

01-12-2013, 23:16

Hea, that's great info. I did a search and found T3-T4 adapter flanges so I won't have to mess with the exhast manifold or cross over pipe. I hope the turbo is OK, but I think it may be done. I'll evaluate it tomorrow. I didn't install the turbo, the PO did and I don't think he did anything with the pistons. If I go with another turbo, i'll have to watch the boost. Now, on to your M1008 build thread.:)

mrwilecoyote

01-13-2013, 07:44

I would not worry about the pistons. The amount of boost isn't the issue, the egt's are. I run 15 lbs of boost on mine with a GM4 and I never see over 1,000f egt . The HG's are more of an issue. The factory 6.2 HG's were crap to begin with. Printoseals. I changed mine to 6.5 HG's with better fire rings and used ARP's but that will be detailed in my build I'm working on.

wpdozer

01-13-2013, 10:47

I don't know if the PO did the ARP head stud upgrade or not, and that has always been a concern. As you know, the 6.2 has a higher comp ratio than the 6.5 turbo motor. You know where I live, hilly terrain and some long steep grades. I keep my eye on the pyro, but I seldom get any more than 900 deg f, well below meltdown, and 450-600f crusing on straight level road. I saw a few holset hx35 for sale on line this morning at reasonable prices. Oh well, im going outside to do an oil and fuel service on the beast and check on the turbo. Kind of a crappy day to work on the truck, but I gotta get it done.:)

wpdozer

01-13-2013, 22:28

Well I checked out the turbo before doing the engine oil and fuel PM. There is no movement in the shaft and it spins fine. I also visually checked it with a mirror to see if there is any contact with the housing, none. Im stumped, unless the exhast side is somehow making contact. I'll park it untill I can remove the turbo and inspect the back side.

DmaxMaverick

01-14-2013, 06:16

A loose hose coupling is the usual suspect. It usually occurs during a specific peak boost/volume event, like just before a high-load shift. It could also be on the pressurized exhaust side.

wpdozer

01-14-2013, 14:30

Thanks Dmax, yup usually in 3rd gear going uphill. It won't do it unless it's under load. There's barely any boost, mabey 4psi. I could never get any more than 7 out of it since i've had it. Thank you sir for the great info. Wayne.

mrwilecoyote

01-14-2013, 16:40

You can tell if it has ARP's very easily. Some of the headbolts are exposed.Look at mine. That is what they look like.

wpdozer

01-14-2013, 18:43

I have a slight leak on the right valve cover, the turbo side course. Guess it's a good excuse to check on the ARP head studs. Thanks mrwile!

DmaxMaverick

01-14-2013, 19:08

You don't need to pull the valve cover to see. There is a whole row of head bolts outside the cover, above the exhaust manifold.

wpdozer

01-14-2013, 19:48

Duh! I should have picked up on that. Boy, thats :o!

wpdozer

02-13-2013, 22:47

I found the cause of the turbo noise. One of the two rubber caps on the intake manifold just under the pressure cap was dry rotted. I saw some cracking and figured i'd give it a tug.

It came right off with little effort. I removed the one on the other side the same way and used some 5/8 heater hose to connect the two ports untill I find suitable caps. No more noise and a full ten pounds of boost now.

sctrailrider

02-14-2013, 05:24

always good to save money, rubber is cheaper than a turbo.. :D

wpdozer

02-14-2013, 17:13

Thanks Chris, It looks pretty bubbafied to the trained eye. Anyone else might think it's some kind of trick piping, but it works for now. McMaster Carr might have something similar to the origanal caps. Hopefully not made in taiwan like these were. LOL.:eek:

DmaxMaverick

02-14-2013, 19:48

I'd leave the hose where it is. Print a label, "Type R -- Double Reverse Vacuum Pressure Booster -- +50 Horsepower". Stick it on the hose. I've seen these before (might have been on one of mine, maybe). They're good for about 10 additional MPG's, too, in case someone asks.