OH CR*P!! quit and no start.

[phantom309]

i drove my faithful? 94 k2500 ext cab 4x4 from toronto to whitecourt alberta,
driving a logtruck for the winter log haul,.
truck ran fine 20+mpg but the SS diesel return lines gave out real crappy hoses,.
right behind the turbo of course,.(aaargh)
it started to not start like it hadair in the system,. then it was idling and it shut off, never to start again,.well like a well trained 6.5'er i sent formy new aftermarket black box,. and presto? it still won't go,.
So how does determine it is the injection pump before i tear it off,.??
No codes,..all fuses good, lift pump pumps,. checked at the tap with a hot wire.
this could be the death knell for the old girl,.(and i just did all big new battery cables and grounds,. (aaaargh)
Nick

[rameye]

Are you getting positive fuel to pump???

It crapped out...you changes lines...it started and ran normally??? on edit I see it never re-started

Fuel shut off solenoid can sneak in there once in a while...its clickng good??

Check and clean all grounds otherwise...start at the basics...verify fuel delivery....work out from there.

Check all those new cables and connections you made up....

Check on air in the system...itsa dickens!!

[phantom309]

fuelsolenoid i removed and tested its good,.the battery cables are all fine,. even if it had air it,d bleed out,. i put head gaskets on the other truck, and i,ve run this one of fuel twice,. i know if i hot wire the fuel pump open the filter, etc she;ll wind over then fire,. this time its winding like crazy but no fire,.it wasidling fine, buti did noticeit stutter as i revved it up,. sort of like a bad accelerator pump ona carb,..

Nick

[convert2diesel]

fuelsolenoid i removed and tested its good,.the battery cables are all fine,. even if it had air it,d bleed out,. i put head gaskets on the other truck, and i,ve run this one of fuel twice,. i know if i hot wire the fuel pump open the filter, etc she;ll wind over then fire,. this time its winding like crazy but no fire,.it wasidling fine, buti did noticeit stutter as i revved it up,. sort of like a bad accelerator pump ona carb,..

Nick
Nick:

Have you got a remote PMD? Friends 99 went the same way. Pulled whats left of my hair out trying to diagnose it. Turned out to be a bad extension cable. Don't know where he got it from but replaced it with one of John Kennedy's and the thing fired right up. Some forensics turned up an intermittent terminal connection.

Good thing as the next thing that was coming off the truck was the pump. Saved the guy over 400 bucks. He's happy and I retained my "diesel guru" status :D.

Bill

[phantom309]

continuity on the cable(s) are good,. 1 blackbox is the grey one it,s brand new with corresponding cable,.
no codes at all,well the 12,..

so intake is off,. pulled fuel feed to pump, hot wired lift pump,. it,s pumping fuel great,
turbo is off,. fuel lines are all loose,.just awaiting parts,. the 5068 pump and the computer to run it,.and i need to hunt down 1 bosch duraterm as i pulled all 8 glows to make sure, and pulled the damn end off one,.aaargh.
what goes wrong in the IP when they quit? and do they quit with no codes??
I have a parts truck back home it,s a 93, with a mechanical pump,.but there's no one there to get it off,.this driveby wire is sure aggravating,.

Nick

[phantom309]

I realise you,ve all been anxiously waiting for an update,. and i know some of you have been losing sleep over this and i,m sorry,. BUT,..
TAA DAAAAH!!

the 5068 pump is on and she cranked about 5-6 revs and fired off perfectly!
So,.i was right!
All i did was hot wire the fuel pump,.crack the tee line and run the fuel into a plastic bottle till it stopped pumping foam,. shut the "T" and voila!
The pump looked original,. didn't have a green tag, and you know how things are when they are "factory"? every little wire clip, plastic doodads and paper tags etc,. all in place,. so it went 386,874kms,(gotta confess tho i took the noise filter out,.)
Bless the old things heart it died here in alberta,. and not somewhere in bumhug northern minnesota,.
Man what a difference in starting,. it cracks off really nice,.no smoke,.(it helps when you solder the broken glow plug wire on the pass side front cylinder,..
I,m back in love with the old rat,.
I haven't had a chance to drive it yet,. and i,m interested to see how the computer fuels the bigger pump,.

Nick
any clever idea's how to get the short 9/16ths socket out of the exhaust?
dropped straight down the head pipe when the turbo was off,. so i stuffed a rag in there after the fact,. DOH!!

[DmaxMaverick]

It's always nice when things improve. A good solid start is always a load off.

For the socket, use a magnet on a stick. If it's around bends (probably, by the sound of it), duct tape a magnet (redneck technique, tape all around it) to an old mower throttle wire shell or some other flexible, but firm extension (any cable shell, like from an E-brake or motorcycle, depending on how far you have to go). The dollar store near me (and maybe Walmart) sells a "mini-snake" for clearing sink drains, which would be ideal. Twist it as it goes in and out. The tape around the magnet will keep it from sticking to the pipe, with still enough magnetism to grab the socket. It works for lost/missing nuts and bolts too, but not something I would ever have to resort to.

[JohnC]

The original '94 HD injection pump (I think it was the 5068, but that's from memory) uses different programming from the LD pump and all the later replacements. If you didn't have the HD pump then you don't have the correct programming either. Not sure how it will all play together. I know (at least I think I know) that if the pump was replaced with a later one the programming had to be changed or driveability was poor. Not sure about going the other way, though...

[phantom309]

The original '94 HD injection pump (I think it was the 5068, but that's from memory) uses different programming from the LD pump and all the later replacements. If you didn't have the HD pump then you don't have the correct programming either. Not sure how it will all play together. I know (at least I think I know) that if the pump was replaced with a later one the programming had to be changed or driveability was poor. Not sure about going the other way, though...

haven't drove it yet,. the damn slip fitting for heater hose is leaking, so it,s coming out and a barb fitting going in,.
seems to be happy enough starting (big difference ) i did get the ecm shipped from the other truck to run the 5068 if there's a problem,.but it,s got a big chip in it,. and i,m not enthusiastic enough to change out the head bolts for the studs yet,..so i,m really hoping the stock 5521 programming will suffice,.

nick

[DmaxMaverick]

If you don't know which PCM is in it, but are fairly certain it is original, an original replacement, or you know what's in there, look at the emission series (engine code), and the GVWR rating. 8600/F=HD, and [less than 8600]/S=LD. The pump corresponding to the weight rating and engine emission series (according to the VIN, or PCM if it's not original) should match. If not, something else has been changed along the way. With that info, the LD pump and/or PCM is compatible with other years, while the 94 HD pump is compatible only with 94 HD PCM. If the PCM is 94 HD, it must have the 94 HD pump.

[phantom309]

the update on the 5068 with 5521 programming,.
wow,.
except at idle and up to 2% throttle,.it definitely puts in more fuel right across the board,. which translates to very little throttle input to get the job done,. quick heavy throttle is enough for the caterpillar wanna be puff of black smoke and instant (and i do mean right now) response,. enough to spin the small 245-75-16 v-steel bridgestones,.
Due to an unfortunate accident,. i,ve returned to ontario and it,s just successfully completed the 3600kms home again,.(in 56hrs) getting 23.7mpg (big gallon)(almost 20mpg baby gallon) I used howes fuel conditioner every tankful,.
I remember now that i did an optical bump on this pump and i dislike it, plans are to put it back in the middle,.it,s too twitchy at small throttle input,.not good for an easy take off on slippery surface,(compounded with summer race tires)
will defuel after 2400 if i use full throttle,. too much boost iirc,.sets the cel which resets after restart,.
driving impression is very favourable power wise but with medium input position on the throttle the trans isn't happy trying to hold the extra torque at lower rpm,. i think either the trans pressure needs to be raised,.or shift points raised for 25%+ throttle input,.
cold start this morning was no issue,.was about 26f.
it was climbing the steep ontario hills along hwy 17 from thunderbay southbound with ease never unlocking the converter,.cruise on set at 108kmh,(67.1)
I do feel that if an inexperienced driver were to drive it for very long, they might melt the motor,.i know whats going on with the extra fuel etc,. and i may explore a different turbo,. and if motivation kicks in further, i'll replacethe head bolts one by one with the arp studs i have from the dually motor,.and add the coolant flow lines from the rear of the heads to the single t-stat water manifold,. although this particular truck was never bought with hot rodding in mind,.the 2nd step has been take,.the first being the bigger down pipe and large cone air filter when i first got the truck, along with the 8 new injectors and new glow plugs, a worth while investment for any older 6.5,..

interesting that gm did not uprate the turbo for this pump, i can tell it definitely could use more flow,.(bigger better fuel feed when the rpm gets up too)

Nick