White smoke at idle

[Flyboy]

I have been following deerhunter7's thread about the smoke at idle as I have the same problem. I just had injector balance checked this morning. Here are the readings:
Cylinder
1 + 1.2
2 - 2.3
3 + 1.7
4 + 0.6
5 + 2.0
6 - 1.9
7 + 1.6
8 - 2.8
Does these readings indicate anything to you guys?
The tech suggested that I fill the fuel filter with Diesel Kleen, let it run about five minutes and shut it off for a while to let it soak. It's soaking now. I may have the injectors changed before I get stranded on the road somewhere.
Thanks, Gerald

[DmaxMaverick]

It's hard to tell with just the balance rate numbers. Are they all negative, or did you just list them with a dash (indicating they are all positive)? It should be neither, and should include both, positive and negative numbers. The numbers, as spread as they are (not bad, really), should be both positive and negative. It is important to note the ECT, fuel temperature, air temperature, idle RPM (exact, according to the PCM, desired/actual, and any variation), shift selector position, and HVAC position (A/C compressor on or off, or cycling). It is also important to include the PWM (pulse width modulation) numbers with each corresponding cylinder balance rate, or the number mean essentially nothing. The "balance rates" are ONLY an indication of fuel volume, represented as a departure from the base fuel rate. The PWM indicates the duration of the event, and many times, can be more telling than the balance rates.

White smoke can be caused by several things, and can be normal under some conditions. What does the exhaust smell like?

[Flyboy]

Edited to show positive or negative rates. Sorry I missed that the first time.

[Flyboy]

The smoke is diesel smell. The truck is not loosing coolant or making oil.

[DmaxMaverick]

The balance rates don't appear to be remarkable, and could be seen with new injectors. Without other info: PWM, environmental and running conditions, it's difficult to begin diagnostics. The balance rate values alone don't toss up any flags.

[Kennedy]

I have been following deerhunter7's thread about the smoke at idle as I have the same problem. I just had injector balance checked this morning. Here are the readings:
Cylinder
1 + 1.2
2 - 2.3
3 + 1.7
4 + 0.6
5 + 2.0
6 - 1.9
7 + 1.6
8 - 2.8
Does these readings indicate anything to you guys?
The tech suggested that I fill the fuel filter with Diesel Kleen, let it run about five minutes and shut it off for a while to let it soak. It's soaking now. I may have the injectors changed before I get stranded on the road somewhere.
Thanks, Gerald

Yes your balance rates tell me one thing: Balance rates are overrated Knowing them can help in some cases, but not all.

Curious if this was checked with a Tech 2 or other?

I wouldn't use Power Service is any of my diesels. The only place I will pour it is in my drain oil container.

[deerhunter7]

My smoke at idle is more grey than white . Do not lose any coolant or have oil dilution. Or no fuel knock. My # 7 balance rate was 3.8 to 4 . Have tried lots of cleaner but has not helped. I may change 1 bank of injectors myself .

[Flyboy]

John:
This was not checked with a Tech 2. I don't know what it was other than it cost around $4,000. There is no other issues with the truck except for the smoke. It runs fine and makes good power. I don't know what to do at this point. I don't want to get stranded on the road somewhere.
Gerald

[Kennedy]

From my armchair I can tell you that if you have smoke at idle, primarily when warm that it is an injector issue. I don't trust anything but a Tech 2 for balance rates, but the smoke pretty much says injector. If it's a single injector, the Tech 2 can cancel firing events on each cylinder until the smoke clears or at least lessens.

If it's just smoky, you may well get by for a while, but pistons can take a beating from a bad injector and then it gets REALLY expensive...

[Flyboy]

Thanks everyone. I will baby it for a while and then do an injector job.

[Kennedy]

Plan ahead as Injectors have been B.O. a lot as of late. We've been able to get a set here and there and haven't fallen too far behind, but I'd expect potential resistance to sale of a partial set from stock until the supply catches up.

[mark g]

my 02 duramax has finally started to show the same symtom, smoke at idle. i have 115k and bought the truck new. my friend, who is a pretty good wrench put his non-tech2 on the truck. the results from injector kill showed only #8 with no rpm change and #1 with a slight change. my question is since im going to replace my injectors, what about the so called 50hp injectors? will they work in my stock truck? im after economy, not performance. there are some on ebay right now for a resonable price. whats the deal?? i want to keep my truck, ive had no trouble thus far.

[dually2002]

My 02 still has the original injectors with 90k on them. When its my time I will stick with JK because of his knowledge base and experience and if you don't turn into a pain in the ass all the tech support you can stand. As far as the 50 hp injectors stick with the stock inj. and get a JK tuned ECM. I have been running his 50-100-hp tune for 3 years now and has worked as advertised. I am also running his 4" exhaust.

[Kennedy]

my 02 duramax has finally started to show the same symtom, smoke at idle. i have 115k and bought the truck new. my friend, who is a pretty good wrench put his non-tech2 on the truck. the results from injector kill showed only #8 with no rpm change and #1 with a slight change. my question is since im going to replace my injectors, what about the so called 50hp injectors? will they work in my stock truck? im after economy, not performance. there are some on ebay right now for a resonable price. whats the deal?? i want to keep my truck, ive had no trouble thus far.

Generally if the seller needs Ebay he has no market. Not a fan of ebay.
A 50HP injector should be somewhat (a few hundred dollars) more expensive than a standard. They can give more power, but ECM tuning needs to take the additional fuel into account or you wil have a good bit of smoke.

[mark g]

i did not buy the 50hp injectors. im looking for stock ones to put in my stock truck. 300hp is enough for my needs.

there are several diesel shops listing rebuilt units on ebay. they give a 1 yr warranty. they range in price from 200-250 per for 8. i found a chevy dealer that will sell for 192.00 with a tax number but i have not verified this. thanks for the help. i need to have at least one bank changed before feb-6. i need to make a trip.

[DmaxMaverick]

www.gmpartsdirect.com has injectors for $182 ea. Part # 97729095.

[mark g]

thanks, ill check it out. do they need your core? thanks. mark

[DmaxMaverick]

Yes, they are exchange. The core charge is $100. You'll have to deal with that, anywhere. New, if you can find them, are several hundred more, each. I've done a lot of trading with them, and they are about as good an online store as any. If you order from them, be sure to go through their customer service, providing your VIN#. If you do this, and they send the wrong/defective part, for any reason, they will expedite an exchange for no additional charge. Other places charge a restocking fee, and GMPD does too for most items if you don't go through the customer service option. This is very important with the injectors, because they are "non-returnable". Once a package is opened, it is considered "contaminated", and cannot be re-shelved before a full inspection and bench test. A very good practice, in my opinion (ensures the highest quality).

[DmaxMaverick]

Additionally, gmpartsdirect is a GM dealership parts store, with an online outlet.

[mark g]

thanks for the info. looked up gm parts direct. 178.50 each but their s&h was 171.00 for 4 injectors. profit margin? thanks but this will not work for me.

[Kennedy]

We don't gouge on shipping PLUS we are a supporting vendor here. We are still a bit higher than the whorehouses, BUT just try to get tech support from them...

[mark g]

just fyi i bought from capitol chevy, here in austin, tx. 8 injectors 1750.00 plus 100 core deposit. i called three local dealer, all had them in stock. 350.00 list. they were all between 275-219 apiece. thanks for the heads up.

[Dub G]

I too have an 02 with over 200000mls and my injectors just went out I took it into oc Diesel guys in cali and he told me #1,4,5,6,7 Are bad so to replace all 8 he wants 4500.. I love this truck if I do the injectors what is the next thing to go wrong I don't want to keep dropping money into the truck...I have a 4" exhaust with a hypertech chip and intake I could use some good advice?? Thanks

[mark g]

mine are finished, wasn't to bad . took a total of about 12 hrs. i let it run for 30 minutes or so, took care of the idle smoke problem. i will give it another test tomorrow and see how it does.
i had no cups come out with injectors and only 2 were difficult to remove. i found that you can move them back and forth enough to wiggle them out. next time will be faster but i hope its not my truck. thanks for the help. mark

[Flyboy]

I just finished changing my injectors. Not too difficult a jog, but I hope I don't have to do it again. Engine runs very smooth and no more smoke. For injectors that are hard go get out, screw a fuel line on it to use as a handle. Worked much better than using channel lock pliers.
Thanks to everyone's help.

[mark g]

i just returned from my trip to co with the family, almost 2k miles of driving, milage is back up to almost 20 average. thanks. mark