Thoughts and Opinions - Acetone as a fuel additive

[KerrySchrantz]

We were talking fuel (cost, supply etc.) here at work and one of my associates blurted out that he was going to add acetone to his tank to get better MPG (you shoulda seen the look on my face, I was picturing melting plastics and o-rings in my eng compartment). I googled it (acetone fuel additive) and was floored at what I found. I also searched these forums and noticed it's never been discussed. Thoughts, opinions, flames?

[JTodd]

I think it has been briefly discussed here. It has been argued vigorously on dieselstop.com, a similar forum to this, but for Powerstroke owners. As will happen here, there will be those that have used concentrated acetone and beg all to forget the topic ever came up, and if used, the truck will become a raging fireball, or at least instantly disabled. Then there will be those arguing that in such low concentrations (I believe the recommendation is 1oz in 10 gal of diesel fuel) that no harm will be done.

Sit back and wait for the show here (get your popcorn ready)

[eracers999]

I tried it and thought it ran like a dog tird, couldent wait to run that tank out.

[GMCfourX4]

I have not tried it myself, but I have read a number of articles on it, and if you add too much, it WILL make the vehicle run like crap. It has a VERY high octane rating, which means if you put too much in, the fuel will be very slow to start burning, which would probably be more noticeable in a diesel. I'm curious to see what difference it makes in a 6.5TD. I was going to try it in my truck, but I have too many issues to iron out for me to be able to make a good comparison.

-Chris

[moondoggie]

Guy claims increased MPG by mixing acetone w- fuel (http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=003747)

[GMCfourX4]

After reading through post after post on the Ferd forum on the subject, and reading quite a bit from other sites (including the one that started the whole thing...) I've come to the conclusion that none of the people on the Ford forum were quite following the intended procedure to figure out how much to use. The way I read the article, you are supposed to start at a low concentration, and very slowly go up, AFTER you've already figured out your base mileage. Some of the Ford guys were starting with high concentrations of acetone (which the author comes right out and tells you will hurt mileage) then stop adding it, and say their mileage went up, so it isn't worth it. Did the mileage go up b/c the acetone made it go down, or did it go up b/c they put too much in in the first place? I don't know, but I don't think the way they went about it is good enough to come up with a solid answer. It seems to me that someone who does a LOT of very consistent driving needs to test it (my mileage goes up and down by 1-2mpg every fillup, b/c of the crazy traffic around Boston). They should start with a LOW concentration (.75oz/10gal) and slowly increase it each tank (keeping in mind that there will still be some in the fuel left in the tank). My truck isn't in any condition for me to try this now, but I am trying it in my Impala, and I'm starting at a low concentration. Is there anyone here willing to try, and follow the suggestions in the article to do a valid test?

-Chris

[KerrySchrantz]

Like Chris (GMCfourx4), I have spent a considerable amount of time reading up on this subject since starting this thread and have come to the same conclusion.

I think my driving habits make for an excellent test platform. I have recently (Mid June) started working for a new company and have a commute of 58 miles each way. I work nights so I encounter very little traffic. My house is 1.7 miles from the highway and the office is 1.1 miles from the same highway leaving 55 miles of uninterrupted highway speeds (I have been religious about setting the cruise to 60 and leaving it there). Among the other gauges and usual monitoring methods to watch the health of my baby, I also pay very close attention to my MPG's, for the last 7 years the truck has been consistently getting between 14.3 and 14.6 during city driving (the vast majority of my driving). Since starting the new job I have been logging my MPGs and been getting between 17.1 and 17.8 (usually more towards the high end. There was one morning where I moved only 1.5 miles over the course of an hour. This was the same week I got the 17.1 reading). Yesterday I added 1.5 oz. to the tank and topped off (30 gallons) before going to work. I have already noticed the engine absolutely does idle smoother and runs quieter. I'll run with this volume for two tanks (about two weeks) and then follow up with a .5 oz. per 10g increase every other tank until I hit the 2 per 10 max and report what I find while doing so.

[JeepSJ]

Acetone is a solvent - it kills the lubricating qualities of oil. Why would you want to run this through your IP?

I did testing in both of our gas burners. I had no difference in mileage at .5, 1, 1.5 and 2oz per 10 gallons. To validate my test, I ran the test in my wife's car without telling her. She gets very consistent mileage. Same result - absolutely no change in mileage.

Do a google search on it. I had actually found a great article on additives and their chemical composition. They covered acetone and said that there was nothing in acetone that would contribute significantly to gas or fuel.

[JTodd]

Reported results happening at such low concentrations would seem to indicate a chemical reaction between the fuel and the acetone - not just a mixture. If this is the case, alone it may not have beneficial properties, but after a reaction what does it do? (Try drinking Hydrogen or Oxygen)

For those among us more versed in chemistry, what happens with CH3COCH3 + CnH2n+2C9

Don't get me wrong, I am not a shill for this stuff, and as skeptical as most, but I am willing to entertain the possibility until proven to the contrary. Jeep

[farmerherb]

There is something in all the diesel additives I've used which raise cetane ratings and it has the same smell as lipstick. Does anyone know what this could be? It's supposed to help MPG.

[jbell]

I haven't tried it in my 6.2, but my taco likes it. 4oz / 15gal. With airdam, low profile toolbox, rear half tonneau, sunroof popped up, and acetone, I'm up to 22-23mpg, runing 75mpg on my 100mile daily commute. (not bad for a epa rated 17-19 tacoma on 32's.) I also have had mobile1 in my trans,xfer,rear end since break in for anyone wanting to know. I used to get 287miles to when the fuel light would turn on, now it's 346 - 350.

Suburban with 6.2 still gets 20... I don't put enough daily miles on it, for a good mileage comparison.

I noticed that I had to put it in, just before filling up, or it wouldn't mix properly (I'm guessing) On the tanks that I added it after fillup, little change in mpg, and right after fill up, motor died a couple times idling, which was unique.....

As always ymmv.

[TurboDiverArt]

Originally posted by KerrySchrantz:
Like Chris (GMCfourx4), I have spent a considerable amount of time reading up on this subject since starting this thread and have come to the same conclusion.

I think my driving habits make for an excellent test platform. I have recently (Mid June) started working for a new company and have a commute of 58 miles each way. I work nights so I encounter very little traffic. My house is 1.7 miles from the highway and the office is 1.1 miles from the same highway leaving 55 miles of uninterrupted highway speeds (I have been religious about setting the cruise to 60 and leaving it there). Among the other gauges and usual monitoring methods to watch the health of my baby, I also pay very close attention to my MPG's, for the last 7 years the truck has been consistently getting between 14.3 and 14.6 during city driving (the vast majority of my driving). Since starting the new job I have been logging my MPGs and been getting between 17.1 and 17.8 (usually more towards the high end. There was one morning where I moved only 1.5 miles over the course of an hour. This was the same week I got the 17.1 reading). Yesterday I added 1.5 oz. to the tank and topped off (30 gallons) before going to work. I have already noticed the engine absolutely does idle smoother and runs quieter. I'll run with this volume for two tanks (about two weeks) and then follow up with a .5 oz. per 10g increase every other tank until I hit the 2 per 10 max and report what I find while doing so. If what Jeep says is true about removing lubricating properties, you might want to add in additional lubricity to protect your injector pump. I've got no idea how much to add but I would error on the side of caution just to be safe. I always add an additive at each fill up. I plan to add additional lubricity starting next year as we get close to the introduction of the ultra low sulfur 50-PPM fuel. Might not need to do so but anything that adds additional protection to a $2000 pump is money well spent.

Always looking for anything that will increase mileage or make the truck quieter.

Art.

[Barry Nave]

In my line of work I have driven 1500+ miles in as little as 2 days. But my pump is on 104K.
I'd be afraid of taking away and fuel lube to fine out. Truck in most of it's year as seen 60mph and under. New job, truck see's 70-75 mph for hours at a time. Then the ugly 35 code would show. Some times 36. This was with in the frist week. Now pump seem fine for these codes dont show there face anymore. :confused:
Could these higher speed cleared something out of the pump. Maybe the new chip had something to do with it. Maybe, I'm also using more fuel Addt. then I use to. MPG is 15.5, 16, and at times 14. with those speeds. Town driving also at times. Just glad not to see any code for now.
Wonder how much longer my pump will last?
Anywho more lube for me ;)

[KerrySchrantz]

Well, while I do believe the truck ran smoother and seemed to have more power, I didn't see an improvement in MPG's

Week1 0.5oz/10 464m 26.37g 17.59575275mpg
Week2 0.5oz/10 472m 26.45g 17.84499055mpg
Week3 1oz/10 471m 26.5g 17.77358491mpg
Week4 1oz/10 480m 28g 17.14285714mpg
Week5 1.5oz/10 467m 26.4g 17.68939394mpg
Week6 1.5oz/10 472m 26.5g 17.81132075mpg
Week7 2oz/10 492m 28.2g 17.44680851mpg
Week8 2oz/10 565m 31g 18.22581mpg

Week 4 - there was a bunch of traffic and I spent 45 minutes one morning moving about 1,000 feet.
Week 8 - overnight temps dropped several degrees. Added 5lbs air to one tire. Changed fuel filter and oil during the weekend before

Still within the same range (17.1/17.8) as with out the acetone. not sure it's worth the effort.

I do add lube (stanadyne) to the tank already.

Oh well.

[tom.mcinerney]

I would guess that acetone would have similar energy content to ethanol/methanol . Probably good as an 'oxygenator', and possibly drying agent like ether . Also guessing that glycols would have better energy and lubricity, assuming they aren't mixed with water.

[tom.mcinerney]

Ran across the following in the tech bulletin section of the PenRay site:

http://www.penray.com/bulletins/diesel1.htm
"Service Recommendation:
Most diesel fuel additive demonstrations performed in the field by itinerant salesmen are, at best, invalid. At worst they are intentionally deceptive and fraudulent. The chemistries of various fuel additives do vary from brand to brand, depending on the intended application and price towards which the product is designed. In general, this is certainly an area of products where you get exactly what you pay for. Nevertheless, it is Penray's experience with the major suppliers' products that they are compatible with one another, when used as directed in diesel fuel. Customers should not be concerned that the use of multiple brands of additives will damage their engines due to incompatibility. Of course, use of a harmful chemistry, i.e. methanol, will be problematic regardless of other products used.

Penray recommends the use of additive products that have been tested and proven to provide the advertised benefits. Penray diesel additives have been documented to be effective and beneficial, when used as directed."

http://www.penray.com/bulletins/index.htm

[markrinker]

Personally, the only thing I add to diesel fuel is synthetic 2-cycle oil. 2-3 ounces per tankful.

Not sure if it does a damn thing for my IP or injectors, but it makes me feel good!!!

[markrinker]

"Service Recommendation:
Most diesel fuel additive demonstrations performed in the field by itinerant salesmen are, at best, invalid. At worst they are intentionally deceptive and fraudulent. The chemistries of various fuel additives do vary from brand to brand, depending on the intended application and price towards which the product is designed. In general, this is certainly an area of products where you get exactly what you pay for. Nevertheless, it is Penray's experience with the major suppliers' products that they are compatible with one another, when used as directed in diesel fuel. Customers should not be concerned that the use of multiple brands of additives will damage their engines due to incompatibility. Of course, use of a harmful chemistry, i.e. methanol, will be problematic regardless of other products used.

Penray recommends the use of additive products that have been tested and proven to provide the advertised benefits. Penray diesel additives have been documented to be effective and beneficial, when used as directed."

http://www.penray.com/bulletins/index.htm
Short translation:

"Everybody elses (diesel additive) product sucks. Our product rocks (doesn't suck).

If you mix them together, ours still rocks - but theirs still sucks.

Use our product only."

tongue.gif ;) :D

[tom.mcinerney]

10-4 on your translation, Mark!

I didn't intentionally post that twice.

I was quite impressed with the quality of info at the Pennray site.