4.5L Duramax For 2010- New Pictures?

[ccole]

Hello All-
I stumbled across some different pictures of the 2010 (LMK) 4.5L Duramax (new to me anyway). Thought I would share them...

Happy Holidays.

[More Power]

Is the engine using a BOP (Buick, Olds, Pontiac) transmission bellhousing bolt pattern? It's not a Chevy/GMC V-8 pattern (like the Duramax 6600).

Thanks for the pics,

Jim

[Mark Rinker]

Way cool...now there is an engine that would make sense to swap into a rolled caged GM Colorado - then head off to Bonneville for Speed Week...;)

So much for changing the alternator in your driveway. Looks like you need a hoist...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49_RwAZ2_vc

[mattb5150]

With all that's going on with GM and the economy does anyone know if this engine is still slated for introduction for the 2010 model year?

Matt

[ccole]

With all that's going on with GM and the economy does anyone know if this engine is still slated for introduction for the 2010 model year?

Matt

Looks like it (at this point anyway). Check out the below link and click on "Truck Engines- 2010": http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/photos/f_actual/powertrain.html

[04duramaxlly]

looks like the fuel filter will be fun to access. Maybe from underneath the vehicle, or through the fender well.

[trbankii]

Looks like it (at this point anyway). Check out the below link and click on "Truck Engines- 2010": http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/photos/f_actual/powertrain.html

I don't think that means much, because this - LINK (http://gm.wieck.com/forms/gm/previewpage?038782)- shows it in 2008...

[Rabbler]

I think the first posted pics are more likely to be close to the actual engine.
That link you posted looks like an artist concept drawing.

The LMK is an interesting animal. Notice the missing exhaust manifolds??

The heads flow backwards compared to a conventional V8!

Supposedly this engine is all GM with no Isuzu influence too.

I wonder which bank is #1 cyl on?

[leolkfrm]

As of right now the new engine project is on hold!!!!!!!!!

[Showgood1]

Don't leave us in suspense how do you know? For how long? Good grief we've been waiting for 10 years.

[leolkfrm]

Tonawanda Engine plant is designated to build it, old machines were pulled out, floor is ready for new, with the economic downturn, and bailout GM put a hold on a lot of things.
Really not a good thought process for turning a business around, but then they always blame the labor force and union for their problems, and the public believes it!!:mad:

[More Power]

Ford shelved their light-duty diesel program as well. They blame the cost imbalance between gas/diesel and the rising fuel economy capability of the newest direct-injected gas engines. I haven't heard from anyone who blames the union for the lack of a light-duty diesel. The leadership at GM/Ford made the decision not to move ahead with their diesel programs.

GM and Ford had the past 8 years to establish a foothold in the light-duty diesel consumer market when 1/2-ton & SUV diesels would have been wildly popular.... They let it slip away... :(

Jim

[More Power]

http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/photopost/data/500/45LDiesel.jpg

[trbankii]

Disappointed to see that - especially as I consider that moving ahead with the program could place them as a market leader in light-duty trucks when they need anything they can get to convince people to put faith in them.

[More Power]

I agree... GM (and Ford & Dodge) sat on their hands for the past 9 years, even though they had a light-duty diesel in the pipeline. None of them was willing to take the lead and actually introduce one (GM was waiting for Ford to take the lead). In doing so, they all passed up a tremendous opportunity to expand their brand and sell a lot of diesel powered vehicles.

Never say never, but I do not believe GM/Ford/Dodge will ever expand their diesel offerings here in the U.S. I say this because of the current political climate, gas/diesel cost difference, diesel engine option cost premium and the improvement in gasoline technology - primarily direct-injected gas engines and other fuel efficiency technologies that improve gas fuel mileage.

It does expand an opportunity for the Suburban/Duramax conversion market. They're currently selling for about $80K, which begins with a used 2500-series gas powered Suburban.

DMAX is down to a single shift 6-days a week, but they are optimistic for the future. No doubt....

Jim

[trbankii]

I haven't seen anything lately on the Toyota Tundra diesel. Last I saw was a late 2009 introduction. That could prompt GM and Ford to get off their duffs, but then once again they'll be playing catchup and follow the leader instead of being the leader...

[richp]

Hi,

I was talking today to the owner of my dealership (Bob Jass Chevrolet in Elburn, IL -- fine outfit). It was his view that GM is shelving the small diesel due to the emissions issues that they see coming down the road.

FWIW.

[ccole]

I agree with Jim 100% on this. As I am very, very disappointed to hear of this news, I am not surprised.

I believe the future of diesels in US consumer vehicles are continually going to fade away. There are simply too many strikes against the diesels in the U.S. for the market to survive. Such as premium $$ for hardware to meet emissions (DPT, urea, controllers, sensors, etc etc), decreased mpg, higher cost per gallon at pump, increased maintenance costs, politics, EPA, GM financial status, etc etc). Especially when you stand back and look at the engineering gains that have been made in the gasoline powered engines such as: direct injections, HP gains, MPG gains from partial cylinder cut-out, cheaper fuel, etc etc.

I have been a faithful diesel owner since I began driving. Especially partial to GM, but I forecast the 4.5L cancellation is just the beginning of the end for diesel powered consumer vehicles in the US. Keep in mind that the U.S. emission standard "Bin 5/Tier2" is 6 times tougher to meet that Europe’s "Euro 5." Therefore, I forecast the Europe diesel engine market will remain on target, while we fade away here.

Quoting Bob Lutz, GM VP of Global Development "At best, the diesel engine of the future will be tremendously expensive, lower MPG and unsure with emissions can be met for California and Northern States."


Just my $.02

[leolkfrm]

todays local paper

03/11/09 10:00 AM
GM delays V-8 diesel production at Tonawanda engine plant

By Matt Glynn
News Business Reporter

General Motors Corp. has made announcements about two products at its Town of Tonawanda engine plant.
The automaker has placed an "indefinite hold" its plan to add a Duramax 4.5-liter V-8 diesel engine in 2010 to its Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra light-duty trucks. It was to be made at the River Road site. The start of the new engine's production had already been delayed this year.
The plant will regain production of a 3.7-liter, Inline 5-cylinder engine that had been transferred from Tonawanda to a plant in Flint, Mich., in 2007. Production of the I-5 is set to resume at the Tonawanda plant this summer.

[MacDR50]

Much of the ULSD produced in NA meets a less than 10% PPM standard. As a result it can readily be sold in Europe. The production of diesel is increasing while gas production is falling. For the first time in several years diesel prices are below gas in several NA markets. The fall off in offshore demand is a partial factor for this decline. For those interested in a good summary here is a link:

http://www.energytribune.com/articles.cfm?aid=1347

[More Power]

A quote from that article that I found interesting...


The U.S. exported 544,000 barrels of distillate a day in November, up from 81,000 in November 2003.

It is a puzzle why a country that imports most of the petroleum it uses would then export a refined product.... Without the diesel exports, what might the diesel fuel pump price be? Supply & demand would seem to indicate a much lower diesel fuel price.....

Jim

[mattb5150]

I've always heard that we swap diesel for gasoline with Europe.

Matt

[More Power]

http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/photopost/data/500/dieselprices.jpg

More gasoline results from the refining process than diesel fuel, when refining the lighter crude stocks. I've read that heavy crude produces more diesel than gasoline.

Per the Department of Energy's statistics in 2004, each year the US consumes roughly 60 billion gallons of petroleum diesel and 120 billion gallons of gasoline.

Jim

[MacDR50]

More power you are correct WRT heavy crude. The % of heavy crude entering the market is increasing as light crude sources are being depleted. Many US refineries are not designed for the heavier crude feedstocks. This is changing and we should see more diesel in the market. The downside seems to be that many countries are encouraging the use of diesel for environmental reasons and the growth of diesel vehicles is significant in these countries. Here in NA we have not kept pace. While Europe has 3 cylinder diesel autos we seem to think only big trucks are diesel candidates.

[n3pro]

As of right now the new engine project is on hold!!!!!!!!!

That's what I read from gminsidenews.com
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2009/03/gm-delays-new-25-mpg-diesel-engine-for-silverado-and-sierra.html

[DennisG01]

I'm disappointed about the 4.5, as well. While I'm not ready to buy a new vehicle, yet (hopefully another Sub), I was really looking forward to seeing that new engine in the market.

On the other hand, I'm optimistic that we will start seeing more diesels in NA. BMW, for one, recently announced that they're bringing a 3 series diesel to the US. I'm not sure if Merc currently has one available in the US, or not - but their Bluetec diesel is only about a $1,000 option over gas - the last time I checked, anyway. Here's another interesting thing: greencar.com recently announced their pick for the 2009 Green Car of the year - guess what? It wasn't a hybrid - it was Jetta diesel! Here's the link: http://www.greencar.com/articles/vw-jetta-clean-diesel-wins-2009-green-car-year.php

[john8662]

I used to go to the car (truck) lots and look at the new vehicles, I used to actually care what was coming out and waiting for Diesel options in SUV's, smaller trucks, and cars. But I don't get an option, in reality, they don't make a vehicle (none of the big 3) that I'm interested in paying for, for the 5 or more year duration. I really don't go looking any more, just the used car lots for that old 6.2 or 6.5 hiding out abandoned. It's not just because I'm cheap, it's I'm completly un-interested in what they're offering. From the tone in this thread, I'm certainly not alone. I have no desire for another 3/4 ton or 1 ton truck just to get a Diesel, have one, don't want another.

I love driving (lately) of the 1982 SHORT BED 6.2's I have, get's better fuel economy than a new gasser, and it's a cool truck that sounds sweet. Just don't have anything close in new. Piss on GM, Ford, and Goats...

The big 3 should probably just ramp up reproduction parts and keep the older stuff on the road, because their new stuff just plain sucks (sales show it too).

[ccole]

Yep... I have been holding onto my 2007 2500HD Dmax with 6000 miles with anticipation of trading it on a 1/2 ton 4.5L Dmax. Well, after being disappointed again by GM putting a "temporary hold" on the project, I traded it in today on a "white diamond" edition 1/2 ton Silverado gasser. I really have no justifiable need for a 3/4 ton Dmax, but I simply wanted to drive a diesel GM truck. And, I hope I am wrong on this, but I have a fear that all this emissions/politics/GM financial status/eroding MPG's from DPF's/diesel fuel prices/etc.,etc is going to further drive market price of Dmax trucks down; and I didn't want to be stuck with a "potential" 50K pink elephant diesel truck. As mentioned above, I hope I am wrong about that.

Meanwhile, I will keep my ol' 6.5 for daily driving and hopefully someday, GM will jump back on the bus of 1/2ton diesel trucks. (and, hopefullly consumers will be kind enough to welcome the 1/2ton diesel with open arms)

[john8662]

Man, I wouldn't trade off a diesel for a gasser, or buy a new gasser. I'm exactly to the point where I'd hold out for an electric vehicle before I'd buy a new gasser. I don't even like electric one bit. I hold electric cars at a very low regard because in my view the batteries and electric motors (starter) on my trucks are the LEAST reliable component, why would I want a vehicle that is entirely reliant on electric components?

This news of the 4.5 dmax being delayed (cancelled in reality) makes me even more upset the Gov bailed out GM, I wouldn't have...

Heck, look how responsible AIG has been? GM is the same...

[ccole]

I agree, I am not real excited about stepping down to a gasser vehicle, but it just makes more sense for me right now.

Man, I wouldn't trade off a diesel for a gasser, or buy a new gasser. I'm exactly to the point where I'd hold out for an electric vehicle before I'd buy a new gasser. I don't even like electric one bit. I hold electric cars at a very low regard because in my view the batteries and electric motors (starter) on my trucks are the LEAST reliable component, why would I want a vehicle that is entirely reliant on electric components?

This news of the 4.5 dmax being delayed (cancelled in reality) makes me even more upset the Gov bailed out GM, I wouldn't have...

Heck, look how responsible AIG has been? GM is the same...

[carco]

Just read a release saying the 4.5L Duramax is on hold! Engineering of the engine is complete but integration engineering into the chassis and all that goes with that process is on hold until GM is in better financial condition. I was looking forward to this engine, not that I was buying but felt like a good market was available for the 4.5L. Grafting one of these into an old pickup say a 50's model would be neat. bob..............


Sorry, I go to another thread below and I see the 4.5 hold by Gm is already being discussed.

[hapaschold]

I agree, I am not real excited about stepping down to a gasser vehicle, but it just makes more sense for me right now.


traded a 2007 with only 6000 miles on it ? that musta been a trade in hit.....how much did they give you for trade ?

[ccole]

traded a 2007 with only 6000 miles on it ? that musta been a trade in hit.....how much did they give you for trade ?

Yep....6000 miles. My dealer (whom takes very good care of me) was hesistant in trading for it, because of the excessively high $$ amount he had to put in my trade-in. I traded for a 1/2 ton '09 LBZ Diamond White that had a higher MSRP than my Loaded LBZ Dmax did when I purchased it new. I do love that white diamond color and no more issues with a DPF. I miss the diesel, but not all of tree-hugging components to make it compliant with EPA.

We do not use our trucks for work; they are more for "sunday driving." After dealing with a DPF that has plugged twice in 6000 miles, the truck is basically telling me that we are not driving it as it was intended. More so, I am fearful of the market value dropping on the new diesels due to all of the emisssion components, expected higher fuel, deteriorating MPG and an even higher premium price for being equipped with a diesel engine. If you own a Dmax and can justify the work truck aspect of it, thats great. I wish I could. We use ours as a sunday vehicle and trade often. It just made more sense for us and our driving habits.