View Full Version : Stalls,no glow plug light,ready to give up on 6.5
Dennis22
10-22-2003, 16:26
you die hard 6.5's have been a great help to me in the past,one more time please!
1996 6.5 suburban 141,000 miles. I drive down the road and it is like you turned off the key, sometimes it will restart, only if the glow plug light comes on.If the glow plug light does not come on when you cycle the key it will not restart.The truck started fine this morning,I went to come home tonight and no glow plug light so no start.This is a intermittent problem, truck will work fine for days and then happen all the time for a stretch.Does not set any codes.
Replaced both Batteries last night, that did not fix it. Last month I replaced the FSD and that fixed that no-start stalling problem (she would not run at all) I have replaced the glow plugs,the glow plug controller. I have put about $3500. into it in the last couple of months and still cant have a reliable vehicle.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!! (I really like the vehicle and dont want to give up on it)
Dennis22
Fishnfool
10-22-2003, 18:28
Dennis - it's possible it might be the ignition switch. Mine was dieing intermittantly and would not start, no dash indicator lights - engine would crank but not start.
I did find that by pulling the release on the Tilt Wheel and slamming the wheel up & down full travel it would jar the switch back to life and allow the engine to start.
By ignition switch, this means the one downstream of the switch you put your key in - it's buried in the steering column someplace.
Good Luck
Dave
charliepeterson
10-22-2003, 18:54
Dennis:
Did you mount the PMD back onto the Injection Pump? Most members here have gone with a "cool plate" as a heat sink for the driver. The plate can be mounted almost anywhere with a harness extension as long as it gets good air flow across it.
The plate also gives MUCH easier access to the driver for replacement or diagnosing.
I know the driver is new but it could have failed. Another member here who I work with had one fail in only one months time.
From what you're describing it could have failed.
The easiest way to trouble shoot the failed driver is to pour tap water on it alone when the truck won't start. The water will cool it enough to start working again.
The glow plugs really won't come on if at all if the engine is hot enough.
turbovair
10-22-2003, 19:54
I agree about checking the ignition switch. On my 96 the switch is adjacent to the key/lockset.I found out when my truck started stalling unpredictably. One day while it was idling, I wiggled/shook the key and it died. I replaced the switch/ harness($180 @ dealer)Problem has completely gone away and has never recurred.Earlier models have the switch lower in the column, but on a 96, it is attached to the ignition lock cylinder.
turbovair
10-22-2003, 19:57
A detail I forgot to add. When removing the switch/harness, I found a green 12 gauge wire broken at the lower end of the ignition switch harness(adjacent to the connector) where it attached to the main harness. Maybe I could have soldered it back, but I changed the harness/switch to be completely safe.
Dennis22
10-23-2003, 15:00
I went back to work today after not doing a thing to it and the glow plug lights came on and she started fine and no stalling today. The harness in the ignition switch is a good idea, next time it happens I will be banging that arounnd for sure!! This happens when it is cold,hot it does not seem to matter. It does seem electrical, now I have a place to look, Thank you. Any other electrical connections I should check?
goodmonkey
10-23-2003, 17:03
I'd look possibly at the PCM. It does give commands to both the glow plug relay and the injection pump. If you turn the key and the rest of your accessories come on, but no glow plug light, and it turns over but won't fire, then there is a possible problem with the PCM connector, or maybe even the PCM itself. I'd hope it might just be a broken wire in the steering column though. Sounds much less stressful on the wallet.
Dennis22
10-24-2003, 03:49
I banged the steering column and all around where the harness is and I could not get it to stall.Where is the PCM connnector? and I am assuming the PCM is the computer and if that is gone what is that going to cost me to get replaced? Thanks for all your help!
Dennis22
Hi Dennis 22,
I used to get the exact symptoms you are getting, stalling and sometimes not restarting with no glow plug light. There was a couple of other warning lights wouldn't come on at the same time.
After cleaning as many multiplugs as possible, installing a new FSC with cooler, new alternator and new batteries the problem was still there, sometimes 7 weeks between stalls.
John Cooper had suggested it may be a bad ground.
I installed a H/D battery cable from the neg terminal at the lhs battery to the neg on the rhs battery. I also put a HD ground cable from the lhs battery neg to the mount area where the solenoids and relays are mounted. Mine is a 96 Suburban.
Also cleaned and greased all battery connections.
After all this it didn't stall for 6 months. This time it was the FSD (installed about 22,000miles before with cooler) and when it would not restart the glow plug light DID come on indicating to me that it was probably a different cause.
Hope you find the cause, if you do find it let us know what it was.
Best of luck
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
twaddle@globalnet.co.uk
Dennis22
10-27-2003, 04:13
Jim,
Thanks for your reply,I also did the same thing with all the grounds and cables and I had a no start last night, I geuss now I am going after the pcm,If I find something I will let you know.
Dennis22
Hi Dennis22,
Is there anyone near you that you can beg, steal or borrow a pcm that is known to work ok so you can test it before spending big bucks on something that may not be the cause.
Does anyone out there know of a way of testing the pcm?
Have you had the truck scanned for codes yet.
Have you checked the power at the fuses when it won't start?
When I was having the "Won't start/no glow plugs" trouble, there was one of the ecm fuses would give the same symtoms if it was removed ie the same warning lights would not light up when the ignition was turned on and it would not start.
The only problem I had was that the fault was so intermittant that it wouldn't "not start" long enough for me to check the voltage.
If you want I can check my suburban to identify which fuse it was?
Have you checked the multiplug that goes in through the bulkhead heading for the pcm?
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
Dennis22
10-30-2003, 04:50
Hi Jim,
I agree, I dont want to just keep putting parts on this thing to just hope I find the problem, I am up to $3800 in the last 2 months and I dont know if it will start or stall everytime I use it.
There is no codes being set. The other day I could not get it to start, same symptoms no glow plug light all the other instrament cluster though, had it towed to the "best diesel mech" and we got it off the tow and "voila" it started right up. If you can check that Fuse that would be great, I will take any help I can get, Thanks!
I went and looked at the multiplug and eveything seems fine,do you think I should take them apart and put some dieletic grease in there?
Thanks for all your help!
Dennis22
Hi Dennis,
I checked which fuse may be part of the circuit giving the stall/no start fault.
Take the cover off the fuse /relay box on the drivers side inner fender. If you pull the ECM-B fuse while the engine is running at idle it will stall. If you try to restart you will find that it won't start and also you have no glow plug light. I also found that the "service engine soon" and "service throttle soon" lights do not come on. This is what my 96 sub was doing when it was stalling and not starting.
I had thought that if I could have traced the circuit I may have been able to find the fault, it may have been a broken wire,bad connection or a relay . Unfortunately the stalling/no start was so intermittant I couldn't get it to do it for long enough to test it.
You will also find if you pull ECM-1 fuse when the engine is running that the engine also stalls except it gives an increase in revs for a moment then dies. when you try to restart the same happens with the warning lights and no glow plugs. I presumed that the ECM-1 circuit was probably not the faulty circuit as my engine did not increase in revs when it stalled.
If you can get a detailed electrical schematic of the ECM-B circuit you or your diesel tech may be able to trace the fault.
Good luck, I hope you find the fault soon as I know how frustrating and dangerous this fault is.
Regards
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
Dennis22
10-30-2003, 17:50
Jim,
I am going back to your theory on bad grounds. I got a volt meter today and checked my grounds, at the battery I am getting 14 volts but at the grounds I am getting 12.2 - 12.3, I checked the computer with a scan tool and it is saying that the charging system is charching at 12.1 - 12.3,I think this leads to the theory that I have a bad ground?? I found the thread that Moondoggie had written about grounds and where they are, I am going to go and clean and inspect all those and hope for the best.This is also on a 96 suburban with 145,000. miles on it.
Thanks, I will let you know.
Dennis22
Dennis22
10-30-2003, 17:53
Jim,
I forgot to thank you for the information on the fuses, if the ground thing does not fix it, I will try to get a schematic so I can trace the wires from that fuse and see if there is a problem there.
Thanks again,
Dennis22
Dennis22,
Check the voltage at the alternater pos terminal, you should be getting just over 14volts.
I found a battery cable that had acid corrosion down inside the insulation about 12 inches away from the battery at a bend in the cable next to a clamp.
I also linked a ground cable from the negative
terminal of one battery to the other to give a true parallel connection. I don't like the idea of the factory set up with the ground cables connected at different sides of the engine. I found a voltage difference between the two batteries. The drivers side battery was at a lower voltage, this is the one that supplies direct to the fuse/relay box on the inner fender, thats why I fitted a HD ground cable to the fender. I also greased all connections.
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
twaddle@globalnet.co.uk
Dennis22
11-01-2003, 19:18
Jim,
I got in the truck this morning, no glow plugs therefore no start. I immediately banged on the ground on the inner passanger side ground from the firewall to the ps battery and it started right up. I had cleaned up that connection,so I thought.I checked that connection for volts and I was getting only 12.2 same with at the ground on the battery itself.The DS battery was 14.1. and the scan tool said the computer was regestering 12.2, so I changed all negative battery cables with new, also took your suggestion and put a cross over cable between the two neggative sides on both batteries. I now have 14.1 + everywhere!!! yeah!! I am thinking of naming my next born after you smile.gif
Thanks for all your help,I hope this was it, time will tell.
Dennis22
turbovair
11-02-2003, 12:26
FYI:
Adding the crossover between batteries neg teminals.....my 1996 has ALWAYS had a negative jumper cable between the batteries.Did from the day I bought it.
Hi Turbovair, my truck has a positive cable from one battery to the other but the negs go one to one side of the engine and the other battery neg to the other side of the engine.
Adding the neg cable from one battery directly to the others neg to give a true parralel connection and cured my stalling problem as well. (or until the next time 6 months later.
Hi Dennis22,
Be careful about crowing too much until you're sure its cured.
Hope it is cured though.
When I have had trouble with the Sub stalling it was a great relief to have the back up of the DP members who had been through the same kind of heartache, otherwise I wouldn't have kept the truck this long.
Glad I was able to help another member as others had helped me.
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
twaddle@globalnet.co.uk
Oh bye the way, If you do have a "next born" some time, let me know so I can send you some ceegars and a bottle of some fine Scottish malt from Bonnie Scotland to wet the babies head.
JT
Dennis 22,
I can really relate to your problem.
I chased what sound like the same thing for 3+ years on a 97-6.5. Fortunately for me, it started in the warranty period and I had it well document. After to many stalls to count, 2 tows into the dealer, (it never showed any codes), a friend who works for GM told me how to get attention via a factory rep and the local dealer.
Almost of solid week of investigation with support from the factory, the dealer service tracked it down to the ECM (the +$1800 main computer). Once replaced, +2 yrs ago, all has been fine.
A little more detail on my symptoms, it would run fine in summer and “cold” winter conditions but during the spring, fall and winter thaw it would to act up. It would have the stalling problems during large temperature transitions particularly in conditions when you see condensation appearing on everything. According to the mechanic who work on it and the factory-service consultant/rep they believed it to have been a bad circuit board or solder joint inside of the computer. Because of the documentation we had kept, they covered the entire replacement of the computer (and my warranty had actually expired almost a year prior).
I hope you find a less expensive solution.
ZbarZ
Dennis22
11-07-2003, 05:09
Well,I geuss I should have not counted my Chickens before they hatched. It had the symptoms again today :( I went for a week with no problems, thought the ground thing was it. Here we go again. PCM,ECM? all sound really expensive.
Dennis22
Dennis22,
Did you install a extra ground cable from the drivers side neg terminal to the inner fender?
If you didn't give it a try just in case.
As near to the area where the relays are located.
It might be worth a try. Use a heavy duty cable.
Was it the stalling that you got again followed by no glow plug/no start or not starting straight off again before even moving?
Regards
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
Dennis22
11-09-2003, 15:44
Jim,
It started right off before even moving,I kept cycling the key and I finaly got a quick flash of the glow plug light and it started, went up the road about 3 miles and it stalle, again I kept cycling the key and got a flash of the glow plug light and it restrarted.
That was 2 days ago and it has not had a problem since. It definently is not doing it as much (only once since the ground overhaul)Maybe I am missing it just a little on one of the grounds still.
I did put a new ground wire from the neg. terminal to the inner fender. Do you think I should put a second one? I geuss it cant hurt right?
The ground in the back of the motor on the passanger side with the ground strap was carouded pretty good,maybe I did not get that good enough?
I will tackle that one ASAP.
Thanks for all your advice!
My wife said thanks for the offer of the Cigars and Scotish malt from Bonnie Scotland but she says she is cutting me off,4 children is enough,ages 11 through 3.(Thats why we need this Suburban to run,need something to haul my "Team" around with.)
Dennis22
Hi Dennis,
The way this Suburban is behaving I'll be sending ya'll the ceegars and bottle of malt when WE get it running reliably.
The ground straps,... If you used a heavy duty cable (as in starter cable)and connections are clean and greased. Did you use an electrical grease that is conductive?
This may seem like I'm being cheeky, did you scrape the contact metal where the grounds are mating to give good connections, also did you scrape away any paint from the inner fender for the ground strap connection. If the paint is there
it may struggle to connect.
Did you replace your batteries at any time.
If not check them with a battery tester that puts them under load. you will have to disconnct them the vehicle and from each other so you don't get a false readings
Good luck
Jim
Biggar, Scotland
twaddle@globalnet
jspringator
11-09-2003, 17:50
Twaddle:
I use anti sieze compound on single connections (like a Battery terminal) and dialectic grease on plugs that carry more than one different type of connections. Is this right?
Hi J Springate,
Since buying the Suburban and having the electrically related stalling and no starting trouble I have become more aware of the importance of voltage drop and resistance at connectors and cables.
I've had the few occasions where my voltmeter was reading battery voltage at a fuel pump connection but not enough current to operate the pump.
So that I could be more than sure that connections I was cleaning or replacing were allowing as much voltage & current through I started to use an electrically conductive grease on all contact areas.
The grease I use is a U.S. military surplus grease.
I got it from a dealer probably about 10 or 12 years ago, it's been lying in my toolboxes for years so any names are long since rubbed off.
It is a grey grafite looking material with the consistancy of thick grease.
Some of the members with military service and mechanical experience may recognise it from the description.
One word of warning though if you do find a grease that is electrically conductive, DO NOT let it overlap from pin to pin on multiplug connectors as it will short circuit.
I use a piece of wire with the insulation stripped off it like a mini paint brush to ensure that the greade only goes where I want it.
I don't know if the "dialectic" that some of you guys talk about is conductive or if it is just acting as a sealer.
I'm based across the Atlantic in Scotland and I hadn't heard of "dialetic" until I joined the DP.
Regards
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
G B Sisson
11-10-2003, 12:17
When I replaced my FSD 3 weeks ago because of stalling, Idecided to replace driver side battery as the Chev stealer replaced the other 6 mo.s ago. Winter coming on and cranking seemed slower anyhow. I cleaned most grounds (easy ones) when I replaced battery. Huge difference,cranks real nice. The reason I mention that here is last weekend I finally converted my Ford 8n to 12 volts and decided to use (for now )the bat I'd retired from the Suburban. Well,she was deader than my great grandma and would not take a charge...... So along with these grounds, check your batteries. I would not be be surprised if this might have contributed to the demise of this FSD. It could have been coincidental, but temps have been around the 50's in western wash at time of stalls. My .02
Dennis22
11-10-2003, 15:39
Jim and All,
I replaced both batteries and have been using Dialectic grease on all metal to metal connections, not in any of the connectors(can I put dialectic grease in the connectors?). I do not know if this is the right place for the grease, but I was told that this was good for the connections??
Report.... All day today and no problems,it is not acting up as much for sure, I have not had a chance to work on the grounds again, but what I have done so far seems to be helping.
Thanks for all of the input from everybody.
Dennis22
Barry Nave
11-10-2003, 16:07
Does the 96 have a pin contack on the fire wall.? If so has it been pulled apart and cleaned?
Jim:
It's "dielectric" grease. Non-conductive and silicone based. You can slob it on with out having to worry about shorting anything out. All it does is exclude moisture which breaks the corrosion cycle. I use a product called DC-4 from Dow Corning. It's aviation approved.
Thanks John for the info on the "Dielectric" grease.
Dennis, If the work you've done on the ground cables doesn't completely cure your troubles, check and clean all positive connections from the batteries (including the smaller cable which feeds the fuse/relay box on the driver side inner fender.
Best of luck
Jim
Hi Dennis22,
How are you getting on with the sub or have you bought something else?
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
twaddle@globalnet
Dennis22
11-17-2003, 15:06
Hey Jim,
Went a way for a couple of days,put about 600 miles on the Suburban, acted up once but restarted after cycling the key for several minutes until I got a glow plug light. It has only acted up twice since the Ground overhaul (3 weeks) it used to act up everyday so I am happy,I think I am just missing one of the grounds buy I little bit,I have not had a chance to go over them again.
How is your sub. running, how many miles on yours?
Dennis22
This may have no relevance here but I once had an experience with an 87 S-10.
My wife and I had it all loaded up to go camping and while backing out the drive it died and would not start. So I took off the electronic ignition module and took it to a local parts store to have it checked. It checked bad so I bought a new one and put it on and it started right up.
We never did go camping because we were worried about it quiting again. A couple days later it would not start at the gas station. So I called my wife and she brought my old faithful 78 k30 dump truck to tow it home. When we got it home, I tried to start it and it fired right up. I even tried my old electronic ignition module and it still started right up, so it was never really bad.
I finally took it to a shop and he had to drive it around for a couple days before it died again. He eventually found out that it was loosing the signal from the pcm to the fuel injector. He put on a new pcm and I never had any more problems with it. If I remember right, the new pcm was only about 100.00.
I am not saying that this is your problem but it sure sounds similar. For your sake, I hope it is not the problem because it sounds like the pcm for these diesels are a little more expensive.
gerickson
11-21-2003, 05:26
Success! I have the very same problem, so after reviewing related postings, I decided that the ignition switch as the most likely problem, simply because playing with the key is a common string everyone and myself used as a temporary/emergency fix. In my case it indeed turned out to be the cause. (1996 K3500) I removed the lower steering column cover that clamshells the turnsignal and keyswitch to find the switch assembly. The key switch is the usual metal casting that houses locking drum, electrical contacts and hardware to lock the steering. The wires are connected to this casting through an elaborate plastic connector at the bottom RH side. This connector is held to the casting with male torx fasteners. The connector has an upper and a lower cover snapped on to it. I popped the lower protective cover off to expose where the wires are soldered to posts extending out of the metal casting. Using a VOM, I mapped what wires have, and do not have voltage before, during, and after the failure. It clearly showed two wires coming out of the switch were not getting power during failure. Frustration made me try the key wiggle and then physically pressing upwards on the connectors while the failure was occurring. It worked, (EVERY TIME). Further inspection showed no solder problems, so indeed the failure is internal. Using what I learned through mapping the voltages, I experimented with jumping the always hot wire to one of those two wires. This successfully worked exactly like pressing on the assembly. Cure is replace keyswitch assembly...
Dennis22
11-21-2003, 05:52
Thanks for your post, your truck would do the same things, stall or no start, and then would not restart because the glow plug light would not come on and then after cycling the key for several times you would get a glow plug light and it would start?
It just seems strange that after I clean up all the grounds it seems to work a whole lot better,(but not totlaly cured)Maybe this is it, I will give it a try!!
When you say key switch assembly, that is the ignition key, correct? If I tell them the key switch assembly they will know what I am talking about?
Thanks for the input, everybody!!
smile.gif Dennis22
gerickson
11-21-2003, 09:23
During my failure, my truck would display no idiot lights at all, (glow plug wait-to-start, ABS, seatbelt, emergancy brake, all idiot lights). What did work was the instrument guages, interior lights, radio, even the starter motor worked. But engine would not start. If the only lamp that is out on your truck, is the wait-to-start glow plug lamp, my success likely isn't related.
Hi Dennis,
When your truck won't start, What lights come on the dash panal? (On my Suburban the "Service engine soon" and "service throttle soon" light did not come on along with the glow plug light).
Or do none of your dash lights come on when it won't start?
Jim Twaddle
Biggar, Scotland
Dennis22
11-23-2003, 15:09
On my Sub. the only light that does not come on is the "glow plug" light all the other idiot lights do come on.
Hey Dennis 22, Did you ever solve your problem?
I have the exact symptons. However today was the first time it ever stalled (it was on decelleration to an idle), it did restart after several key cycles. All dash indications normal except no glow plug light and the lift pump doesn't cycle (no buzz). Normally this happens every couple weeks on the first start of the day. I've swapped relays, added O gauge ground wires and put in a new glow plug relay. It does seem more prevalant when its colder outside. I've jiggled the daylights out of the key when its running and when its in no start mode with no avail. Batteries up to snuff. Also when it stalled today, took it to local auto store to check for codes, no such luck, came up clean. I just hate to start throwing parts at it. Did you ever resolve your problem?
Thanks
HudB1
96GMC6.5TDSubOwner
01-30-2004, 15:57
My experience with no wait to start light has been the CTS (Coolant Temp Sensor) which is located in the coolant manifold. Either there is a bad connection (reseat connector/use dielectric grease on pins) or a bad sensor (part #15326386). Also check ground wires on right engine bank. I carry an extra sensor ($16-22 investment) for piece of mind!
Thanks,
Would that temp sensor also stop the Fuel pump from running? Would it put a code to the computer?
Tuesday is a scheduled down day for the truck all connections are being removed cleaned then dielectric greased and grounds samo already added a 0 gauge between aft block and firewall. Then on to the notorious oil lines.
We'll See
Hudb1
Edit sat 31st/ it rained all day yesterday (truck sat) and very damp out this morning went to start truck and no glow plug light/lift pump ,everything else normal as usual however this time didn't cycle key just left in start position and noted watch. Timed, took about 3 min but the light popped on and she fired right up. I tracking it down slowly but surely.
[ 01-31-2004, 06:38 AM: Message edited by: HudB1 ]
Try hot wirinng your glow plug relay and see if you get your glow plug light.also try a battery jump cable to your engine block from the battery neg. This would check out your poor connection theary. Guns
Update:
My glow plug/start malfunction was just like dennis 22. I cleaned all underhood connectors and fuses/relays with CRC electrical cleaner then applied Dilectric grease to every plug/fuse. Also added a 0 gauge ground from left to right ground and knock on wood no problems for almost 2 weeks and it has been cool and wet which is when my problems appeared.
Hope this helps someone else out. If it surfaces again i will update
Bob
I had this problem in 2001. When I was driving, the idiot lights came on and the gear indicator light would flash also. No glow plug light when I tried to restart. It was towed three times! There were two places that had problems, one caused by the other. First the ground was bad under the little box in the driver's side engine compartment that contains the solenoids and relays. Remove the whole box, clean everything, check all wires, and remount. The second problem was the main computer wires were a little cooked from this problem. Remove the glove box and check all of the wires to the computer. Make sure no wires have become exposed. If so, put black tape on them (I had one that needed a bit of black tape). That was 3 years ago and I have never ever had a single solitary problem with this Subuarban. It now has 140K miles. Original PMD in original spot, original glow plugs, and original lift pump too. I use that Kennedy fuel additive and change all filters and oil every 3K miles with Delo 400 and Slick 50 (I believe in magic?). I baby it and it has had an easy life with no towing so maybe if this was not the case things would be bad....thinking about buying an Excursion after reading about all of the problems on this site!
Dennis22
02-18-2004, 16:22
I have been away for awhile, I am glad Hub1 found the problem, mine was solved also with the cleaning of all ground wires and adding the ground crossover. I had my Sub. at two different shops and $2,000 later, they could not solve the problem but everybody here helped correct it. This is such a valuable forum
Thanks!
Dennis
well dennis
i guess i shouldn't have been so optimistic it happen again this morning. It was cold down in the 30s last night(for us). Anyway started right up fine drove about 5 minutes and as it was idling it stalled but started right back up then stalled again, fired back and drove fine. I went into a store for about an hour and when i came back out no glow plug light or initial fuel pump boost ,after several minutes it fired up and has run the remainder of the day w/o problem.
Do you know exactly what your mechanic did?
Thanks
Hudb1
Dennis22
02-19-2004, 13:15
HudB1,
The local mechanics could not fix it, that is when I came to this forum. The suggestions I got were to go through and clean all grounds,that I did and it made a huge difference. It does still stall every once in a great while, but not like it used to (almost every day and it would not restart for hours or days) now when it stalls it will restart almost immediatly. I think there is still something in the grounding system that I did not get good enough.If you find something else please post it, I would love to have this cured for good but I cant afford to put any more money into it right now.Thanks and Good luck!
Dennis
well added another ground 4g this time from ac bracket down to frame, previously added xover ground 0 gauge on intake and small ground 10g from back of block to firewall.
have a 1100 mile journey over the weekend
will keep you posted
hudb1
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