Used Motor Oil As Fuel

[Stratosurfer]

All,
I'm an Electronic 6.5 guy and looking at Waste Motor Oil as a fuel stretcher. My research seems to point to WMO as a better alternative than Waste Vegetable Oil. Any 6.5'er burning any mix of WMO to diesel or even straight up? I understand our optical sensors can present a problem, is there anyway to fool this sensor on the opacity of the fuel.
I believe that filtering WMO down to 5 microns (whole house water filter) and sucking from a catch tank far away from the bottom to avoid water should provide an excellent and safe fuel that could be mixed in the tank with the existing diesel.
I would think the lift pump might be the major issue if we were to go higher than a 50/50 mix as over time the higher viscosity might wear it out. The IP however I believe should be OK at dealing with the blend.
I am game for moving in this direction, many Ford 7.3/7.3 Powerstrokers are running up to 100% WMO in the summer and lower cuts in the winter with no IP issues after many years. I know the optical sensor will give us issues as we increase WMO to ULSD ratio and maybe why I don't read about more 6.5'ers doing this.
All feedback appreciated.

[JeepSJ]

I think the general consensus around here is that it is a bad idea. First, there are additives in motor oil that are designed NOT to burn, which is exactly what you do not want. Second, what is the source of the WMO? If from your diesel, then it will be full of soot and other goodies that can cause a lot of wear on the pump and injectors. That being said, there are a few people here that run a small mix of it. If you are going to do it, filter it extremely well first.

Strokes running 100% WMO? Got a link to that? I'd like to know where they are getting enough WMO to run 100%.

[Stratosurfer]

Jeep,
Type in Used Motor as Diesel Fuel in Google and you will find volumes. I think the 7.3 IH and Powerstrokers have been doing more of this because they apparently don't have an optical sensor. The U.S. Military (you'll find many sites on this) spec out all waste oil from their fleet vehicles to be filtered and put in the fuel tank, this has been going on for probably 50 years or more and just recently been codified as mandatory in the military.
Filtration is the key, and ensuring no water/antifreeze in the WMO.
I have a friend who was Chief Technical (Combustion) Engineer for Conoco Phillips and was with them for 40 years. He says the ideal oil to burn would be SAE 10W w/no additives. Tranny oil's Friction Modifiers are colloidal metal and when burned can leave metallic deposits. Motor oil has some colloidal metals as additives as well, but not nearly as much as ATF, he advised strongly about not using ATF. He said 10w mineral oil (read no additives) would be the most ideal fuel stretcher for any compression ignition engine. The IP will love it, the lift pump shouldn't have to struggle too hard to move it particularly if blended w/ULSD and it should burn very clean. I am going to focus on a source of WMO that is from gas vehicles only as most are moving toward 0W-30 SAE oil and at the same time see if I can source some bulk 10W mineral oil in bulk. If I can get 10W mineral oil in bulk at around $2.00 gallon, taking into account that it requires no processing, I would think this would be a nearly ideal fuel for our 6.5's.

[cjones]

strato, Did you come to any conclusions on using 10W? I'd like to here if you learned anything along the way.

[More Power]

Jeep,
Type in Used Motor as Diesel Fuel in Google and you will find volumes. I think the 7.3 IH and Powerstrokers have been doing more of this because they apparently don't have an optical sensor. The U.S. Military (you'll find many sites on this) spec out all waste oil from their fleet vehicles to be filtered and put in the fuel tank, this has been going on for probably 50 years or more and just recently been codified as mandatory in the military.
Filtration is the key, and ensuring no water/antifreeze in the WMO.
I have a friend who was Chief Technical (Combustion) Engineer for Conoco Phillips and was with them for 40 years. He says the ideal oil to burn would be SAE 10W w/no additives. Tranny oil's Friction Modifiers are colloidal metal and when burned can leave metallic deposits. Motor oil has some colloidal metals as additives as well, but not nearly as much as ATF, he advised strongly about not using ATF. He said 10w mineral oil (read no additives) would be the most ideal fuel stretcher for any compression ignition engine. The IP will love it, the lift pump shouldn't have to struggle too hard to move it particularly if blended w/ULSD and it should burn very clean. I am going to focus on a source of WMO that is from gas vehicles only as most are moving toward 0W-30 SAE oil and at the same time see if I can source some bulk 10W mineral oil in bulk. If I can get 10W mineral oil in bulk at around $2.00 gallon, taking into account that it requires no processing, I would think this would be a nearly ideal fuel for our 6.5's.

Somewhere in my stack of stuff is a series of U.S. Military documents from the 1990s that warn about using motor oil as a diesel fuel supplement in the HMMWV. As I recall, the Military was concerned about the 6.2/6.5 engines not producing rated power when using motor oil mixed in the fuel. The HMMWV mechanics and drivers used the motor oil because they were worried about the effect of low lubricity military diesel fuel on fuel injection system reliability and life.

About a year ago I spoke with a member from the midwest whose company rebuilt Bosch injectors and did service work for owners of Duramax powered pickups. He told me that they recently replaced a set of injectors for a customer who had religiously used ATF as a lubricity supplement. The interesting thing is that the injector tips and moving parts of the injectors were clean, where injectors removed from trucks that ran straight #2 always had a varnish-like coating on the various close-tolerance components. This varnish was blamed for producing sticking/galling in these parts, which resulted in a white smoke at idle complaint.

Jim

[Mark Rinker]

A few years back I met a guy who owned an oil change station. He was filtering the waste oil through a series of increasingly smaller micron media, then centrifuging the final oil to spin out the soot.

The resulting oil was honey colored and he burned it in an old VW Rabbit that was his parts car and experimental platform. His plan was to start burning it in his Ford F350 tow truck, but I never heard if he got there with the project.

The 'soot' that was collected in the centrifuge could be formed into stuff resembling the density of a hockey puck :eek:.

[cdnewt]

Went 150 miles and got a clogged pre- filter in illinois. Horrid emmisions. it works. But I'd advise a good in garage filter set-up with a centrifuge. The dual tank systems get expensive but can pay for themselves. I'm desiging an onboard centrifugal system at the moment. But may not be able to use it until my engine runs.

[rustyk]

As some of you know I'm a recovering fuels and lube engineer. I would NEVER add used motor oil (or virgin motor oil, for that matter) into the fuel system. Running the contaminants held in suspension back through the engine just isn't wise.

I do add 2-cycle oil - which is designed to be combusted - into the fuel to compensate for the loss of sulfur's lubricity.

[petroteks]

Does anybody know how can we determine the presence of used/unused engine oil,base oil , hydraulic oil any kind of oil which is used for lubrication in diesel. I am asking this now we are dealing with sellers who blend this oil with solvents/thinners and sell as diesel.

[More Power]

Does anybody know how can we determine the presence of used/unused engine oil,base oil , hydraulic oil any kind of oil which is used for lubrication in diesel. I am asking this now we are dealing with sellers who blend this oil with solvents/thinners and sell as diesel.

I don't know of a test - other than a fuel analysis. However, your nose should be able to tell the difference. Jim

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[MajMike]

"at the same time see if I can source some bulk 10W mineral oil in bulk. If I can get 10W mineral oil in bulk at around $2.00 gallon, taking into account that it requires no processing, I would think this would be a nearly ideal fuel for our 6.5's."

Ever get any results with this, anybody? . . . Bueller? . . .

[More Power]

"at the same time see if I can source some bulk 10W mineral oil in bulk. If I can get 10W mineral oil in bulk at around $2.00 gallon, taking into account that it requires no processing, I would think this would be a nearly ideal fuel for our 6.5's."

Ever get any results with this, anybody? . . . Bueller? . . .

I've got a pile of US military documents around here somewhere that discuss the use of motor oil mixed with diesel fuel for use in their HMMWVs and other vehicles. In short, the military very strongly discourages the practice.

They said it actually reduces performance because oil/fuel mixes are less combustible than diesel fuel. Other papers cite carbon buildup on pistons and rings as a problem unless the vehicle is used in ways that generate higher exhaust temperatures.

I'd not want to use more than a 50/50 mix, and I'd not want to run it in the winter (too cool exhaust temps to burn efficiently).

[MajMike]

I've got a pile of US military documents around here somewhere that discuss the use of motor oil mixed with diesel fuel for use in their HMMWVs and other vehicles. In short, the military very strongly discourages the practice.

They said it actually reduces performance because oil/fuel mixes are less combustible than diesel fuel. Other papers cite carbon buildup on pistons and rings as a problem unless the vehicle is used in ways that generate higher exhaust temperatures.

I'd not want to use more than a 50/50 mix, and I'd not want to run it in the winter (too cool exhaust temps to burn efficiently).

I agree, I would only do so in an emergency (ie. SHTF), what about the mineral oil as mentioned above, any thoughts?