Cold Start Tips?

[sapper33]

I've got a 91 GMC K1500, w/ 6.2(obviously) w/ 170K miles.

I'm hoping that all of you in 6.2L internet land could offer some tips for getting the thing to start easier in the winter.

Currently I'm running 0W-30, and keep it plugged in when the temp starts to hover around the freezing mark. However it still doesn't like to start. In fact I went to start it last night at about -20C(so -4F), and it wouldn't...at all (ok, turns out my block heater got unplugged). But it drained the batteries all the way down. So I pulled them inside and have them on the charger.

I was thinking of installing an oil pan heater in addition to the block heater. But other than that any "normal" ways of getting it to start nicer?

I know this one might be pushing it, but anyone ever rig up 4 batteries to a 6.2? Give myself in the neighborhood of 3000 CCA.

[allformike]

Yes, I Hooked Up 3 And 4 Batteries Before, But That Was For Big Power Audio Systems And They Were In The Trunk, Not Shure How It Would Work For You, And The Cables Would Be Really Long, Since You Would Have To Put The Other Batteries In The Box

[arveetek]

Have you checked your glow plugs, wiring, etc.? With a working block heater and proper glow plug system, a 6.2L ought to start in nearly any temperature.

Also, check all your battery cables and terminals. Any corrosion in the cables or terminals will slow the starter down. Don't forget the connection at the starter either. That's another common trouble spot.

Casey

[Subzilla]

AND after you check the glow plugs, think about changing the fuel filter if that hasn't been done in a while. I always try to replace mine before cold weather hits. Also, do you know for sure your block heater is working? Listen for the hissing in the driver's side fender well. Check for 25 ohms resistance through the heater amd check for continuity through the cord. As Casey said, it should start in most any temperature but it will cough and spit a little as it's waking up. Let us know what you find.

[sapper33]

Once I got the batteries charged up, and had it plugged in for 2 days (or so), it started quite nicely.

1st crank and she fired up, belched a bit bit of black smoke, then quite smoking faster than she normally does.

I think I do need to change my fuel filter though, as well as giving everything a good check up. The mileage has sucked on the past few tanks(~17), and with diesel hitting $1.15/liter...it sucks

[WeaselWerks]

Do you know which wattage heater you have? Up in the great white north there are 'low' and 'high' wattage versions. (I think 1000W for the high, iirc)

[allformike]

how can you tell which heater is the high or the low

[ccatlett1984]

the only part# the local guy can find is for a 600watt freeze plug heater.

the freeze plugs are 41mm (1 5/8")

[wallew]

A simple check of your fuel system is to hit it with a shot or two of stater fluid.

When mine's set for more than a few days, I KNOW my IP needs to be rebuilt, because it allows all the fuel to drain back to the tank. A rebuild would resovle that issue.

But I hit it with a count of three or four on the starter fluid, and BOOM, starts right up.

That's cycling the glow plugs ONCE and I live in Denver and it's been REALLY COLD lately. I used to subscribe to the 'cycle them three times' type of theory. But basically with my electric fuel pump (in addition to the regular fuel pump), turning it on for that long allows the fuel to travel up from the tank to the injection pump. And YEAH, she starts right up.

So, if you are having cold start issues, consider a hit or two of starter fluid. That should tell you volumes as to whether you are or are not getting fuel to the IP and from there to the cylinders.

Changing out the fuel filter IS an excellent idea. But you may want to try that shot of starter fluid. Which, by the way, was orginally manufactured for diesel engines. If this does make a difference, swap your fuel filter and consider a rebuild of your IP.

That WILL resolve most of the issue. Again, this is ONLY if it appears the rest of your starting system is in good shape. Glow plugs, controller, starter, batteries MUST be in good working order.

[ccatlett1984]

A simple check of your fuel system is to hit it with a shot or two of stater fluid.

When mine's set for more than a few days, I KNOW my IP needs to be rebuilt, because it allows all the fuel to drain back to the tank. A rebuild would resovle that issue.

But I hit it with a count of three or four on the starter fluid, and BOOM, starts right up.

That's cycling the glow plugs ONCE and I live in Denver and it's been REALLY COLD lately. I used to subscribe to the 'cycle them three times' type of theory. But basically with my electric fuel pump (in addition to the regular fuel pump), turning it on for that long allows the fuel to travel up from the tank to the injection pump. And YEAH, she starts right up.

So, if you are having cold start issues, consider a hit or two of starter fluid. That should tell you volumes as to whether you are or are not getting fuel to the IP and from there to the cylinders.

Changing out the fuel filter IS an excellent idea. But you may want to try that shot of starter fluid. Which, by the way, was orginally manufactured for diesel engines. If this does make a difference, swap your fuel filter and consider a rebuild of your IP.

That WILL resolve most of the issue. Again, this is ONLY if it appears the rest of your starting system is in good shape. Glow plugs, controller, starter, batteries MUST be in good working order.

BOOM is right, DONT EVER USE STARTING FLUID WITH WORKING GLOW PLUGS.

VERY BAD THINGS WILL HAPPEN. the gp's get hot enougth to ignite the starting fluid before it gets into the cylinder, you dont want that to happen. As a safe alternative, you can pick up a can of dry silicone spray. It is completely safe to use in a truck with working glow plugs.

[bigbossman26]

:eek: NO Starting fluid!!! That is if you want the engine to last. I have never used starting fluid in my 85 1/2 ton 6.2. As said in prev. posts, keep batteries clean and connections good and with a decent block heater I have always been able to start my truck. Even though it typically drops down to -30 deg Celcius here in Saskatchewan. Also be careful where you buy your fuel. Always buy from a busy station so you know that the fuel has been changed to winter diesel. Some slow stations will still be selling summer fuel which will not help you one bit. If anyone has ever had fuel gel on them they know what I mean by a PITA!! Starting fluid is never a good idea. Just my 2 cents.....

[moondoggie]

Good Day!


DO NOT USE STARTING FLUID (ETHER) UNLESS YOU ARE VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT YOUR PARTICULAR DIESEL!!!!!

Using ether on a glow plug diesel engine can be extremely hazardous to your engine's (& your wallet's) health. If you intend to try this, either completely disable the glow plug system, or be absolutely certain the glow plugs are cold & won't energize when you try this.

I will not argue the likelihood of engine damage - the price for being wrong on this is way too high. I only wish all to make an informed choice. I would never under any except the most dire circumstances shoot ether into any of my diesel trucks (see signature). There is no need to use ether: A 6.2 with working glow plug system, working frost plug heater plugged in for ≥ 3 hours, well-PMd battery connections, & intact fuel delivery system will start down to AT LEAST -30°F (-34°C) exactly like it does in the middle of summer; it will probably do so at colder temps too, this is just as cold as I've ever seen. Fix the truck, don't chance grenading it. :eek:

Flame me if you must; I would hope you'd take this in the spirit given - helping each other keep our junk running. ;)

Merry Christmas!

[Robyn]

I can't say enough about this
DONT USE Ma Startley in a glow engine EVER :eek::eek:
One can use some gasoline on a rag and hold it in front of the air cleaner inlet. NO WET Gasoline in the engine , just a little vapor.
Never try to hold a rag over the open manifold. Lest thee watch said rag dissapear into the chasm never to be see again in one piece. The dissapearance of said rag will be followed quickly by sour running and most probably a destruction of the little creature that resides under the hood of your pride and joy. :(

The best starting tips are to have a well maintained glow system as well as an IP in good order and injectors that are popping and spraying correctly ;)

Best

Robyn

[wallew]

I'm sorry you guys feel that way. Let's see. You are advising that an engine BUILT for compression ignition, with heat generated by FRICTION will be bad if you use starter fluid. So sorry.

But I'll take the advice of a buddy of mine who's the HEAD DIESEL MECHANIC for a national trucking company and HE RECOMMENDS IT.

Given he's ALSO GOT the same 6.2L in his Sub that's in my M1009, I think I'll follow the advice of a guy who is not only responsible for a FLEET of diesel trucks but has been doing diesels for a LOOONG TIME (35+ yrs).

USING GAS? Yeah, right. That's the same thing as using STARTER FLUID, if according to YOUR theories that a hot glow plug will set off the starter fluid. What exactly do you think hot glow plugs will do to a GAS MIXTURE?

And YEAH, BOOM, as in RFN it starts right up. By the time the engine has had a dozen revolutions, the truck is running perfectly.

So, go ahead. Keep grinding those starters. Keep cycling those glow plugs, especially during cold weather. Wear those batteries down unnecessarily. IGNORE THE ADVICE OF A PROFESSIONAL DIESEL MECHANIC. No skin off my nose.

This is the EXACT SAME ADVICE GIVEN TO PEOPLE WHO USE STARTER FLUID IN GAS ENGINES! OMG, you are going to BLOW UP your engine (spark plugs=flames in the cylinder). YEAH, RIGHT. The only bad result of using starter fluid in gas engines is it scours the walls of it's oil coating in an older engine.

Given that's NOT a problem with diesel fuel... you figure it out. You probably ALSO disagree with using ACETONE as a fuel additive. Which I've done in both gas and diesel engines FOR YEARS with nothing but positive results (higher mpg).

But don't listen to me (a person who has been doing this for quite some time), that's kewl. It's your truck, do what YOU think it right.

Me? I think I'll stick with the advice given to me by my diesel mechanic. And NOT wear down my starter, solenoid, glow plug controller, glow plugs and batteries. I think I'll HAVE MY TRUCK START RIGHT UP in weather that's BELOW ZERO, thank you very much.

I live in Denver, where lately, the thermometer on the porch says 12, but 'feels like' -2.

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

"I'll take the advice of a buddy of mine who's the HEAD DIESEL MECHANIC for a national trucking company and HE RECOMMENDS IT." Ask him how many of these have glow plugs and / or a 21.3:1 compression ratio.

"...heat generated by FRICTION..." If you're referring to what ignites the fuel, I thought it was the heat of the air being compressed.

If you'll re-read what I wrote, you'll find it includes using a frost plug heater. I actually only need ~ 2 hours to start in any weather I've encountered. My engines start like it's 70°F outside - a couple turns & they're running, a few more & they're running clean.

Do whatever you want, I never in any way told you or anyone else what to do. I would in fact use ether on my trucks, but I would only do it after disabling the glow plugs. In fact the need has never come up. I've never been anywhere I couldn't plug the frost plug heater in, & at home I even have a timer so I don't have to have it powered until 2 or 3 hours before I need the truck.

I didn't deserve the tone of your reply. I told you what I thought was sort of gospel knowledge about glow plug diesel engines. Maybe I was wrong, but I intended neither harm nor offense. You've convinced me that perhaps giving friendly advice isn't worth the effort. I wish you well & in fact hope my advice was wrong & you never have any difficulty because of how you've chosen to start your truck.



Blessings!
(signature in previous post)

[wallew]

Good Day!

"I'll take the advice of a buddy of mine who's the HEAD DIESEL MECHANIC for a national trucking company and HE RECOMMENDS IT." Ask him how many of these have glow plugs and / or a 21.3:1 compression ratio.

"...heat generated by FRICTION..." If you're referring to what ignites the fuel, I thought it was the heat of the air being compressed.


Blessings!
(signature in previous post)

For the FLEET TRUCKS, not many and if so they are so old they only run them when all their newer stuff is on the road. This is a trucking company that doesn't seem to 'throw away' a working vehicle. Use it daily? Nope. Throw it away when it still works? Nope. His PERSONAL VEHICLE (and a similar one his wife drives), YEPPIR. Both are Burbs with the 6.2L in them. One even has the Banks turbo system in it (his). I keep trying to convince him to paint his three color camo, but alas, so far no joy.

And uh... AIR COMPRESSED IS FRICTION... i know, i know, it's a hard concept to grasp, but even AIR COMPRESSED can produce friction. Don't want to believe that, that's kewl. Again, no skin off my nose.

Again, if you do not think FRICTION is involved, just compression, well that's kewl too.

Like I said, DON'T USE IT. Fine with me. But then again, I've been given tons of cr@p because I use K&N air filters in a deuce as well as every other vehicle we've owned. I also used Royal Purple and Prolong. And like I've said, I use acetone as a fuel additive. TO EVERY VEHICLE. Works great. A lot of people say these products do not work. Fine by me. They've kept me from walking when I blew a high speed impellor pump (plastic part) in a 700R4 tranny. My tranny guy asked who towed my truck to him. "None", was my reply. He didn't believe me. Just like you folks do not. Again, no skin off my nose. But that's what happened to ME. Not to YOU. Or to my TRANNY GUY. TO ME.

I've been doing this for years. No 'KABOOM' (as opposed to BOOM) while EVER using starter fluid. Plus, I ONLY use it for trouble shooting (like my IP needing a rebuild) or when the temp drops WAY below freezing. That DOES happen here occasionally during the winter time. Plus, I basically use it in my M1009 Blazer, which seems to get the most usage. Never an issue. And like I said, it's IP needs to be rebuilt. Once I do that, I probably won't even need the starter fluid. But if it's a SIMPLE fix, it's a SIMPLE FIX. Which is what using starter fluid is - FOR ME. Again, just reporting WHAT I DO. That's all.

Hey, I'm NOT telling YOU what to do. I'm just telling you WHAT I DO. That's all.

But, I've got a spare 6.2L engine, in the can. Ready to be dropped into either of the two vehicles I own that have them. So I guess that's WHY I'm not concerned. OH, that 6.2L 'in the can'? Cost me $150. So not a huge investment in that one either.

Just bought an M1031 for $2850. A buddy of mine who's coming up from Texas to Colorado for Xmas is bringing it to me. I can't wait to get it so I can start working on it. I ALWAYS replace the batteries (a pair of 6TL), tires (6 - 2 spares), fluids and THEN see where I sit. Oh, the M1031? Has 13,775 miles on it. I even CHECKED with one of the guys who used to drive it around the military base doing maintenance. He verified it was 'his' truck for more than six years. Said it worked great. Then the military decided they would contract that type of work out and he retired. OH WELL, as least I'm getting a nice truck out of the deal.

[Robyn]

The knowledge here with the fine folks that have answered this post, myself included are the best advice you are going to find.

I will go so far as to say that your diesel mechanic who is advising you to use starting fluid in the 6.2/6.5 engines is a very sorry lot indeed and needs to attend a refresher course.
The large Cats, Cummins, Detroits and such that do not have glow plugs are fine with a touch of ether on a cold day if need be.

The glow engines always come with a big sticker somwhere on the air filter system that says DO NOT USE STARTING AIDS (ETHER)

My 6.5 will happily start in cold weather with little more than a couple turns of the engine.
Now my glow system is in top shape as are the injectors and the IP.

I have started it in near zero temps with no problem.

Now my credentials are not as good as some but I am a Master Diesel technician and have been around 6.2/6.5 engines since they came out and the Olds diesels before them. I am well versed with Cat, Cummins and Detroits too. My college major was auto and diesel technology. Now I will admit that I recieved my degree back in 1970 but I have kept up with the times and things have not changed that much. :)


We offer help here to all but we certainly dont offer any information that will cause them or their engines harm.

If you wish to use your "mechanics" tips for cold starts, please feel free to do so but I suggest that it is not a great plan and please dont tell unsuspecting neophites that have recently purchased a diesel to do this as it is poor tech and will result in engine damage.


Best

Missy Robyn

[ccatlett1984]

now this is completely out of the scope of this topic and forum, but the reason you get yelled at for using a K&N filter in you deuce, is that they simply cant flow enough air for the engine. its like running with a dirty filter all the time. your getting less power and higher EGT's for the sake of a cheaper filter. the only correct one is the donaldson that the military uses, there is no civilian part that meets the specs.

[Robyn]

I will offer some observations here.

I have purchased a few rigs (GM diesels included ) that some PO had installed this type of filter.

The oiled element type filters always seem to pass more gritty materials than is even close to reasonable. :eek:

My DaHooooley had a oiled element type filter in the air box and it looked good bu there was far too much dirt passing the filter.
I went to a HD paper replacement without the foam cover. I personally would rather sacrifice a tiny bit of power and have my little creature breathing clean air. I run a lot on dusty roads in the summer so this is important to longevity of the engine and my pocketbook. :)


There are far better air filters than the stock paper units but I am not convinced that the little cone or drum type units that use an oiled element are the answer.

The class 8 trucks use 1 or 2 huge paper element type filters to flow the air for the big engines. The velocity through these filters is fairly low but the volume is up there due to the CID of the engines.

Restricted airflow on the 6.2/6.5 engines will certainly result in lost power and much higher EGT

Just some observations

[wallew]

[edited by DmaxMaverick]

[DmaxMaverick]

PLEASE....DO NOT bring a grudge match started on another website to this forum. It matters not what it's about or who is/was right or wrong. If you need technical data to help you with an argument, please ask for it. Odds are, we can help you, or provide information to support or refute the discussion.

Continue it on the originating website, off line or somewhere else. Just not here.

If you wish to counter points made in a post, please do so. Keep it on topic and counter the points made.

Here's some advice. Please feel free to ignore it if you don't agree, but don't argue the point or try to convince anyone otherwise on this forum. DO NOT USE ETHER OR STARTING FLUID IN AN IDI ENGINE. If you've done it successfully, put a feather in your cap, grin and keep it to yourself. More often than not, serious engine damage can and does occur.

[bigbossman26]

I think that the well meaning posters here are only trying to convey one message. That is with a properly adjusted IP and fully functioning glowplug system automatic or otherwise, decent winter fuel, clean filters and a functioning block heater, and charged batteries will not have the need to use starter fluid/other products. I personally would much rather have my truck start under it's own power and not with the aid of starting fluid. Much easier on the engine as a whole you must agree. Maybe a mod can initiate a poll thread to see how many members use starting fluid, etc. Please don't take posts to heart when members disagree with you. That is why we are all here, to learn from others and seek advice when we run into problems.

[moondoggie]

Good Day!
"DO NOT bring a grudge match started on another website to this forum." I was completely unaware of this being so. I can guess what other forum this may have come from, but I don't go there, so had no way to know this.

"...don't argue the point or try to convince anyone otherwise on this forum." I'd appreciate an email to my personal email address (which you [DmaxMaverick] either have or Jim can give you) if you feel I did. If members other than Dmax figure I stepped out of line, feel free to PM me, just don't be offended if I don't get around to replying for quite awhile - it's a good day when I get to sit down to lunch at my 'puter & check out my other family, the Page. :)

My concern was not at all with wallew - he can & will do whatever he wants. My concern was for the many newbies that might try ether based on his information.




Blessings!
(signature in previous post)

[Robyn]

I will say this.

I have on one ocasion had a rig that the batteries had gone down and we were going to get one shot at a start and the truck was out in the sticks on a winter hunting trip.
I sprayed some either on a red rag and held it a few inches in front of the air inlet (That we had opened up, also not a smart idea)
I had a helper glow and then crank the engine, it started up but barely and most likely would not have with the low batteries.

This was a very tedious startup and was done by someone who knew all well the consequences and took every precaution to avoid engine damage.

The rig ran fine and did not rattle hard when it started.
Doing this this way is a risk but if done correctly will not do harm.

I will not post this technique as being advisable or something that should be tried.
We were way out in the sticks and I for one did not want to walk out 10 miles.

The standard NO MA STARTLY is my only official advice and will remain so.

Also I generally dont talk smack about other mechanics but this forum and those who come here pride themselves on having good materials to offer all who ask for help.

I for one enjoy very much in helping others solve problems with their rigs and will give the very best advice that I can. If I know of a shortcut that will help and in doing so will do no harm I will share it with all.

I will however cut down any and all tech that can risk damage to an engine or a rig and or risk personal injury to the one doing the work or others in the area.
I take safety seriously and just dont cut corners, Nuff Said :)

Robyn

[DmaxMaverick]

Good Day!............

None of what I posted was directed toward your responses in any way. I deleted the content in question. I don't take pleasure in editing or moderating any posts. Quite the opposite. It has always been our policy to allow users to express their opinions and experiences, but sometimes this is outside the bounds and scope of this website. It is not personal in any way.

If anyone has a personal beef with any other user, we appreciate your keeping it off the forums. If there is a problem that needs addressing here, please bring it to our attention. Every issue gets personal attention. We have no "bots" working here.

[wallew]

Well, I do find it INTERESTING that you allow personal attacks AGAINST me, but delete my response.

That's ALL I NEED TO KNOW.

Feel free to delete my account. I vote by walking.

This is the same reason I left SS.

Good on ya, mate.

At least ONE PERSON had the honesty to admit they did what I've done for years and NO KABOOM.

Good luck. OH, and you know how you are all so anti K&N filters? Let me CLUE YOU IN. They're GOOD ENOUGH FOR MR. GALE BANKS. It's THE ONLY FREE FLOWING FILTER HE SELLS WITH HIS TURBO'S.

PERIOD. END OF STORY.

[WeaselWerks]

I found the package for the heater I picked up. Product code is 3100059, UPC is 0-64222-00729-2, part number is 30-3250-4 (i think that one is the part-store stock number)... If you search for the 3100059 number with 'heater' as terms in google, you can find some links, it IS indeed a 1000W heater. Depending on your location might determine if your parts places will stock it. I picked mine up from PartSource. If your hard pressed to find one (1kW) PM me, and we'll see if I can't send you one.

[WeaselWerks]

To answer another earlier question (back from page 1), I'm pretty sure it's cast into the heater what the wattage is... only other way I could think of is to measure the resistance of the elements at a given block temperature.... The lower the resistance, the higher the wattage :D

However:

I have no idea if these units are thermo-resistive.. that is, if they change their resistance as their temperature changes to maintain a constant heat level (temperature) rather than a constant power output.... If they are (thermo resistive) you'd have to compensate the resistance for the temperature of the element. I could provide some resistances for units at sub-freezing temperatures on request for the 1000w unit if necessary.

[Subzilla]

Bahh Humbug?!?

[arveetek]

The biggest problem with any starting aid, whether it be Ether, gasoline, etc, is that it can be ignited at the wrong time. A diesel is timed by injecting fuel at the precise moment. Unlike a gasoline engine where fuel and air is introduced at the bottom of a compression stroke, and then ignited by a spark, a diesel engine waits until the time is right to inject fuel, because as soon as there is enough heat to ignite the fuel, you have combustion.

What this means is that if fuel is sucked into the intake manifold, then there is fuel and air in the cumbustion chamber ready to be ignited as soon as there is enough heat. With glow plugs turned on, there is enough heat to ignite Ether, since it ignites at a much lower temperature than diesel fuel, which is how it helps to start the engine in cold weather.

Picture this scenario: you spray some Ether into the intake manifold, turn the key on and try to start the engine. One piston pulls in most of the Ether on the intake stroke, the glow plugs have created enough heat, and just as the piston starts up on compression, the fuel ignites way too soon, and tries to shove that piston back down the way it came. Ouch!

Not only can this cause internal engine damage, it could cause ring gear/starter damage, or even break the starter right off the block (it's happened).

Now, will using Ether one time ruin a 6.2L? Not likely. Will damage occur over prolonged use? Probably.

I've used Ether in my 6.2L before, and it's scary to hear it rattle when all that fuel ignites at the wrong time.

A person who is really smart about the 6.2L and the glow plug system can disable the glow plugs and hopefully the Ether won't ignite until the piston comes to TDC. But say a person unfamiliar with diesels who just bought his first 6.2L or 6.5L comes onto this site and asks about hard starting, and perhaps he's advised to use starting fluid. He goes out and tries to start the engine as normally while shooting a bunch of Ether into the intake, and then BOOM! There goes a bent rod or broken starter.

THAT'S why we advise never to use starting fluids.

Larger over the road diesel engines are built much stronger, and can handle the effects of starting fluid. In fact, some older diesels had Ether injecting systems installed from the factory.

As a general rule, don't use starting fluids on the 6.2L/6.5L engine.

Casey

[ccatlett1984]

To answer another earlier question (back from page 1), I'm pretty sure it's cast into the heater what the wattage is... only other way I could think of is to measure the resistance of the elements at a given block temperature.... The lower the resistance, the higher the wattage :D

However:

I have no idea if these units are thermo-resistive.. that is, if they change their resistance as their temperature changes to maintain a constant heat level (temperature) rather than a constant power output.... If they are (thermo resistive) you'd have to compensate the resistance for the temperature of the element. I could provide some resistances for units at sub-freezing temperatures on request for the 1000w unit if necessary.


the wattage is stamped into the heater itself. right ext to the plug that you connect the electric cord to. I live in michigan and they only stock the 600w.
I had to replace a dead heater, so i got it. As soon as i can find it, I'll be getting the 1000w. If only for the decreased time it needs to be on to warm the block.

[DmaxMaverick]

No need to replace a "good" heater. Just install another on the other side (frost plugs are all the same size). When it gets really cold, it will heat up in a hurry with both putting out.

[ccatlett1984]

banks kit installed, i dont think i can get to the freeze plugs on the passenger side. and then routing the cord away from the exhaust would be fun.

[DmaxMaverick]

Works just fine. Been there. Done that. I didn't say it would be simple, but it can be done and the end result is highly beneficial. It depends on how you align your priorities.

[warwagon]

the last 4 pages have been ALL THAT! i can see why ol' boy don't belong to the SS club , like he said , same thing happened over there! well, i'm real glad you guy's are there with a PRICELESS ammount of info, i love it!! missy R. is the GIRL!! i love it when she writes!!!! all of ya all are awesome, you too moonDoggie. Merry Christmas from Las Vegas [no ether required]

[GregCrabb]

Once, when I first got my truck in 2002, the local Chevy dealership changed my fuel filter for me...and I actually saw them spray ether into my truck's intake...I wasn't able to stop them, but was waiting for something to happen and I would have demanded a new engine because they didn't follow their own manufacturer's instructions...but it didn't hurt. I no longer go there. If I can't do it myself, it goes to the diesel shop I trust.

[john8662]

Wow, I'm skacking off a bit, I missed this whole conversation :confused: until today (read posting date) :rolleyes:

Thanks Greg for running the mop n' bucket! :cool:

But yeah, no glows, spray sparingly, get it runnin, then get the system fixed.

J