New 4.5L Duramax Suburban at SEMA

[More Power]

http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/photopost/data/500/medium/4-5L-DuramaxSuburbanSM.jpg

[JeepSJ]

Now that is just cruel. Pull that cover and show us the goods!!!

[DieselMonk]

makes me drool! :D

[Bill Voitel]

OK I will Bite...Is that the 4.5 V-6 made by International or did the General build one???

[More Power]

You can read more about the 4.5L here (http://www.thedieselpage.com/duramax/4-5lduramax.htm). :)

Jim

[Bill Voitel]

Kool!!!!!!!!!

[tanker]

I only wish GM had done this sooner. An 8-10 year span without a Diesel for the suburban.
I think we will see more Diesel's in the near future from all manufacturers, however will it offset the price differential between gasoline and Diesel fuel at the pump. Here in Pennsylvania, there is a .50 cents difference in those fuels at the pump.

[StrangeEngine]

You can read more about the 4.5L here (http://www.thedieselpage.com/duramax/4-5lduramax.htm). :)

Q4 2009?

Sh*t.

- Mark

[Dakster]

Awesome a proto-type is out. I might just have to go to the Autoshow this weekend and see it for myself. Hopefully GM brought one with them.

That's about when I will be ready to get into an SUV... Makes the H2 a possibility now as well. Guess I better start buying everything with the GM card as you know that vehicle will be $5-$6k more than a gasser.

BTW, Diesel fuel here is MORE expensive than super lately... You can't count the cost differential anymore, just the mileage differential. (Although I can still find BioDiesel for $2.99 - Regular d2 is $3.39 - $3.55)

[Mark Rinker]

Lets trust that they haven't forgotten the black eye they got with the 6.5 casting woes.

They have rebuilt major goodwill from 2001-2007 with the Isuzu/GM 6.6L Duramax. I'd hate to see the waters muddied relative to the Duramax name that they have built.

However, my bet is it will be a homerun engine for GM. I am excited to see this engine on the road!

[Kenneth]

What you can see of the motor, looks great. The compartment is so clean and simple looking. I'm sure though once the cover comes off, there is a mess of wires and hoses, etc. I am excited for the 1/2 ton diesels.


An 8-10 year span without a Diesel for the suburban.


I have to agree. that is way too long of a span. My grandpa used to own a 83 or so 6.2L 1/2 diesel pickup. Then in 94, he upgraded to a 3/4 6.5 TD. I certainly like the idea of having a 1/2 ton diesel. In my situation, i don't need a 3/4 ton diesel, all I use it for is daily driving and a little towing (boats, motorcycles, tool trailers, etc.) but mostly daily driving. I think a year or two after the 4.5 comes out, it's time for a new truck!

[DarylB]

I'd like to see the window sticker on a plain half-ton 2wd, SWB truck, 6 speed auto with the 4.5. Do you think it would push 30mpg?

[ToddMeister]

I'd like to see the window sticker on a plain half-ton 2wd, SWB truck, 6 speed auto with the 4.5. Do you think it would push 30mpg?

I think it could...

[More Power]

This is the new Chevrolet Suburban HD Z-71, equipped with the 4.5L Duramax Diesel. :)

http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/photopost/data/500/dmaxsuburban.jpg

Here's a close up of the hood emblem...

http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/photopost/data/500/dmaxsuburban02.jpg

Jim

[Dakster]

drool... slurp.. drool. drool....Wipe...

Looks *nice*. Can't wait to drive one. Another nice feature might be the fact I can go over 300 miles before filing up. My Denali XL had a 300 mile range if I wanted to push it the last mile to the gas station. I like the long bed truck I have for distance driving - over 500 mile range. Although the city range is closer to 400.

[StrangeEngine]

This is the new Chevrolet Suburban HD Z-71, equipped with the 4.5L Duramax Diesel.

I want.

- Mark

[avk199]

I just wish GM would sh*t or got off the pot on this one. When are they going to make these available to us ?

As for mileage, I don't think she will get 30MPG highway. The Jeep CRD 3.0 V-6 diesel gets 19 city 23 highway and its a smaller motor and a smaller lighter vehicle. I really hope I'm wrong though ! ;)

Diesel Power !

[EdHale]

I had a '98 Suburban 6.5 and originally planned on trading for another diesel Suburban in '02, but we all know that didn't happen. I finally gave up on GM and another diesel Suburban and you can see from my tag line what I ended up with. Now that I have had the Sierra for a year and a half, I'm glad I didn't get another Suburban. I really like the ability to throw something really nasty in the back and then just hose it out. I couldn't be happer. Ed

[gophergunner]

that suburban sure looks nice. I really hope this engine stands up for gm.

If it can perform as well as the 6.6 litre, I wouldn't be scared to get a nice new 1/2 ton:cool:

[JohnC]

...The Jeep CRD 3.0 V-6 diesel gets 19 city 23 highway and its a smaller motor and a smaller lighter vehicle.

I regularly break 22 highway with my '06, as long as I stay out of the mountains...

[Subzilla]

Sitting in my '83 Sub in the ice skating rink parking lot last night eating my supper of crackers before I go inside to watch the son's hockey practice, here comes a soccer mom with a brand, spanking new Suburban full of kids. I sit there and wonder if she even appreciates what she has as I envy and drool over how really cool the new Subs look. Throw in the diesel and whooaa - the ultimate vehicle for me. I really, really like the looks of that diesel Sub. It's got more of a ready-for-anything look than the previous body styles. The wheels, mirrors, and front end really make it stand out more. But don't get me wrong, I like older ones too and am currently looking at buying a '99 model in mint condition - diesel, of course. Just trying to justify buying another one and still hang on to my '83 and '86 Blazer and '93 baby Jimmy and....

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

Similar power (310 hp, 510 lb/ft torque) to the original DuraMax, ~ 2/3 the displacement - not bad. I hope they did the level of engineering they've exhibited on the 6.6, or better - it's the only way they can keep market share when the overseas companies attack these markets too. (No, I have no information about what if anything overseas outfits are up to, but look at the full-size pickups Toyota & Nissan are offering right now - you'd have to be nuts to think they're not eyeing other big vehicles too.)

(on edit) Take another look at More Power's 2 Nov 07 link - are those four "tubes" injection lines? If so, does this thing go back to some sort of semi-mechanical injection pump? I doubt it - the common-rail high-pressure injection appears to be a big part of the huge power increases we've seen, + helping them run cleaner. Just asking - seems kinda odd...

Blessings!

[jsmiracle]

I should be "needing" one of those (to tow the TT with the family) around 2009 or 2010.:)

Jim M.

[DieselDavy]

What is the latest news about the first model year that will offer the 4.5L Duramax? I was hoping 2009.... Any chance?
Dave

[Showgood1]

Do we know what tranny they are using yet? Or did I just miss it?

[Stlheadake]

I read through all the posts and I didn't see anything. Here is a youtube video about the 4.5l Duramax. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7J4wFwIXC7U It is very short, but does disclose one thing. GM reversed airflow in the engine and did away with the intake and exhaust manifolds.

Exhaust dumps straight out to the turbo on the INSIDE of the V. Intake is on the OUTSIDE of the V. GM claims this saves money on production and does away with unnecessary parts. No mention of the transmission though.

I like this engine!!! I can see one in my future!!

[D-max Man]

Here"s a little more info. on it

http://www.sae.org/automag/technewsletter/080108Tech/01.htm

[TurboDiverArt]

Anyone hear of any plans to put one of these in a Tahoe? That would be cool and probably get good mileage.

Art.

[TurboDiverArt]

Anybody hear more about putting this new engine into a truck for next year?

[Dakster]

I thought this was a 2010 engine? The 4.5L was at one point RUMORED to go into a 1500 pickup. That would be nice as not everyone needs an HD and that should get good MPG in a 1500 pickup.

The first one (auto manuf.) to put a diesel in a light duty truck wins.

Even better than a Tahoe, I wonder if the 4.5 will fit in an H2 or even better an H3.

[TurboDiverArt]

I thought this was a 2010 engine? The 4.5L was at one point RUMORED to go into a 1500 pickup. That would be nice as not everyone needs an HD and that should get good MPG in a 1500 pickup.

The first one (auto manuf.) to put a diesel in a light duty truck wins.

Even better than a Tahoe, I wonder if the 4.5 will fit in an H2 or even better an H3.

If you read the various threads on this subject they mention the H2. Supposedly it'll fit in any vehicle that first a small block V8, including cars. I thought I read the rumor to start in 2009 (late 2008 orders?), maybe I'm mistaken.

[Dakster]

I think are rumors are the same just some fuzzy math involved, 2009 as a 2010 model year... Again, time will tell although I doubt that many diesel vehicles will sell since diesel is more than gas. I know the extra MPG you get from diesel more than makes up for the cost spread, but it is psychological.

Funny how people think buying the diesel VW was a mistake. I tell them we get 2x the mileage as the gas volvo we had got, so diesel needs to be almost $8 gallon and gas remain the same price to BREAK EVEN....

Saying it will fit and actually doing it are two entirely different things in my book. It should fit in a H3 too! As a side note, I know many people that have put 350's in a Jeep Wrangler, but you don't see the factory adding that back to the line-up! That would mean the 4.5 would fit as well. (Sorry to cross breeds here, but its the best example I can think of)

[More Power]

The folks at GM who actually have the power to push a diesel SUV program have always been a little too timid when it comes to diesel. My instincts tell me the spread in fuel costs, a high overall fuel cost and a depressed SUV market may produce additional knee quivers... When GM didn't produce a diesel Suburban in 2001, 2002, 2003..... but indicated they were working on one (a couple of members here have actually driven the prototypes), I eventually went into the "I'll believe it when it happens" mode....

There was a time when GM was ready to begin production of a V-6 diesel based on the Duramax 6600 for their Suburban. They had already completed the development work and emissions certification, but were waiting for Ford to release their V-6 (Navistar) diesel to their SUV line. When the Ford/Nav V-6 program collapsed (Navistar had just built a new V-6 engine plant in Huntsville, AL), GM pulled back - not wanting to go it alone in the market.

Jim

[moondoggie]

Good Day!

My understanding was that they never sold that many diesel Subs anyway - MP, got any numbers? It'd be interesting to know the actual percentage of Subs sold with diesels during the years they did sell them; maybe I'm wrong.

Blessings!

[Robyn]

Even with the cost of diesel right through the roof the cost per mile to run a diesel (if it gets good mileage) is still less than the cost per mile to run most gas rigs unless they are the micro cracker cans that get umteen mpg.

GM would do well to get a nice SUV on the scene with a diesel that can produce some good mileage numbers.

Waiting for the competition seems a bit odd to me.

The Burb and the Tahoe/Yukon series would be a smash hit me thinks if they could offer them with the ability to get 20+ mpg

At the current price of diesel ($4.20 here) 20 MPG is about 21 cents a mile.

A gasser at $3.50 a gallon has got to get at least 17 to compare.

There are few full sized SUV's that can do this.

Our 94 Burb 6.5 is consistently getting 21 or so Hwy so the cost savings with the ability to drive a comfortable rig is definately there.

Later

Robyn

[More Power]

Good Day!

My understanding was that they never sold that many diesel Subs anyway - MP, got any numbers? It'd be interesting to know the actual percentage of Subs sold with diesels during the years they did sell them; maybe I'm wrong.

Blessings!

Roughly 11% of all subscribing members since 1997 have indicated they owned a diesel Suburban. This doesn't include the 80's & 90's Blazer/Tahoe or Jimmy/Yukon 2-door SUV lines.

Here's the primary reasons GM people have indicated in the past for not offering a new diesel SUV.

1- Cost differential between gas/diesel fuel.
2- Higher diesel engine option cost.
3- Uncertain buying public - will they embrace diesel or not.
4- For most of the past 8 years, GM has been able to sell all of the gas powered Suburbans they could produce. Sales dipped significantly after Katrina and have really dipped recently.
5- Gas engine technology has improved to a point that diminishes the diesel fuel economy advantage - especially since the new diesel emissions systems impact diesel fuel economy.
6- For the past 8 years, GM has been afraid of the upcoming diesel emissions laws. It's easy (comparatively so) to meet the emissions rules for the 8600+ GVW emissions. Light-duty emissions rules are (or have been) somewhat tougher.

My opinion is that enthusiasm for diesel is high at GM Powertrain and the engineering level, but 2-3 steps higher up the food chain that enthusiasm collapses. It's all about the beans, and those making the ultimate decisions are not diesel people. They love the Duramax, but that's where it ends.

I attended and spoke at a clean diesel forum in Washington DC in late 2005. Several dozen auto industry reps were in attendance. I urged them to push diesel SUV programs, and presented the numbers I had for diesel Suburban owners and related discussions here in TDP. Through the years, I've also had numerous discussions with GM people regarding diesel SUV's.

And finally, I've heard the comment many times over the past 8 years that GM would produce a diesel SUV when and only when Ford begins their diesel SUV program.

One of our members from AZ told me last year that he bought a custom Duramax Suburban conversion from a fellow in Ohio. On the drive back to AZ, he was offered $17,000 more than what he paid (about $50K) by a guy who followed him into a fuel station (saw the Duramax emblems on the Burb while on the Interstate). The AZ Dmax Burb owner didn't sell. He was excited to finally get what he really wanted.

GM is missing out big time. As was mentioned earlier..... "I'll believe it when I see it", regarding a release of a new diesel program for their SUV line.

Jim

[Dakster]

More Power - Unfortunately, for us diesel enthusiasts, I agree with you 100%.

I can't believe that GM will wait for the competition to bring out a diesel SUV before they will. Seems a little behind the time thinking to me...

Our Big three better think fast, as Chinese/Korean/Japanese car companies are going to take even more market share. Especially when/if Toyota puts the Hino (yanmar) diesel engine in a Tundra. I know several owners of American Diesel trucks that would go to a Toyota Diesel tomorrow.

[EdHale]

I had a 1998 Suburban diesel that I bought new in late 1997. I had to order it and the dealer tried every way you could imagine to talk me out of it. I drove it for 245,000 miles, bone stock and sold it to my son in law. He is still driving it with 270,000 on it now. I wanted another diesel suburban, but got tired of waiting. I dearly love my Sierra, but another diesel Suburban would be great. Ed

[Burgess]

346,000 on my '98 sub..........runs like a dream and will pull 18 per at 65 cruise. the goal is 500,000 and then we'll see...............b