Oil Filters

[1st DMAX]

Hi All first time user here. I have a question about oil filters. Can you use the Baldwin B7 2 quart filter without any problems? I have a 01 DMAX and thought the extra quart of oil would not hurt. Thanks in advance for any feedback

[jbplock]

Hi All first time user here. I have a question about oil filters. Can you use the Baldwin B7 2 quart filter without any problems? I have a 01 DMAX and thought the extra quart of oil would not hurt. Thanks in advance for any feedback

1st DMAX .. Welcome to the forum!


Short answer is no ... The Baldwin B7 (http://catalog.baldwinfilter.com/PartSpecification.asp?URL=PartEntry.asp&partnumber=B7) would fit but it doesn't have an Internal Bypass or an Anti DrainBack valve... The Duramax Oil Filters also have a higher Burst rating to with stand the high Dmax cold start oil pressures... I use the Baldwin B1441 (http://catalog.baldwinfilter.com/PartSpecification.asp?URL=PartEntry.asp&partnumber=B1441). It’s designed for the Duramax, is reasonably priced, and has very good specs: beta rating of 8 microns nominal and 24 microns absolute. If I didn't have an oil bypass filter I would probably use a Mobil-1 M1-303.. The AMSOIL EaO filters (http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/detail.aspx?ID=6926) also have very good performance. Whichever filter you choose make sure it’s designed for the Duramax and cross references to the OE AC PF2232. Compared to other Diesels the non EGR LB7 Duramax’s are also pretty easy on the oil so an extra capacity filter would probably not make a big difference. Another option would be to add an oil bypass filter.

Here’s a few related topics …

Mobil-1 Filter for the Duramax, M1-303 (http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/tdpforum/showthread.php?t=13562&)

GM Oil Filter Micron Rating? (http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/tdpforum/showthread.php?t=17473&highlight=B1441)

The forum search feature will turn up more oil filter discussion… Try a search for “B1441” or “PF2232”

:)

[Duramaster]

So now the real question.................. The AC DELCO PF-2232 is the replacement for the ORIGINAL black filter that comes with the engine which has an 8 digit GM P/N. Do you have the micron rating for that one? I will check my notes tomorrow (FRIDAY) and get the P/N for you. :o

[killerbee]

Hi All first time user here. I have a question about oil filters. Can you use the Baldwin B7 2 quart filter without any problems? I have a 01 DMAX and thought the extra quart of oil would not hurt. Thanks in advance for any feedback


This is such a good question. Especially considering you have an 01. Jbplock gives good guidance already.

Bypass: this is important for several reasons. The short of it is you want the motor to get oil flow as quickly as possible in cold starts or a filter malfunction. And typically for this a bypass is built-in to the housing that the element is mounted on. GM's original 01 design skipped this step. And it didn't take long for someone like yourself to come along and prove GM wrong: using a filter w/o a bypass, the motor was soon damaged due to oil starvation. So they redesigned the part, and included the bypass in the housing. Some 01's have a bypass and some do not. You can see it with a visual inspection.

The bypass that is spec'd on the housing, as well as the filter, is a medium pressure bypass, approx 15 psi. Without at least one bypass, you will likely blow the element out on a cold morning start. It is also stressful to the oil pump, which is seeing a higher load than normal.

Anti-drainback: not as important, but a good idea to have. It helps speed up rise to pressure, but is not essential IMO.

The term "full flow" filter is a misnomer. The spec's element does not flow full flow, except at idle after it is warmed up. Our oil flow rates are around 14-16 gpm at max rpm. So it is technically a bypass filter, maxing out at 8-10 gpm, 15 psi pressure drop. So you see, having redundant bypass protection is pretty important in my book. You risk all kinds of failures without it.

If you have the bypass on the housing, you can use the bigger filter, but if it fails, you will have no redundant protection, and you risk losing the motor. Obviously it is more important that the motor have oil flow, than constant filtration.

BTW, you get 2.5-3.0 extra quarts of oil with the TD-EOC.

[JohnC]

Anyone else want to take a shot at this? I've always believed that oil filters typically do not bypass under normal circumstances and the bypass is really ony there in case the filter gets clogged, in which case you've probably got bigger problems anyhow...

I have a lot of experience with aircraft engines that often use a screen in place of a filter. The screen, albiet not as fine a filter as a paper filter, has much less surface area and no bypass. We often use SAE 50 straight oil. The screen is designed to collapse if bypass is necessary. It simply doesn't happen.

[killerbee]

Put a plug in place of the spring bypass on the filter housing, then put a Fram element on that has no bypass. Run it up to 3000 rpm.

After you are done cleaning up the mess, inspect the inner can of the, now collapsed, filter.

Oh, just curious. Why do you think the aircraft doesn't use the same technology?

[JohnC]

Oh, just curious. Why do you think the aircraft doesn't use the same technology?

The new ones do.

The ones I was referring to were designed and certified 75 years ago. Full flow filters were not common back then. Certified modifications are available to replace the screen with a full flow filter. All you need is money.

If 90 psi of oil pressure with 50 wt oil won't collapse a 10 square inch screen I don't see how 15w-40 oil could do that to a modern day filter with more than 10 times the area (the Baldwin B1428 has 458 square inches of filter media), unless maybe if it was a Fram...

Running a cold engine up to 3000 RPM may not be a good idea, either, although most aircraft engines redline well below that anyhow.

[1st DMAX]

Thank you all for the response. I gues I better get that filter off my truck.
I have always used the B1441, AC or the luber-finer in the past. This last oil change I put the B7 on. I will get it off tomorrow.
I have been told the luber-finer brand of filters made by CHAMP LABS
are exceptional filters. Any comment on that?
Thanks again, I should have joined this forum long ago. There is some great stuff on here.

[killerbee]

Thank you all for the response. I gues I better get that filter off my truck.



I think you are ok, unless your truck does not have the built-in bypass.

[killerbee]

This shows the built-in bypass of the housing. if you have this, then you have a 15 psi bypass protection, regardless of the element. If you you pull off the hex nut on the upper right, there is a spring and a stopper.

[killerbee]

here is the front view. If you have this port (seen by removing the element) then you have bypass protection.

[jbplock]

Interesting ... Where is the bypass valve located? IIRC there is a small check valve on the inlet side of the plug shown in your first picture that is always open as soon as there is any (minimal) oil pressure. I used that plug (on the bottom of the oil cooler/filter mount assy) as a feed for my bypass filter.
http://thumb8.webshots.net/s/thumb1/0/56/42/65005642hlJEYv_th.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1065005642033933568hlJEYv) (click to enlarge)

Before selecting it, I removed the plug and hooked up an oil pressure gauge and determined that there is always pressure at that point.. So would the bypass valve be to the right of the plug in your picture (behind the plug in my picture)? .. looks like there is a second plug to access the valve??

[JohnC]

The pipe plug you are using is on the back side of the bypass. Normally, it is seeing filtered oil. When the differential pressure across the filter exceeds the bypass setting the plug seen in the picture moves back against spring pressure and uncovers the passage your line is connected to, providing a path between the unfiltered side and the filtered side.

Back to the aircraft world: Lycoming engines all use a filter without a bypass, and have a bypass built into the adapter. Continental uses all internal bypass filters and no bypass in the adapter.

[jbplock]

The pipe plug you are using is on the back side of the bypass. Normally, it is seeing filtered oil. When the differential pressure across the filter exceeds the bypass setting the plug seen in the picture moves back against spring pressure and uncovers the passage your line is connected to, providing a path between the unfiltered side and the filtered side..

I see .. makes sense .. Thanks

[killerbee]

If 90 psi of oil pressure with 50 wt oil won't collapse a 10 square inch screen I don't see how 15w-40 oil could do that to a modern day filter with more than 10 times the area

pressure differential defines collapse.

A screen and an 8 micron element cannot be compared for pressure differential by looking at them.

To answer my own question, screens were used because the aircraft oem general aviation industry doesn't care all that much about fine filtration. Mandated TBO comes normally much sooner than excessive wear from dirty oil. Dirty oil will never cause a catastrophic failure. On the other hand, a single element failure on a bonanza means ditching her on the highway, ironically in the breakdown lane if possible:D.

[Duramaster]

So..... Uhhhhhhhhhhh.............. Here is the P/N of the ORIGINAL oil filter (the black one).... 97214983. What is the micron rating on that one? :confused:

[JohnC]

...To answer my own question, screens were used because...

Screens were used because that's what everyone was using. Now they all have full flow filters, including Bonanzas.