Looking for your 2 cents

[Thumper Pilot]

Thought I'd ask the pros for an opinion on the value of a used truck I'm considering buying. I'd really appreciate anyone's input, I'm shopping for my first pickup and I know I want a used D/A.


'02 2500HD D/A, 59K, LS, 4spd auto, banks exhaust, power seats, priv glass, electro-mirror, forest green, spray-in liner, no 5th wheel pulling, did do trailer pulling as there's a brake module still installed, bald tires, cloth interior, not a GM Certified vehicle, sold as-is with no dealer-sponsored limited warranty. I have a friend that is a diesel mechanic, he drove it, went over the entire thing, put in on the rack, it's pristine. It apparently did have some sort of chip, etc. in it at one time as there is a piece of fuse cover cut away on driver side, looks like to run wires.

I'm looking for anyone that would like to offer their 2 cents on what's a reasonable price for this truck? The salesman started writing the purchase order as soon as I got back with the truck from my mechanic. The number he put on it.... $34,900. I nearly spewed a mouthful of water all over the desk!

Edmunds and KBB, NADA are way way different, by about $6k on the retail value, with edmunds being at around $20K. I know KBB is offering "suggested retail pricing", not based on actual sales prices like Edmunds, but $6k? We know which number the dealers will use.... ;)

Thanks in advance for your opinions!

[NutNbutGMC]

Here's my $0.02. Not to offend anyone here. It's my experience and please do a further search here to confirm.

The 2002 model has the LB7 engine (a numerical 1 in the 8th digit from the left, of the VIN). That constitutes an inherent problem of faulty fuel injecters that have often been known for partial or complete failure.

I have the 2002 (for about two more days because of this very reason, I am getting a 2007 LBZ) and I am on my third set of injectors. I cannot recommend any LB7 engine. Like I said, read here about fuel injectors in the LB7.

Run away from the LB7 engine, all of which the 2001 and 2002 models have.

US$34,000 is ridiculous for anyone but he and the sucker that will pay it.

Like I said, run away from the LB7 and the $34K... I do not want to see anyone have to deal with what I have had to with this problem. Even if the truck was free, leave it sitting.

Please feel free to PM me if you have any further questions on my experiences (I had a 2001 also). I ask for the PM so that I do not seem to be trashing out the LB7 in an offensive way. I just call it like I see it.

Your mechanic friend is not aware of this issue (apparently). The issues is so dominate in the LB7 Owners' world, GM extended the warranty (for original owners) to 7 years and 200,000 miles (I think, or there abouts) to cover this issue and hush the folks like me. ANd that is for the injectors only, IF (I stress IF) you can get them.

[Dakster]

Ummm... They want $6k OVER RETAIL on KBB? Yikes! You'll be lucky on trade int o get close to KBB Trade-In value.

You're looking at a $12k hit right off the bat... While I do not have any expereince with the 2001-2002 motors, it does seem like people here have to change them way too often and much more than any other year(s).

I agree, I would stay away from that one. I won't even get into the module running issues that you will have to deal with.

[alteredspeed]

I my self would not be too scared of the LB7 engine. The new injectors gm has seem to be good as long as the sleeves have also been replaced. That is the olny major thing ive seen becides one turbo failure thats it I work in a good size dealer ship and olny one turbo failure.While the LBZ is a better engine the LB7 is quite a decent engine. Price for the truck a little higggggghhh

[Thumper Pilot]

Yep, I am aware of the injector issues that I believe were fixed in the '04 models (I say that because the 7-yr/200K GM warranty covers '01-'03 models, so I assume that they fixed the issue for '04)? My diesel-mechanic friend has an '03 and he is aware of the injector issues, but as far as how the truck looked from what you can see when driving/inspecting/putting on the rack, etc. it was good. No signs of wrecks, no leaks, 4WD working fine, etc.

Yes, $35K is ridiculous and it was $8K more than what was in their advertisement for the truck! The salesman is a tool and he thought I was a sucka. Their asking price is over $26K, for a 5-yr old truck, and they're offering no warranty at all. This says to me they are afraid of a 'diesel problem', even though they just can't stop talking about how low the miles are and how it's just broken in. I bet if it were a gas truck they would offer some sort of warranty, like 3mo/3k miles.

[NutNbutGMC]

Risk acceptance. To each their own.

You'll find out when it happens. I say go for it....

LB7

.
http://img179.imagevenue.com/loc25/th_74868_IMG_0544_122_25lo.JPG (http://img179.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=74868_IMG_0544_122_25lo.JPG)Click to enlarge.

It's a Jimmy Crack Corn thing to me.

[Dakster]

IF you decide to get it.

You could always buy an aftermarket warranty - don't know what it would be for your truck, but I would guess around $1500 for a bumper to bumper type warranty with the usual parts exclusions (brakes, belts, hoses, etc...) and would cover you until 100k miles and probably another two years. This way you minimize some of your risk. Then try to get the dealer down enough to be able to afford it.

[jbplock]

Regarding LB7's, aside from injector issues there are some benefits .. i.e no CAT or EGR (assuming it's not a California truck)

:)

[Shed]

My 01' LB7 has been a work horse. I know it has that one big injector issue, but I still love that truck! I bought mine used alos and had knew nothing about the injector problems at that time. I found out that she had all 8 replaced shortly before I bought her. See if you can pull a history or have the dealer do it for you.

As for the price.... Are you kidding me?!?!?!? I don't care what's on it 30k$ for a 5 year old truck?!?!?! Unless it's got 20k miles I would keep shopping! There is always another truck and always another good deal to be found, it may take some time but they are out there! I paid $20,500 for my 01' ext. cab with 66Kmiles. And they threw in a spray in bedliner and bug shield. Plus they put on brand new tires before i bought it! Do not buy that truck for that price!!! What was the previous owner doing with all the mods on it? See what you can find out about that. History of a truck can be critical. Good luck! Shed:D

[torque]

I sold my '02 SLT Ext cab 4X4 in Feb for $23K. It had 61K miles, new tires (incl spare) that I took off my '07 LBZ, an Edge chip (not installed), Line-x bed, 5th wheel hitch, Amzoil air filter, Fumoto oil drain valve, and a 45 gal. Transferflow tank. I priced it according to the Consumer Reports recommendations you can order from them. I'd say you shouldn't pay more than $20K -max.
I never had any issues with my injectors. In fact, GM extended the warranty on the injectors to 200K miles or 6 (?) years.

[Screefer]

I bought my 02 in March 07 for 27000 CDN. It had 70000 km. (45000) miles. Mint Condition. 3 month GM warranty. Boxliner, running boards, canopy, new tires. Get a history report from Carfax.com it reports any accidents, all GMC repairs or servicing. I think it was $20.
Then if you have no trade offer them 25 or keep looking. Theres lots of trucks out there.:)
I wouldnt worry about injectors or LB7. They're a warranty item.

[lb7lbz]

$34900 is way too high for that truck, i just bought a 06 gmc crewcab diesel slt model with 13000 miles for $35000, as far as lb7's go i got one with almost 200000 miles on it 1 set of injectors at 100k under warranty tows 7000lbs everyday a great truck good luck looking for a truck

[Thumper Pilot]

Hey all - thanks for the replies and advice.

That $34.9K number was just to see if I'd pay it - this shows the "morals" of the salesman. There's no way on earth I'd pay that for an '02, regardless of mileage. The problem to me seems to be finding out what they're worth. KBB and NADA show way higher numbers than edmunds, but, edmunds numbers are based on actual vehicle sales - which is the important thing to the consumer. KBB's numbers are "suggested retail price". They showed me the KBB price and are trying to tell me that's what its worth, but it's not 'worth' that, that's just what the good 'ol boy network of dealer's buddies at the KBB say it should retail at.

I haven't bought a used car in awhile, but I don't recall last time there being such a huge difference in values between KBB and Edmunds.

Edmunds says it's worth $20K retail, nearly $21K if it is Certified. They told me their bottom line price was $25K and then basically told me to have a nice day and thanked me for coming in. No negotiations, nothing. Just 'get out' (they were apparently reeling from my ~$19K offer).

I really like the truck and would be willing to make another offer on it, but they didn't even give me the chance. I think in a couple weeks, as the truck starts approaching the 45-days-on-the-lot mark, they'll have to reconsider their price to avoid having to deal with sending it to auction.

I'm Ok with the injector issue. I know it's there and could come up. I'd have about 18-20 months left on the GM 7yr/100K warranty on them so hopefully if they'd go it'd be during that time. Like someone said earlier, for all I know they have all been replaced already. I would check the carfax and hopefully get a GM service dept to pull anything they had on the VIN.

Thanks again everyone for all your input, I really do appreciate it!

[Dakster]

It sounds like typical dealer BS to me. They want to make 6k-8k on selling the truck and until they do it will sit.

The "true" wholesale value of cars is actually in something called the black book, which shows what the dealers are paying at Auction, it is updated every 2 weeks and unless you are a dealer you can't get it. Although, I've had several buddies give me their "old" copies when the new one comes in.

Good luck....