broken bolt extraction

[derekja]

Hmm, in taking off my exhaust manifolds I managed to break a bolt. I've got it off, but I need to get the old bolt out and re-tap the hole before I can put it back on again. I first tried lots of penetrating oil and a screw extractor to get the old bolt out, but it broke pretty quickly leaving a nice chunk of hardened tool steel in the center of the bolt.

I'm now breaking or dulling drill bits like crazy trying to drill through the thing.

I don't want to have to break down and try and find a new manifold, but I may be reduced to that soon. Any suggestions?

Thanks.

[DickWells]

Hi: I'm assuming that you don't have even a smidgin of bolt sticking out, right? That's the worst case scenario. What confuses me, right now, is why you say that you may have to buy a new manifold. I don't see why you can't just remove all the other bolts, and move the manifold away.
Anyway, I've been in this kind of situation, myself, from time to time. I've always had access to an arc welder though. If you have access, then maybe you can weld on a nut to the end of the bolt. Again, depends on whether or not you have some bolt to work with. If you can weld something on there, then two things happen. First, you now have a nut to put a socket on, and turn the bolt out. Second, you've heated the Dickens out of the bolt. The expansion of the hot bolt will displace the bad stuff around the threads and after it cools, the thing will be free to turn out a lot easier. Might want to use cold water on it to speed the cooling.

Assuming you don't have anything sticking up to weld to, try smashing the easy-out with a punch. The easy-out is pretty brittle, and SOMETIMES it's possible to use a small punch, and break out enough pieces to get a drill down in there to drill the bolt out and re-tap. You MIGHT be able to drill out the easy-out with a carbide drill. A $15-$20 drill! I've been better at busting carbide drills than anyone I know, though.
Here's a good hint, to be used before you put a lot of torque on a bolt, initially. Swat it straight on with short, sharp blows with a fairly light hammer, or drift punch and hammer. Amazing how that will jar tight threads loose! Sorry that it's too late for that. BTW, it's not too late, if you have a way of getting a grip on that bolt, after you swat it.
IF you can heat it some way, quench it with cold water, immediately. You might just loosen it up enough with that process, to allow you to cut a slot in the end of the bolt with a die grinder and abbrasive cutting wheel, then just turn it out with a flat srewdriver. I've done this many times in the gun business. Need to heat it quite hot, (prefferably a little red), then quench it well. Use enough water to pull the temperature down quickly. Surprising how well this works. Works much better than just heating a bolt, no matter how hot you get it.
These are all I can think of at the moment. If anything else comes to mind, I'll post it here. Others may have even better ideas. Keep trying, and good luck.
Dick Wells:)

[Robyn]

OK

Warm the manifold up reeeeeeely hot around that old bolt tap the manifold flange with a small ball peen hammer all around the bolt.

Now find a steel nut that will just fit around the broken bolt, center it up and weld it with a wire welder to the broken bolt.
Let cool and then put a wrenchon the new head you just grafted on.
If this does not work you are faced with using the torch and blowing the steel out.
Oxyacetalene torch will not burn caqst iron readily but the bolt will go away fast.

Run a tap back through the hole/holes and go again with all new bolts and Use never seaze when you put them back in.

[robertb6963]

Very easy to blow through with a torch w/o hurting the cast, seen my dad it before, but i've never tried it. Good luck!!!!

[dieseldummy]

OK

.
If this does not work you are faced with using the torch and blowing the steel out.
Oxyacetalene torch will not burn caqst iron readily but the bolt will go away fast.

Run a tap back through the hole/holes and go again with all new bolts and Use never seaze when you put them back in.

This is the easiest usually. I've got a 6.2 manifold to do this way tommorrow. IMO the best way to use an easy out is throw it in the trash as fast as you can... It seems like everytime I've used one it has made the situation worse. I've use the torch method on many an antique tractor and never had a bad result.

[derekja]

great thoughts. Thank you!

I'm not hopeful about the welding a new bolt head on approaches, both because of my welding inexperience and because I've managed with the drill to nibble away anything I might possibly have gotten a purchase on.

I'm going to try the punch to break out the easy out first, which would put me back in familiar drill and tap territory. Failing that, I guess I've been looking for an excuse to get a decent torch.

I'd much rather buy a tool than a part.

Appreciate all the help...

--Derek

[GSE2SCHMIDT]

You could take the manifold to someone you trust to do the torch thing.

I had to get a broken starter bolt with 2 easy outs stuck in it up in the block while in the truck.....scary I can blow torch scrap OK with an oxy/act torch set....but I didn't have the guts to just go for it like my buddy did. It aint a propane or map gas torch set you need....you need the big guns

It was amazing the bolt melted out like hot wax with the chunck of the tap still solid in the puddle on the floor...amazing the right stuff melted and nothing else

[Robyn]

The weld method uses a nut of slightly larger size and you stick the wire welder nozzle right in the center of the nut and squirt it full while holding the nut tight to the manifold.

OBTW I dont recommend puting any water on a hot piece of cast iron.
This can cause results that you are not going to want to deal with. ;0(

[GSE2SCHMIDT]

Yeah my Grandma threw a cast iron pan in the snow that caught on fire in the house and the thing almost folded itself in half, didn't return back to it's shape after cooling either.

[darkroad]

Another trick I use to use in my auto machine shop was to heat area until med cherry red and quickly touch a piece of gulf wax to the threads, it will smoke and maybe flare up a bit but it will pull the wax up the threads and let the remaining part of the bolt come out easier. Learned it from an old used shop equipment salesman. You can try this and then weld a nut onto whats left, you may be amazed that most of the weld won't stick to the cast metal, so if it is a little wways down the hole most of the time you can still get it out. I did many head this way for mechanics that could not get it themselves.

good luck

Darkroad

[derekja]

Wow, was that ever a pain!

I really appreciate all the help. I stood in the hardware store debating the purchase of an oxy-acetalene torch, but decided that I needed to fight with it a bit more before spending $300. I think the wire feed welder is probably a better first welding purchase than the torch anyway, I may get that when I come to my exhaust mounts.

I banged away at it with a punch. I couldn't get the piece of easy out out of the hole initially, but I got it pushed to one side enough to get a 1/8th inch bit down beside it. After ruining 3 of those there was enough room beside it to wedge a small center punch next to the offending piece of tool steel and try to pry it out. Of course, the punch broke, but fortunately the broken piece didn't stay in there (yup, don't pry on punches - good impact strength, horrible tensile strength.) I ground down an old nail to wedge behind the piece of tool steel and eventually banged it loose.

Then it was just a comparatively simple drill and tap. Looks a bit ugly near the surface, but I have plenty of usable threads left.

I like the wax trick! If I run into this again I'll have to try that.

[HammerWerf]

Derekla,

While you were drilling the bolt carcus, were you using a right twist or left twist drill ? There was very little discription of the initial drill out.

I've broken off a couple of starter bolts. It took me a while to find one, but I bought a left twist drill bit. When I pressed the tip to the bolt, put the drill in reverse, and backed the bolt right out.

Just a thought, late in the game. Glad you got the carcus out.

HammerWerf

[derekja]

Hey, that makes a lot of sense! I hadn't even thought that I could perhaps of found a left twist drill bit. I know that's something the local hardware store doesn't carry or I would have noticed it, though. Thanks for the thought.

[oilburnertoo]

Derekla,



I've broken off a couple of starter bolts. It took me a while to find one, but I bought a left twist drill bit. When I pressed the tip to the bolt, put the drill in reverse, and backed the bolt right out.


HammerWerf

That works great for starter bolts, but a bolt that is rusted in place such as an exhaust manifold bolt its a bit tougher to get out with a left handed bit. Best way is to center punch the remains exactly on center and start with a small bit like a 1/16" - 1/8" and get a hole drilled all the way through the center of the broken bolt, then progressively drill it out larger till you reach the size required for the tap that you will rethread the hole with. The key is to have patience and go slow, don't rush the job, and use a cutting oil while drilling and tapping and don't get the bit too hot. Glad you got it out.

[JohnC]

Next time, get the wire feed welder. Start welding on the broken end of the bolt. Neatness doesn't count, just don't weld the bolt to the casting. When you've welded enough on to grab with vice grips, do so and unscrew the bolt. The heat from the welding will be plenty to break it free.

Don't have a clue why they call them "easy outs".