Looking at a 99 Suburban 2500

[BrentN]

Hey Guys,
First posting for me. Have been watching posts for the last 6months in prep for buying a diesel burb. I have a 93 Suburb 1500 (5.7 gas with 230,000 miles). I tow a 4000lb (dry) travel trailer. My gasser does well towing (from Salem, OR to Los Angeles) from a power perspective, it just happens to chug through the fuel...6.5 to 7.2mpg) and gets 14.5mpg hiway empty.

From what I have gleened from the posts, depending on the gearing (and my speed) of course, I could see a 3-6mpg improvement while towing and similar results in the empty hiway driving with the 6.5TD.

I would love a duramax..but no suburban option..I have a family of 6 and dont really want to have to get quad cab pickup...we'd be cramped on long road trips...I love the suburban for that.

Have found a 99 2500 4wd, fully optioned (leather, tow package,etc) It has 90,000 miles (which by itself I think is good ..less than 120,000 in case there is IP issues).

They are asking $16,900 for it which is well in my price range and I think it to be a fair deal.

From what I understand, the 99 had better power #'s than the earlier 6.5's

I would like any thoughts or comments, pitfalls to look at when I go take a look at this truck..Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Brent

[dieselrealtor]

Sounds like a fair deal, I bought a 97 GMC SLT k2500, leather, push button 4x4 & all the goodies & was thrilled to get it for $12,000. In fact, I drove about 120 miles at the drop of a hat when it showed up in my morning ad search. With the 99s I believe they have the heated leather & possibly the memory seats (not sure on that one).

They do have more power, there are currently some ongoing threads on that issue right now.

I have been getting right at 14.9 mpg mostly town driving empty. I have yet to tow any distance with it. I expect that I may get as high as 18 on the highway empty. fyi, I have also been running the diesel kleen (sp?) every tank save one.

It has been great, we recently had company from California, our 3 kids & their 3 kids all piled into our 8 passenger (anchored 2 child seats to the floor anchors in the cargo area & away we went, all 10 of us.

I posted a help just after I bought it & received a great deal of excellent advice "just bought 97 suburban, now what, help"

or something very close to that, you may want to look it up & take a gander. :D

good luck

[MJEasly]

Chances are very good that it will have the updated engine block, which I think is important if you hang out here too long and catch the more power bug.

[catmandoo]

if you dig thru the older posts yes they do have more power,and that sounds like a great price,there was a dealer about an hour from me that had one about 2 months ago,with 70,000 miles it went for 21,500.i have a 94 1500 gasser 4x4 and i can pull 18mpg empty doing 65.my 94 2500 6.5 turbo 2wd with 4.10 will do 20mpg, ,the only thing i don't like is the leather seats,always sliding off of em and man do your shirts get soaked and stick to ya.otherwise diesel suburbans rule,i totally love mine and if the little woman didn't have to have the 4 wheel drive for winter the gasser would be gone in a heartbeat.

[Jon P.]

Originally posted by BrentN:
Hey Guys,

Have found a 99 2500 4wd, fully optioned (leather, tow package,etc) It has 90,000 miles (which by itself I think is good ..less than 120,000 in case there is IP issues).

They are asking $16,900 for it which is well in my price range and I think it to be a fair deal.

From what I understand, the 99 had better power #'s than the earlier 6.5's

I would like any thoughts or comments, pitfalls to look at when I go take a look at this truck..Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Brent Brent -- it sounds like a good deal. I bought my 99 2500 in August 02 for over 20K (55,000 miles). I've had several issues, but they are common to Suburbans in general and the 6.5 in particular:

1. Lost an alternator due to the bad battery terminals/battery cable -- replaced under the extended warranty I bought.

2. Had the seeping oil cooler lines replaced under the extended warranty I bought.

3. Brakes are terrible, but they're no better in your current Sub, so you won't be surprised. There is a brake TSB for the 2500s that involves changing the proportioning valve -- if this is at a GM dealer, insist that they do the TSB before you buy it (the dealer I bought from did this with no complaint).

4. I got a new IP at about 75,000 miles -- it just started stalling one day and then began stalling worse over the next week. Again, dealer replaced under the GM warranty with no questions.

5. Finally, the rear AC hoses corroded, and I had those replaced (under extended warranty).

This was my first Sub, and I really wanted a diesel. I really like taking it on long trips. It rides much harsher/stiffer than a 1500 (my in-laws have one of those), but on smooth roads, it's fine. Also, with your whole family aboard, it wil smooth out the ride a bit. I replaced the factory shocks with Edelbrocks and added Hotchkis front and rear sway bars, so it's very flat in the curves.

I've towed a horse trailer (about 5,500 lbs loaded with one horse) with it a couple of times. It does OK, but I've also got a '99 F-350 Superduty Powerstroke that tows the same trailer like it's not there. The brakes on the Ford are much better, but stopping the trailer when I'm towing with the Sub isn't too bad since the trailer brakes work well. It should do just fine with 4000 lbs, although you won't win any races.

Milage isn't great (high teens, typically), but I've got the 4.10 rear end, so at 70 mph, the engine is doing more than 2500 rpm. I've never driven an earlier diesel Sub, so I can't compare it to anything earlier, but I think it's got more "seat of the pants" power than my in-law's 5.7 liter gasser 1500. Some of that is a result of the 4.10 gears.

Obviously, the interior space can't be beat, and I really like the way the Subs look.

The price sounds very good. As you've probably figured out from this board, many of the problems with the diesel Sub are not unique to the diesel (like brakes, electrical, rear AC lines, etc.) Just remember that the 6.5 will never be anywhere as strong or as bulletproof as a Powerstroke or Cummins. Properly cared for, it should be just fine.

I'd recommend investing in a set of gauges, or at least a transmission temperature gauge. The transmission runs about 180 - 190 in the summer with no trailer -- much hotter than the transmission in my Powerstroke under the same conditions, and with a load, I think it would be easier to overheat.

[Perry]

If everything checks out, it sounds like a great deal. I paid just under $40k for mine back in 99, it seemed like a good deal back then at $500 over invoice. I'm amazed how poorly these Sub's hold their value. My old 89 didn't depreciate this fast.

If you are buying it from a private party, it wouldn't hurt to have a buyers inspection done, or if they could produce a pile of receipts. I've gone though two sets of oil cooler lines, brakes every 15k miles, corroded battery cable end, mysterious coolant leak which stopped by itself, passenger side glow plugs and lift pump. Otherwise, it has been a pretty reliable truck, with the battery cable connector incident the only time a tow truck was required.

[Basshopper]

Hi Brent: That sounds like a great deal. You cannot get a newer 6.5T Sub than the 99. I got mine new and other than some upgrades like exhaust, JK boost controller ete ete totally happy with the towing power and fuel economy I get. Would like a D Max also but no Sub so I will wait until. Good luck

[BrentN]

Hey all,
Thanks for the advice and comments. I totally agree with the "issues" that burbs in general have, but nothing is insurmountable. At least with this forum and the Chevy Talk Forum that I hang in for my current burban there is a wealth of information and very helpful people.

I do like the 99, with it being the newest diesel suburban one can get...I still dont understand why GM hasnt gotten on the stick and Duramaxed the Suburbans...I think they are dropping the ball on this one.

Is the IP the only item that is on the 10y/120,000mile warranty or is the entire engine?

Even if the engine goes totally south in a few years, replacement engines arent horribly priced.

I think you guys are right, I most likely will get the performance bug (within reason) once I purchase this puppy. New gauges, Chips, filters, maybe an intercooler down the road.

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice.

Brent

[BrentN]

Update:
Went and drove the Suburban yesterday. Started and ran out well. No smoke at all.

They are willing to come down on their price a little more.

Now here is the sweet part of the deal:
The engine..has a fresh GM Goodwrench Sticker on the Left Bank Valve Cover. The selling dealer said they werent able to get any info as to what is the deal with the engine. I called my local chevy dealer, gave them the vin: Engine was replaced @ 83,900 miles (it has 90k on the odo now), this was done in February O4. Engine has 6000 miles on it, plus shouldnt that be a really new block too?

Apparently back in '02 it had a new IP.

I plan on going back tonight and completing the transaction...I just am going to neglect telling the selling lot what I learned, or they might not be so soft on their price!!!

When I talked to the chevy dealer, he also confirmed that the engine will have a 3y/50k warranty on it too.

I will update after I drive home. It also looks like it has a 4:10 rear end based on some rough calcs...1700rpm=55mph. For what I need to tow I might be wanting to stick 3.73's in there, or maybe even 3.42's

[Shuck]

Brent,

That's exactly the deal I got when I picked up my 99 2 years ago. Engine had been replaced 5k miles prior to sale. Turned out to be a pretty good deal. Truck now has 112k miles on it, but only 48k on the engine. Can't beat that. I've had plenty of troubles with other parts of the truck, but the engine hasn't been the source of them.

Do check to make sure the engine swap was done well. Mine hadn't been done very well and I ended up having to get some seals and wiring replaced (under warranty) because the dealer who put the engine in did a ****-poor job.

Good luck!

PS. My 99 K2500 TD is always for sale for the right price ;)

[catmandoo]

well i have good news and bad news first the good my 2500 sub has the 4.10's and it turns just over 2000 at 55,so you should have the 3.73,now the bad ,thats as high a gear as they put in the floaters,to get the 3:42 you have to drop to the 1500 series rear end,evidently the 10 1/2 ring prevents going that high,and believe me i have been looking high and low for a 1500 rear end,but it has to be from a diesel sub,as the gassers have 5 bolt axles,not 8,the easiest way to check is pull the wheel cover off and see if the axle is bolted in,if so you have the big rear end. i think some days i want the 3:42 then others i think if someday i want to pull a camper the 4:10 will work better.

[Andy Chesek]

catmandoo,

Ever look into GearVendor's underdrive/overdrive setup? It sounds like several members here have them, and enjoy lower rpm's at highwar speed and an increase in fuel moleage.

[catmandoo]

yes i have but for the cost savings in fuel i'd have to drive about 150,000 miles to break even,unless i could find a used one,i don't think the cost is justified,i would love to have one though.i'd really like one on my 92 pickup it's a n/a 6.5 with a banks,5spd and 3:08 gears,i've got a best of 27.3mpg and would like to top 30 mpg,and think that would be the best bet at getting there.but i just can't justify the cost on this either.my 82 sub 6.2 3/4 has a doug nash overdrive behind the th400 and it works great,it gets about 22 mpg so i know the advantage of em.

[jspringator]

If it has the new block, that would be a sweet deal.

[JohnC]

Originally posted by catmandoo:
now the bad ,thats as high a gear as they put in the floaters,to get the 3:42 you have to drop to the 1500 series rear end Not true!

My '93 has a 3.42 FF rear. 72 mph @ 2000 RPM (5 speed)

[DA BIG ONE]

Originally posted by catmandoo:
well i have good news and bad news first the good my 2500 sub has the 4.10's and it turns just over 2000 at 55,so you should have the 3.73,now the bad ,thats as high a gear as they put in the floaters,to get the 3:42 you have to drop to the 1500 series rear end,evidently the 10 1/2 ring prevents going that high,and believe me i have been looking high and low for a 1500 rear end,but it has to be from a diesel sub,as the gassers have 5 bolt axles,not 8,the easiest way to check is pull the wheel cover off and see if the axle is bolted in,if so you have the big rear end. i think some days i want the 3:42 then others i think if someday i want to pull a camper the 4:10 will work better. Actually, the 14 bolt full floater with its 4.10's will take 3.42's on the same carrier. I had mine done about 4 months ago front and back, the best investment yet on this great machine.

I had to hack the factory VSSB unit because none of the aftermarket units to calibrate it would work (I tried them all) because of the 3 speed sensors on my t-case

Limit your tow to about 5k and you will be ok with the 3.42's.

However, keep in mind your diesel fuel dealer will make less money from you in the long run.

[catmandoo]

well john and dabig one just where in the heck are you going to get these 3:42 gears,everybody i talk to says no way in the 10 1/2 ring gear set up!even gm

[DA BIG ONE]

Originally posted by catmandoo:
well john and dabig one just where in the heck are you going to get these 3:42 gears,everybody i talk to says no way in the 10 1/2 ring gear set up!even gm I have had mine installed for about 4 months now in my 14 bolt full floater, posi and all, so if someone says it can not be done, then I guess they know better.

Perhaps, donning chestwaders when talking to these people that say it can not be done, is now in order!

BROWARD POWER TRAIN in Florida did the work they have a web site too.

[catmandoo]

well was on a different post ,and was given a couple places to try and found one place that lists a 3:42 for the 10 1/2 ring ,gonna give em a call today and see if they still have em.

[DA BIG ONE]

Originally posted by catmandoo:
well was on a different post ,and was given a couple places to try and found one place that lists a 3:42 for the 10 1/2 ring ,gonna give em a call today and see if they still have em. Go for it, well worth the money spent!

Good Luck!

[JohnC]

I ordered it that way (3.42) from the factory.

[catmandoo]

as i said found a 3:42 ring and pinion for 240.00 gonna order it up in the morning,thanks guys for all the help.hope i can gain a couple 3-4 mpg anyway.i drive 60,000 miles a year so it would pay for it's self in 6 months i figure,plus less wear on pretty much everything.