Is my '02 3500 a C35 or a K35 as far as alignment specs are concerned?

[c5dura]

My truck chewed through the front tires in only 8k miles. The *insides* are worn down on both sides. It was aligned at the best shop in town (at least that's the rumor) after it went for a trip into a ditch.

I'm taking it back to the same shop this afternoon to see about getting re-imbursed for two new front tires and a new alignment. I was looking at the specs for my truck and wasn't sure if I should go with the C35 or K35 specs as the left caster specs are a little different (4.25 for the C35 vs. 4.00 for the K35). Any advice?

Btw, the dealership alignment it after I cranked up the torsion bars after installing new keys. They got it within spec. The dealership told me when I had it in recently that the other shop had messed up the alignment and to take it back.

Just want to make sure I have my ducks in a row when I go back to the "best alignment shop in town".

Thanks!

[DalDMax]

c5dura,
C = Two Wheel Drive
K = Four Wheel Drive

So K3500 for your 4X4

[DmaxMaverick]

I would suggest neither.

The shop that is doing your service may have outdated equipment.

The 3500 and C/K3500 are different animals. Both were offered for M/Y 2001 and early 2002. The C/K model was also known as the "Classic" body style, which is the pre-1999 style. The suspension spec's are not interchangeable.

[DalDMax]

They are still using C and K to code whether it is a two or four wheel drive.
If you go to some place like kelly blue book and look at the model numbers, you will see they start with either CC or CK.
I have seen several things for the 01-03s referenced as C or K

[DmaxMaverick]

That may be the case, but I would err on the side of caution. Upgrades and new software are expensive for these new-fangled machines. They may have saved a few bucks at your expense. Many of the shops pass on upgrades if they don't see enough significant improvements. Could be the C/K thing got past them, or they don't know the difference.

Added on edit:
The difference between the C/K castor has only to do with the conditions the vehicles are expected to be operated in. It will have no on-road effects. The reason for less caster on a 4 X 4 is due to strain on the suspension while off road in soft ground. More caster means more feedback and stress.

[ 07-02-2003, 12:28 PM: Message edited by: DmaxMaverick ]

[c5dura]

Well, I just spoke to the shop and they said it was *way* out of alignment and that they fixed it.

I spoke to the owner (this shop has been in business for some 30 years and have about 10 bays) said that they adjust the HDs about 1 degree less than what is recommended due to tire wear problems. I'll be sure to pick up the data sheet when I get the truck in the morning to see exactly what the angles are now.

I'm wondering how it got "way" out of alignment again in only 5000 miles since they are the ones that aligned it last and I didn't hit anything or do any excessive off-roading in the 5000 miles that have transpired. The only thing I can think of is that the dealership replaced the seal on the steering box about 2000 miles ago, so perhaps *they* are the ones that caused it?

At any rate, they agreed to check it again in another 5000 miles for free just to make sure it is still within the values they recommend.

The owner did say that they do at least 20 HDs a month, so I assume they know what they're doing... Perhaps the guys that did mine the first time around was having a bad day or something and really screwed things up. I wish I had a copy of the numbers after that particular alignment...

[Lone Eagle]

The caster setting has nothing to do with tire wear. Inside wear is a result of negative camber as you get when you jack the torsion bars up. Once you get the tire wear it will not correct itself after and alignment. Rotating to the rear will help extend the miles but not cure a ruined tire. (radial) I would like to know the camber specs also. Later! Lone Eagle ;)

[SoMnDMAX]

Excessive toe out could cause inside wear too...

It's possible that one of the alignment heads moved during the alignment process, thus making the tech "think" he had everything right- but it actually was off. I've had this happen to me. Lone Eagle, IIRC, you used to do alignments... Ever have that happen to you?

Mistakes happen, and if the shop is standing behind thier work, they cannot be too bad.

[c5dura]

Got the truck back and here is the history of the alignment:

11/7/02 Mileage 3821
......................Before.....After.....Spec
Caster Left.......3.38.......3.38.....3.00-5.00
Caster Right......3.95.......3.95.....3.75-5.75
Camber Left......0.47.......0.08....-0.25-0.75
Camber Right...-0.20......-0.11....-0.25-0.75
Toe Left...........1/16".....1/32"...-1/32"-1/16"
Toe Right..........3/32".....1/32"...-1/32"-1/16"

7/2/03 Mileage 12275
......................Before.....After.....Spec
Caster Left........2.70.......2.76.....3.00-5.00
Caster Right.......3.88.......3.43.....3.75-5.75
Camber Left......-0.18.....-0.12.....-0.25-0.75
Camber Right.....-0.02......0.10.....-0.25-0.75
Toe Left..........-1/32"....-3/32"...-1/32"-1/16"
Toe Right............1/8".....7/32"...-1/32"-1/16"

The recent alignment was done on a "Visualiner", not sure about the 1st time.

I really don't know what to think about these values as the Caster values are now out of spec as are the Toe values?

However, while I was there, I saw no less than 2 2500HD and another 3500 on the lot. I guess that would seem to indicate that these new values represent a compromise of sort by experience that reduces tire wear?

[ 07-03-2003, 03:28 PM: Message edited by: c5dura ]

[Lone Eagle]

SoMnDMAX, You bet I made mistakes. I used to average between 1100 & 1200 alignments a year. That was quite a few years ago but not much has changed at least on our trucks. Did a lot of Chrysler products with torsion bars. If I knew I bumped a head I would recalibrate it.

c5dura, Your front end tech is not up to my standards. All the after specs should be as close as possible to the center of the specs. If I were doing the alignment I would shoot for:

Caster left +4
Caster right +4.5 to 4.75
Camber left +.5
Camber right +.25
Toe left/right 0 to + 1/32 on each side

I might even give you a little more camber if the tires looked really worn on the inside. I would have them redue it til they get it right or refund your money. Good alignment techs have a good word of mouth following. Ask around , you will find one. Later! Lone Eagle ;)