Allison burned fluid normal?

[4diesels]

I took my truck in to my mechanic for a tranny flush and filter at 25k miles. This truck is mainly my wifes rig and had rarely towed anything, and never anything heavy. The fluid was as black as the motor oil. In addition, it seems that the tranny is running a little warmer than it used to. Empty it will stabilize around 150-160. We have since needed to do some hauling with it, not heavy, and it gets to nearly 200 just cruising down the highway pulling a small gooseneck horse trailer.

So anyway, my buddy the mechanic runs an extra 7 qts through during the flush to try and get it to come clean. 2000 miles later it is getting pretty dark again so I take it to a dealer. They keep it all day looking for a problem but of course find nothing wrong. When I pick up the truck, they give me "document #1486345" or #PI01932, not sure which means anything. This thing states that dark brown to black transmission fluid is normal for the allison and that perfomance will not be affected. How can they possibly publish this with a straight face? Yessir, it burns the fluid black but that is OK.

Next, on to customer service (yeah right). First they want me to pay for another flush. I told the lady I just had it done. She tried the "if it wasn't done at a dealer it doesn't count" I reminded her of the MM warranty act and provided proof of the work having been done, she even called the shop! GM is going to pay for the flush now and the dealer is supposed to monitor it afterwards.

There is something wrong with this tranny, unless somebody can seriously justify it burning the fluid. I had a 2001 for 97k miles as a work truck, it towed big all the time. Never did the fluid come out brown or black on that truck.

I have a suspicion that it is fifth gear slipping causing the problem. Tomorrow it gets the flush, wednesday I am hauling a truck 7hrs to Sante Fe NM. I bet anything it will be toast (the fluid) by the time I get home.

There was only one other post I found like this and nothing came of it. I am one of very few? This truck has no mods on it, I would think that somebody with a modded truck has had this happen. Any advice, answers, comments? I just hate going around and around with Chevy on something that should just be replaced period.

[4diesels]

Three days and not a single response or comment? NOBODY thinks it odd that the allison burns its fluid and GM says its OK? Can I get my $20 back?

[DmaxMaverick]

Pardon my bluntness here but....

Your post will probably leave a lot of people scratching their head (apparently, your dealer, as well).

Black fluid in an auto is the second to last indicator of a tranny failure. The last being parts scattered all over the place.

25K and black fluid. Flush and black again after 2K. Pretty obvious to me, and 99.9% of the remaining intelligent (and some not so intelligent) occupants of this civilization.

Find another dealer.

[4diesels]

Well......as long as are are being blunt......... It isn't the dealer, they agree with you and I and 99% of people that know anything about automatic transmissions. The dealer however, has no say in this, they are not footing the bill, GM is. If you would have read the post more closely(there is the blunt part ;) ) I have a GM TSB that says "...trucks equipped with the Allison LCT1000 automatic transmission may experience a condition in which the transmission fluid has become dark/discolored (dark brown to black). There will not be any transmission performance issues with the transmission."

That is what I find very difficult to buy into. There used to be guys here with inside info. From what I have recently read there is pressure from inside GM not to "spill the beans" on the internet anymore. That is a shame, right along with GM not being very willing to correct their errors, then going even further to produce documents with bad info on them to further avoid correcting their errors. I wonder if I can fit that Cummins and six speed into this truck :rolleyes:

[KenZ]

Sorry to hear of your problems. My trans. fluid doesn't get black, and from your post, yours seems to run a lot cooler than mine does. If you are not having any performance issues, I would run it to failure since you have contacted GM and they are aware of the problem. You could also send the fluid in for analysis. Maybe the black is something different than caused by heat. Burned fluid should have a burned smell, and if the temp. gauge is working, it doesn't sound like you are overheating. What if it was some kind of dye leaching from some part? I'm just guessing. At least if you get an analysis done, you will have some additional ammo and maybe some peace of mind. Good luck. I know how you must feel.

By the way, what part of SW CO you from. I've been hunting in South central part for the past several years.

[DmaxMaverick]

I did read your post.

The dealers are allowed some descretion, if they demand it. GM's first answer is "normal", and they accepted it. A good dealer would have called BS and persisted.

If you go to another dealer with the complaint, and tell them what the "other" dealer had to say about it, it may help. The dealers are in competition with one another, and love it when they steal a customer. They are all arrogant. They know its not right. You need to find a dealer that will go to bat for you to make it right.

[4diesels]

This dealer is a little scary, but for now I will persist with them. They spent nearly all day trying to find fault with it last time. I do give them credit for trying. The service manager knows something is wrong. Getting it documented is the first step, even if it is a big waste of my time. I do have some time before the warranty is out. I also have another trip to Santa Fe to tow a car home, so if it is slipping, the mountains will help work it good.

The oil analysis is my next step, I need to get some sample bottles coming.

The fluid DOES smell burnt. You are correct though, it shouldn't be if the gauge is working correctly. The first evidence of the problem came at flush time. Like I said, it was never worked hard, and never over 200 on the gauge.

I guess it really bothers me because my '01 D/A never had this problem in the 97k miles I owned it, and that truck worked a LOT harder.

[Cliffee]

A few months back I helped a buddy with a 2002 GMC Duramax/ Allison do the tranny flush and his was black as well. I even posted on this website about it. He had 25k and normal driving. I just did mine at 25k and the fluid was almost new. I switched to Transynd.
I agree that burnt fluid is definately and early problem indicator.
I would get an oil analysis done on the burn fluid. That should hopefully indicate something.
My buddy now has almost 50k and still running strong. I haven't seen his fluid lately but we did switch his to Transynd also.