France and Michelin...something to think about [Archive]

FisHn2DMax

03-16-2003, 14:08

Bad news for American BFG Customers:
Michelin is a french owned company and Michelin owns BF Goodrich! The French also owned many common food brands including Dannon and Evian water just to name a few. Every American can show their disgust in France by simply switching their purchasing habits to other non French owned product brands.

The only thing the American the French respect is the American Dollar! The French and the Germans are more than willing to take American dollars, and begging for help when they need it, but when it comes to supportining America in our time of need, they thumb their collective smug noses at us. :mad: :confused:

It's time to send them a message! IF Americans would stop purchasing all French and German products during the remaining duration of the Mid east crisis/war, that will send a stronger message than anything political hand slap. tongue.gif

fred

03-16-2003, 14:42

just give france back to the germans, theve won it twice now anyways,, they should be a little more greatful there not speaking german!!!!!!

Silver Bullet

03-16-2003, 15:09

Amen in bruthas!!! I thought M had bought out BFG, but I was not 100% sure so I didn't want to say antything. I may need to go ahead and buy some American made HOT JUICE to burn up my BFG's... :D

GMCTRUCK

03-16-2003, 16:32

Guess I'm gonna have to get rid of my Bosch fuel injection and Duramax engine block as they both come from Germany. Oh yeah my ZF tranny is a German company also. As far as Michelins go, I had LTXs on my diesel Tahoe and they rode smooth and had good wear but, were horrible in mud and snow. Definitely a quality tire though.

mackin

03-16-2003, 16:59

GMCTRUCK

Dude ya spoiled it...There was a good rant going here.....

MAC :eek: :D

Luis

03-16-2003, 17:46

Go with the Yokahama Geolander A/T. They cost less and work better in mud & snow not to mention the quiet smooth ride on the road.

stretch

03-16-2003, 17:58

Their probably owned by Koreans !!! No better , :eek:

Redhawk

03-16-2003, 19:54

I just put on six Coopers last week on my 3500 instead of Michelins. I wonder if Chrysler will notice any downswing in sales. I sure hope so.

FirstDiesel

03-16-2003, 19:57

But Silver Bullet

As with most companies now, Michelin is a Frnech company but they build most of their American sold product in America. (Their US Headquarters is right here in S.C.) Sure some of the profits go back to the parent company but a lot of money is kept here in the US and a lot of jobs are generated.

Do I have any love for the French or Germans right now?? No!! (I'm of German heritage, BTW)
Will I stop buying a tire from Michelin because of this stuff, no. I'll buy what I want that is best for me and best for my fellow Americans too.

Silver Bullet

03-16-2003, 23:18

FirstDiesel,
I know to support "American Made" is pretty hard these days with the global economy, but it doesn't hurt to think a little more before we buy. What we can do as American citizens is somewhat limited in a global view...stop traveling to France, stop buying French products, etc, but in the end we might only be hurting ourselves...hard to say.

chevyguy

03-17-2003, 05:41

I got an e-mail the other day detailing which products to boycott that are made in france, here is the list.

French Products and Companies to Boycott
The following companies are subject to boycott:

** Air France. Air Liquide. Airbus. Alcatel. Allegra
(allergy medication). Aqualung (including: Spirotechnique,
Technisub, US Divers, and SeaQuest). AXA Advisors.

** Bank of the West (owned by BNP Paribas). Beneteau
(boats). BF Goodrich (owned by Michelin). BIC (razors,
pens and lighters). Biotherm (cosmetics). Black Bush.
Bollinger (champagne).

** Car & Driver Magazine. Cartier. Chanel. Chivas Regal
(scotch). Christian Dior. Club Med (vacations). Culligan
(owned by Vivendi).

** Dannon (yogurt and dairy foods). DKNY. Dom Perignon.
Durand Crystal.

** Elle Magazine. Essilor Optical Products. Evian.

** Fina gas stations and Fina Oil (billions invested in
Iraqi oil fields). First Hawaiian Bank.

** George Magazine. Givenchy. Glenlivet (scotch).

** Hennessy. Houghton Mifflin (books).

** Jacobs Creek (owned by Pernod Ricard since 1989).
Jameson (whiskey). Jerry Springer (talk show)

** Krups (coffee and cappuccino makers).

** Lancome. Le Creuset (cookware). L'Oreal (health and
beauty products). Louis Vuitton.

** Marie Claire. Martel Cognac. Maybelline. M

K1XV

03-17-2003, 05:57

I can understand and support the idea of buying American, particularly when the American product is 100% as good in quality and price as the foreign product. However, it is often difficult to determine exactly what is "American".

Over the years, I have bought Goodyear tires made in Brazil, Michelin tires made in South Carolina, and my Duramax Firestones (now owned by Bridgestone, a Japanese company) were made in Canada. And a whole slew of products with American brand labels are now made in China.

Which is more "American", a Toyota manufactured in the USA, or a Dodge (now a German company) made in Mexico?

I believe, if you want to support American workers, then the ownership of the company matters little. What is important, in economic terms, is where is the value added and the manufacturers money spent. Do some homework and find out where the product is actually made. And I don't mean "assembled". I remember about 25 years ago some of the Japanese motorcycle manufacturers began shipping finished Japanese manufactured engine/transmissions and motorcycle frames to the USA, and then bolted the engine to the frame in Nebraska. Took two guys 30 minutes to do that. It may have been "assembled" here, but it was not "manufactured" here. Some doofus bikers then throught it was "made in the USA".

For decades, the Japanese have supported their own economy by buying Japanese when they had a choice. Now, they have a harder time doing that, because even in Japan, many of the Japanese companies have shifted production off shore to cheaper labor sites such as Singapore.

There is only one product I regularly use that I can be 100% sure is all American. On my pancakes, I only use 100% maple syrup that I know was tapped and produced in Vermont by my neighbor!!

;) ;) ;)

Ray

c5dura

03-17-2003, 09:22

Hey Chevyguy, although your list includes an impressive array of liquer, its missing "Grey Goose" Vodka.

I no longer "roll with the Goose", I switched to Stoli even thought its Russian. To bad the US doesn't make a top shelf Vodka. Might just have to switch to my other regular, Jack 'n Coke.

Billy14

03-17-2003, 09:53

Food for thought,

A neighbor was given his pink slip last week. Works for a HUGE American co. that produces microprocessor chips.

Reason for shutting down the facility:
Company will now have the products manufactured in China.....cheaper labor.

Seems that alot of the knives sticking out of American workers' backs are smeared with American finger prints. :rolleyes: The almighty dollar wins out again.

Billy

pinehill

03-17-2003, 12:40

The French, although an irritating nation of cultural snobs, do not represent a real threat to the U.S. Our tiff with the French will soon blow over and be forgotten. The real danger is the Chinese, who are financing the creation of a very capable military by producing consumer goods for U.S. consumption. I do my best to avoid purchasing anything produced in China.

MadDuraMax

03-17-2003, 16:04

The French are exercising their Freedom to disagree with us. Just as there are many in our own country who disagree with our leaders views, they are Free to do so. In a Free world we must learn to accept opposing points of view.

Today we are on the brink of war to help keep us Free from acts of terror. While our Free volunteer military is in harms way, let us all keep them in our thoughts and prayers as we are all Free to do.

May God Bless America for having the courage to understand that there is a cost to Freedom.

zip

03-17-2003, 16:23

Goodyear is still an American-owned tire, although their quality has suffered the past few years. About a year ago Goodyear bought Dunlop.
Some of the members here seem to like their Dunlops. Goodyear also owns Kelly Tire.
Firestone, of course, has been owned by the Japanese company Bridgeport for a number of years. Cooper tires are American owned and are built in Indiana I think.
zip

TooMuchMuscle

03-17-2003, 19:57

Sorry to the union workers here... but the reason why manufacturer's are going oversea's is cause of the unions. Nuf said

Tsckey

03-17-2003, 20:22

Sorry, Too Much, but your suggestion that the cost of labor provides the total explanation for why U.S. companies are moving production to other countries is far too simplistic. It is certainly a factor, but the equation is vastly more complex than allowed by that pat excuse.

mbrower

03-17-2003, 21:23

I happen to be a Michelin employee and boycotting Michelin tires due to the political stance of France would be detrimental to literally thousands of American workers. As an employee I see on a daily basis how much Michelin puts in to the community around Greenville and Spartanburg SC through the sponsorships of charitable Organizations and the donations of money and products. The day after Sept 11, Michelin had already designed a memorial t-shirt and was distributing to any employees who would donate money to help with the relief efforts. As I understand 100% of the donations went to the relief with Michelin footing the bill. Also if I am not mistaken, the tires for the earthmovers were all donated and several service vehicles (firetrucks)that were lost that day were replaced by Michelin. As an employee and proud American vet, the thoughts of losing my job as the result of careless post like these that ask to kick the crutch out of an already crippled AMERICAN economy is hard for me to bear. All I ask is that you buy the products as you normally would because the person most likely hurt will not be the french, but your neighbor.
Mark

[ 03-17-2003: Message edited by: mbrower ]</p>

Redhawk

03-18-2003, 15:01

Hi neighbor Mark: No one is trying to personalize the differences we have with the French and me buying Coopers instead of Michelins is not going to bring the Michelin compeny to their knees. Their involvement in your community is commendable, but the duplicitous French government with it's naked scorn for the U.S. is what everyone is upset about. The 60,000 Americans, now buried in France, who died liberating their country from the Nazis more than compensates for putting tires on the local fire truck.

a64pilot

03-18-2003, 15:19

MadDuraMax,
What you said is really profound.
No, Freedom isn't Free, or said another way,
"Without the home of the brave, There would be no land of the free".
In my younger days I could always end an argument with a liberal by telling them that the basic difference between us was that while we disagreed. I was willing to die standing up for his right to do so, was he?

GMC D-Max

03-18-2003, 16:01

That's priceless, A64!
Can I borrow that?

MadDuraMax

03-18-2003, 16:14

a64pilot,

Being from a family of veterans the point of view is that all war is detestable. Some are very necessary though. Both of my grandfathers gave all for our country to this principle. Fortunately my father (Korea and Vietnam Vet), is still here to relay these thoughts.

The lesson here is not to boycott each other over disagreements of political views. This makes as much sense to me as boycotting your local McDonald's because you disagree with your city concil's policies. Michelin has little to do with the political policy of the Government of France.

Despite our country's balance of trade deficit, we as a nation have much to lose if other countries boycott us for our views. France, Germany etc. have been good allies of the US for years and hopefully will continue to be so in the future, regardless of our current disagreement.

Now is the time for supporting our troops whether or not you agree with our country's policies. Some will give all to protect our right to disagree.

1BADDMAX

03-18-2003, 16:20

Hey Mbrower, what plant do you work in. I used to work at US3 in Spartanburg while I was in college. I've got a friend that lives in Mooresboro so you are not to far away from me.

Burner

03-18-2003, 20:04

Howdy Fellas,

I think that the "****y" French are on our side. Yes, they do have a liberal front but their backward workings seem to help us in the long run. I do not think that the French have ever stabbed us in the back. They are probably allowing this fa

a64pilot

03-19-2003, 07:54

Burner,
What I fly is measured in SHP not thrust.
However JATO or other such things on a helicopter would probably be cool for a really short period of time.
Ever heard the story of the Air Force crewman in Nevada (I think) That put the JATO unit on his car?
Morale of the story, Unless your really sure of the outcome, don't initiate anything that you cannot turn off at a moments notice. :D

DURA-MAX3

03-19-2003, 14:41

My HARLEY-DAVIDSON was built right here in the good ole USA...York, Pa to be exact... I hope nobody spoils this for me...Ha ha ha

More Power

03-19-2003, 18:13

Something to think about....

We have 6 members from France and 52 from Germany. We have members from most European countries and even some Middle Eastern countries (i.e. 2 from Turkey). We have members from Russia, China, South Korea, Japan and most Pacific Rim countries. In total, there are 48 countries represented in the TDP membership.

A coalition of GM diesel enthusiasts.

MP

SS396

03-20-2003, 01:28

More Power Thank You

We have German born relatives that live in Germany, and their thoughtful and supportive e-mails after 9-11 indicate their love for us and all Americans.

The German government have their reasons and I don't support them, but let's not lump all German citizens and what they manufacture under that.

We have one family member who works for Robert Bosch and we all know the importance of that name.

Let's pray for the safe return of all American soldiers who are fighting for our freedom in the Middle East.

Redhawk

03-20-2003, 15:29

More Power: With all due respect, no-one is targeting their disgust at private citizens, especially diesel enthusiasts. What ticks me is any govenment who in a public international forum goes on record as disparaging the U.S. and their intentions, France in particular. We are not always right, but I firmly believe that we are now defending the physical integrity of our country and any attempt to thwart those aims raises emotional and visceral reactions to those countries who oppose that. We have spilled enough blood for France and Germany in the past that they should have just abstained rather than threaten to veto, in an attempt to embarrass the U.S.A. The only way to know who your friends really are is when you need them, whether you are in kindergarten or the United Nations.

Silver Bullet

03-20-2003, 23:24

This thread has drawn many thought provoking posts...thanks for everyone's input. I agree with many of the points-of-view presented...even some at opposite ends of the spectrum. Several points were brought up that I personally had not considered.

Although product boycotts may not be the best answer as it may hurt fellow American's more than the parent companies wallet in a land far away, what other ways can you show your unhappiness about a countries opposing position in our global economy at times such as this? Stop traveling to France? It is not at the top of my "places to see before I die list"! Come to think of it...it is not on the list at all. Write a letter? I think actions (or lack there of) speak louder than words. In this day and age most, but not all people choose to remain anonymous. Here at home when we are unhappy with our government we can stage a protest, we can vote politicians out of office, we can speak our mind (even if noone listens!), and we can post on forums on the internet for all the world to read!

ChevysRus

03-21-2003, 00:55

Motel 6 and Taylor-Made Golf Clubs!!!! A quick round of golf and a cheap hotel room......sorry I can't give that up LOL ha ha ha

Best Line I ever heard was in the Movie "Last of the Mohigans" The British are surrounded by the Indians and they are waiting for the French reinforcements, a scout returns to the Fort to tell the British commander that the French are not coming,` The British commander says "damn Frenchmen, you can't trust them, they make love with their faces".....

Hope I didn't break a rule around here....

best revenge is to just ignore them, French

MadDuraMax

03-22-2003, 10:19

The best way to voice your disapproval of France's political views is through our political system. Whether your State representatives are Republican or Democrat, a professional and well stated letter or email can go a long way.

Our country is a Democracy and these folks are our elected "representatives". Sure the politicians like to aline themselves with what appears to be popular. Then again, it is normal for us to quietly agree with our political leaders and vocally disagree with their views. Sometimes this causes the minority view to be much more clearly heard than the "silent majority".

As a country, we still send billions of dollars in aid each year to Europe. How much of and where this aid goes is largely based upon political motives.