esscort passport 8500 OR VALENTINE1

[fredw]

i need a radar detector,three tickets in last month,(photo radar) love the duramax, have read lots of good things here on the V1, as well on car and driver about it, but the other 5 radar comparisons all used the v1 as well and placed in second to fourth, with a big disavantage being the price, in canada it is a hassel to get a v1 compared to the esscort 8500 what won the other 5 comparisons and took second only once two v1, they are at our local future shops for a lot cheaper, and seam to due a better job, so my question is, why do all you folks stick up for your v1,are they a better detector, then what people say, are you just commited to them because you payed so much, and feel they just have to be better, has any one run with both on the dash and seen better results with the v1, i will be buying three in the next week from your results, basiclly buying one for free if i buy the 8500, thanks fred
--------------------

[mdrag]

fredw,

I was so committed to defending the high $$price$$ for the V1 that I bought a second unit for my wife :eek:

BTW, what are the 'other five' comparisons you mention. I've seen the one by RadarTest.com (or something like that) and it was pure dribble IMHO. I'd like to check out the other comparisons...A few more tickets and that other dectector won't be so 'cheap' anymore :D

[sonofagun]

Fred,

I own both. The Valentine gives a lot more false alarms in built up areas. On the open road I like the Valentine better Out in the open there are few false alarms so a more reactive unit is better. In a city with all the airwave trash I prefer the Passport.

My 2c.

Good luck,
Bob

[fredw]

THANK you two for quick respones, i called future shop, they received a 30 day return which was never open he said, gave it to me for 450doaars cdn or 290us to try out for 30 days, i told him it will come back if it does not perform well, i called V1 and ordered one as well, same policy as future shop, it was a 30 day return so they droped the price to 349us or 540cdn and about 25 cdn shipping, can not wait to try them both out. fred

as to mdrag: they are motor trend,popular mechanics, speedzones, motorcycle consumer,automobile consumer,radar test.com,radarbusters.com, roundal, they all speak higher of the esscort except for car and driver, which gave them a close second

[mdrag]

fredw,

Great idea trying both for 30 days!

I found the articles you mentioned on the Escort web page. Most are product reviews and not actual comparison tests. The RadarTest.com is over TWO YEARS OLD dated 01/2001, with the C&D dated 01/2002 being the most recent comparison.

My problems with the RadarTest.com report www.radartest.com/article.asp?articleid=1064 :

1) The RadarTest.com report gave the BEL 980 a rating of 94, the Escort 8500 a 97, and the V1 rated a 77. I've owned a BEL 980 and it is BY FAR an inferior detector compared to the V1, not even anywhere near the same league IMHO.

2) The V1 product description/summary is written in a very negative, bordering on 'product bashing' way.

3) RadarTest states that "...Truth is, radar to the side poses no threat at all and radar from behind is scarcely worthy of more attention"... That statement alone tells me that the reviewer doesn't have a clue. On the way home form work tonight - the rear directional arrow thingy saved me from a big time ticket, so my vote is that it is not worthless. If I did not have the rear arrow indicator - I would have been focusing most of my attention straight ahead but the rear indicator alerted me to carefully check out rear traffic - an unmarked OHP cruiser was three cars behind in the same lane and I would have missed him without the V1's warning....

4) Bogey counter inaccurate because it went off in a small town, and showed multiple radar sources - SO WHAT??. One automatic door has multiple microwave sensors, and unfortunately those X band signals MAY be the same as the ones from a LEO radar.


IMHO, the radar locator/bogey counter is probably the most important/impressive/addicting feature of the V1. I'll bet you a cold one that you get to try out the Escort's 30 day money back guarantee ;)

[Kennedy]

Hey Mdrag, maybe we should swap for a while!

I've actually considered just buying a V1 and putting it up with the Escort and seeing how they worked side by side..

[fredw]

kennedey: how do you like your esscort, you seamed like the lone wolf on that other post, never heard your thoughs or concerns

mdrag: thanks for the input, that locator/bogey counter looks to be a great bonus for the V1

[mdrag]

HEY Kennedy,

Sure, I'm up for a swap ;) - if you agree to pay for any speeding violations that I'm sure to get tongue.gif :D

The problem with trying two detectors in the same vehicle is that they will frequently cause each other to false alarm.

fredw,

One other thing to consider, the V1 has been updated/upgraded quite a few times since it's introduction. Although it is not inexpensive to upgrade, V1 will let you know if it is cost effective to do so - I've received a brand new unit the last two upgrades. If you buy another brand, how do you know if it has been sitting on the shelf for 2 years - or maybe it does not matter since the other companies have not made any changes ->until a 'brand new' model with a different model number comes out... :eek: You can check the software level of any V1 compared to the most current version by visiting the website and typing in the serial number. That's one reason why I would avoid eBay bargains - you may be getting a much older unit with older electronics/software. I remember (?Alli-max) posting about refurbs from V1 - worth asking about.

IIRC, Mike Valentine was one of the original founders of ESCORT. When they bought him out, he had to agree not to go into competing business making detectors for something like 5 years. He spent that time/money wisely developing the V1 - and introduced his detector shortly after the agreement lapsed.

Please post your experience with the Escort 8500 and V1. Good luck.

[POS]

Here's my answer to the question. I too wanted to know which one was better since I drive 150 miles a day and not all of them are legal. :D :D

So, I bought a Val 1 and an 8500, hooked them both up to the PowerPoints, and stuck them both to the window. Here's what I found:

1) X-band: Val 1 picked up signals sooner, but only by a few seconds. Val 1 was almost always a second quicker than the 8500.

2) K-band: Equal competition; both recognized simultaneously.

3) Ka-band: 8500 won by a long shot every time. This one surprised me most, but it was hands down given to the 8500.

4) Laser: Don't know; never ran into any laser cops. But from what I hear, once the laser is on you, detectors don't mean squat.

5) False alarms: Even on the "best" setting, I could not get the Val 1 to shut up; the 8500 went off on falses too, but not to the extreme as the Val 1. The Val 1 was just plain annoying.

For me, it was an easy decision. The Val 1's directional finder is awesome - I absolutely love it and wish Escort would incorporate one. But the downside was the Val 1's overactive false alarms and the failure to get the Ka band quickly. Texas DPS uses Ka a lot. Add all that madness together and subtract the $100 I saved with the 8500, and you can tell that I sent the Val 1 back for credit. I depend on my 8500 daily; haven't been caught yet.

PS - Bought my wife one too! ;)

[fredw]

thanks pos: yesterday i came across a hiway rcmp, he was using ka, gave me about a mile warning, but like you say it would be nice to have that location indicator, i would like to find and report some photo radar coverage,and see how these detectors work as well

[Toddster]

Fred, thought you were gonna compare the two ? Did you have both in the truck ?

[fredw]

as of today still have not received v1

[Toddster]

Just wanted to move this thread up the ranks again ! Fred, did you have both detectors in your truck yet ? Anxiously waiting your results ! There is lots of reading on comparos of these two high end detectors and just as many excuses by each manufacturer of how the comparos were botched ! So confusing... :confused:

[DMAXDiva]

Well, I have V1 in both the truck and the Vette, and was jettin' down the Eastex freeway here in Houston today in the Z and saw not one but THREE of Houston's finest standing alongside their cruisers on the other side of three consecutive overpasses (those rascals) shooting what I assumed was laser, but my V1 never ONCE alarmed... :confused: Any Houston guys know if HPD runs photo now?

Sheesh...that was SCARY...I really bound up those Brembos a few times...I'll have a bunch of brake dust to clean off the chromies tomorrow! :rolleyes:

[Toddster]

Aaahhh, Diva and company wanna tell this hillbilly what photo is and why the state of the art V1 did not pick it up ? Is the Passport and V1 now obsolete due to a nother form of speed detection ? :mad:

[DMAXDiva]

toddster:

It's my understanding that there are both photo-radar and photo-laser systems out there, but I'm not all that familiar with them and was wondering if they even use them around here....evidently they shoot a pic of your front plate while clocking your speed (hey, since the Vette doesn't have a front plate, do I get a freebie?). ??? teehee

That's why I don't understand the V1 not warning me at all. Even with instant on in either variant (Ka, laser), I will get some sort of warning beforehand, and I came over the hill right at these guys with those boxes aimed right at me and I never heard a peep from the detector. The only thing that saved me was the brakelights ahead as drivers crested the hill...a sure sign to back off the throttle. :eek: I tell ya, if there hadn't been some traffic in front to warn me, and I'd had a clear lane, I'd probably be sittin' in jail right now waitin' for someone to bail my leadfoot out... tongue.gif

DMD

[ 02-28-2003: Message edited by: DMAXDiva ]</p>

[TxDoc]

How do you get away with no front plate on a Texas-licensed vehicle?

http://www.window.state.tx.us/tpr/btm/btmtr/tr14.html

"State law requires passenger and commercial motor vehicles operating on public highways to display two license plates: one plate at the front of the vehicle and one at the rear"

If you just carry a pic of the HD, show that and they will surely let you go smile.gif

[Toddster]

Diva, maybe this was just a scare tactic sting to slow your Texas asses down ! Tx, I think all states now require front plates, my Harley plate looks great on my black Dmax ! lol....

[DMAXDiva]

Yeah, I know it's state law to have a front plate, but frankly, I have yet to see a Vette around here that has one. I'm in a large Corvette club here and noone that I know of runs a front plate either...that does'nt make it legal, but there must be some safety in numbers...now if the officer is really ticked off that you blew by him at over 150, well... tongue.gif

Besides, if I do get pulled over for no plate, I figure I have at least one opportunity to plead ignorance and play that quintessential "dumb female" routine...teehee :D

DMD

[chevyguy]

Toddster, ky doesnt require a front license plate.Diva nice truck and vette,btw can I test drive the vette. :D

[mdrag]

DMAXDiva,

Most of the time laser will not give you any warning until it is aimed directly at you - there is very little scatter from the laser. IIRC, the typical laser has a beam about 4 ft wide at 1000 feet. From what I've seen and read, the lasers are aimed like guns with some type of sighting device.

So little if any advance warning, just like instant on radar. Speed reading from a laser takes less than 1 second - if your laser detector goes off and you are speeding....you get to see those flashing lights up close and personal :eek:

The V1 website as an article on a new undectable type of radar technology used in the MPH Industries model BEE III (POP mode):

www.valentine1.com/pop/

Mike Valentine describes the how's, why's, and limitations. The

QUOTE:

"...Moreover, we believe MPH Industries knows this feature is faulty. Why else would it advise, in the accompanying Operation and Service Manual, as follows:

[mdrag]

I forgot to mention that at least 5 years ago, one of the major car mags (C&D or R&T) had a test on laser dectectors. They found that the laser dectectors worked - BUT in most cases with no advanced warning and speed reading were obtained before the operator could slow down.

They also found that using your headlights DURING THE DAY would decrease the lasers effective detection range by 50% or more - the more lights the better (high beams, or lows with fogs) and lights closer to the center (like Saturn's) worked best....

Why would this work? From a distance, the head lights will make it harder for the officer to choose a target on the front of the vehicle AND the head lights will increase the 'noise' so the laser gun has a much harder time locking onto it's reflected signal, temporarily confusing the laser. This gives the driver vital seconds to respond to the laser dectector warning tongue.gif :

It's very interesting that I've never seen another article or even a suggestion of using this method from any other soure. Too bad that I threw away the article. Could it be that simple to give the driver a slight edge in this difficult situation???

I'm NOT saying this works or doesn't work, just food for thought. Has anyone tried to use a laser sight or pointer in daylight?

[DMAXDiva]

mdrag:

Thanks for the info. I still don't understand why the V1 didn't go off even when I know the cop had me in his sights...could have been the fact that there was so much traffic ahead of me, I guess. Anyway, I was a bit worried that I never got a warning despite three consecutive "hits"... :confused:

[Vette Racer]

DMAXDIVA

If you had A passport you woundn't have to worry about it. That's just the way it is. By the way, about the Corvette club, Does it have to do with NCCC? Just wondering? I happen to play with those folks. We drag and auto-x. Been known to play in the houston area.

[Vette Racer]

Hey MDRAG,

One of these days I am going to come down and see you. I bought my mudflaps after looking at your pictures. Even after they're out of business I still like them. On top of that, I really want to take a look at your truck.

[rrocket]

I just ordered a laser jamer.
It generates a light to confuse the laser.
The big thing is it also detects when you are shot, allowing you enough time to slow down, flip the switch off and let the officer get a more acceptable reading.
Not sure if I am blowing $400.00 but the dealer I've been buying from said if it don't work, hed give me my money back.
It's called the Blinder M-10.
Any thoughts or feedback??
Escort and BEL also have units.
Note this is not a "radio transmision" just "Light" in the same band as the laser??
Thanks Paul

[DMAXDiva]

hey vette racer:

I'm in the Sam Houston CC, but I don't see them listed w/NCCC... :(

I've been toying w/the idea of some road racing, and I would like to try autocross sometime. If you know of any Houston area organizations that participate, or if you ever get back down here, let me know...I'd love to see that '66!!! :eek:

Thanks...

DMD
dmaxdiva@yahoo.com

[mdrag]

Vette Racer,

I'm not sure that I'm ready for another visit from a forum member - the last visit resulted in a proposal :eek: :D :D ....

Too bad DTA went under. I had to change my rear mudflap with the 19.5" conversion, revised pics at the 2nd or 3rd link in my sig.

If you're headed this way, give me a yell, and I can do likewise if I'm headed toward Tulsa..

[Toddster]

mdrag, thats a bad thing :confused: Great speed detection info by the way.... ;)

[fredw]

it has been a while since my last post, on this subject, after about two weeks with the pasport, i received a required service, so it took another week and a half to be replaced,i then had also just received my v1, my findings so far have been the same as others have reported, the v1 on hiway mode is always the first to alarm( the only problem is a few more false alarms than passport) so you really are not sure what it is if you are not fimular with the areas false alarms, the passport has fewer false alarms on hiway and even fewer in the city, as for photo radar, which i was concerened with the most, they both reported about the same time in the city,(ka) i seen no laser yet and have had two occasions when i have had radar flashed on me with instant detection by both, so far this is my testing, will give a final conclusion in a few more weeks

[TexasMax]

I may be way off base here but from my understanding photo radar is just a camera hooked to a radar gun (in the simplest sense). So the radar will still be K or KA (maybe laser) and your radar detector should still go off.

Another thing about laser that I remember from a magazine article was that car color and design also made a huge difference in laser effectiveness. I darker color car was much more difficult to catch then a white car. Cars with a steeply sloped windshield were also more difficult then say a truck. (Diva - black car and slippery shape). Laser just like radar requires a signal to be reflected back to the gun and it's not as broad as radar. One thing they mentioned in the article was that one of the best reflective objects on a vehicle was the front plate. (Diva again didn

[DMAXDiva]

Hi TexasMax:

Thanks for the input...makes sense. I knew black was a good color! ;)

DMD

[sdaver]

v1v1v1v1v1v1v1vV1V1V1V1V1V1V1V1

[Toddster]

Dave Dude, that is sooooo not informative ! :rolleyes:

[NWDmax]

Okay then,I bought both,one for my gorgeous wife and the V1 for me.
Escort gives fewer false alarms but the V1 is hard to beat with its directional arrow indicator.
Wife loves hers and I'm keeping the Valentine!

[sdaver]

310 miles today 4hrs............no tickets........two v1 saves :D dave.......new orleans to montgomery al

[mdrag]

sdaver,

310/4 = 77.5 MPH average. I'd shut off my detector ;) when traveling that slow on the OK Turnpike - legally posted @ 75 MPH tongue.gif :D :D

[ 03-17-2003: Message edited by: mdrag ]</p>

[OKDiesel]

Mdrag and Vette Racer,

If you two ever hook up in the Tulsa area let me know too. I would love to see your guys trucks (I promise not to drool on them) We could kick back a few cold ones and tell lies.

Brian

[sdaver]

one stop for a diet mountain dew..........70 speed limit some 60 mph construction areas.......wish ours was 75 :D :D :D

[fredw]

as for my final verdick: i now have finshed my test of the two detectors mounted about a foot apart on my truck for the last month, i have came threw all sorts of radar except for laser, as stated, in a earlier post , the v1 seams to alarm as fast or faster for rear radar compared to the 8500, it seams on hiway mode to go off a bit sooner (a second or two)compared to 8500, as well in the city, and its biggest benifit is the directional bogey counter, which the passport only has a counter of each type of radar, as for the passport, the protection is very close to the v1, photo radar was a bit stronger on ka than the v1, it all came down to false alarms which was a noticable difference with the advantage to the 8500 while the v1 was a bit skeptical when city bound, when the x band was turned off very few alarms with 8500,as there was still some with the v1,i think the reason as stated by others is due to a stronger signal by the v1, without a stronger filter for false alarms installed, they are both recomended by myself with the advantage for me being the price and support closer to myself, i also found with little trouble the passport at 250$ with shipping for a new unit compared to 375$ with shipping for a 30 day return unit, this works out in canada to a 125 dollar savings, for about the same detector, except for the directional bogey indicator, i now have bought 3 of these passports brand new for this price and only need two, will not need one for the streetbike, so i have a brand new one for sale for that price, as for the v1 i have sent back, and waiting for a refund, so this test is my own test and is here only to show you a one man opion of the v1 versus the esscort passport 8500 :D :D

[Vette Racer]

FredW

Great report on the detectors. I tried the same thing when BEL first came out to see if it was any better than passport, ended up taking it down before the red river on a trip to Texas. False alarms drove me crazy.

DMAXDIVA, Yes, I've heard of the Sam Houston club. The main NCCC (National Council of Corvette Clubs) in Houston is the San Jacinto CC. There's also the Houtex CC. You ought to get acquainted with some of those folks and attend one of the auto-x's. A legal place to put your foot in it.

MDRAG, Sorry to hear about your last visitor. Maybe I'd better pass. ;) ;)

OKDIESEL, We'll let you know if that ever happens. Glad to hear of another "Okie" here.

There, think I got everyone covered. Been awhile since I was here. Thanks all for the comments.

[atvpilot]

Fred,
Sorry but I prefer my Cobra 25 NTW. I gives me a second set of eyes further down the road. I have seen dectectors go off everytime you go past a convient coffee shop cause somebody has nuked their danish or hard roll with butter. I have also seen dept store alarm systems set off the dectectors but to each their own. I have a lot of faith(and watts) in my CB. Just my 2 cents.

[atvpilot]

I was just chatting with one of the Police Officers I work with and he tells me that their is a front end bra that is specifically made to throw off radar guns. Don't know if this is true or he is pulling my leg. Something to think about. Still trust my Cobra.
Seee Yaaaaaaaaaaa :D :cool:

[a64pilot]

ATVpilot,
The bras you speak of are made of RAM or radar absorbent material. They do work some, but usually not that much. Probably the biggest radar reflectors are the headlights. Example, A small sport bike with two headlights has a larger RCS, radar cross section, than a large dresser type bike if it has only one.
There is probably nothing you can do to get the RCS of say a Vette with it's retractable headlights and slanted radiator. Even a Vette has more than enough RCS for modern radar guns and with our huge frontal area early detection and maybe advance warning with a CB and diligence on our part is all we can do.

[atvpilot]

a64,
with that 250watt linear does that pull alot of power when you key up and how far can you transmit? :cool:

[Vette Racer]

Question, Where can you purchase the Linear? Been so long I'm out of touch. I used to and still have another brand but its so far out of date I'd be afraid to fire it up. Might burn up the whole car or cause sterilization or some stupid thing like that. oh my god!! Is yours a transistor based or what? Some fools want to know??

[a64pilot]

ATV,
about 25-30 amps I think. Ran a car stereo power cable from jump start terminal to a battery isolation solenoid located under back seat to power it and inverter.
Vette,
Any good truck stop will have a CB shop, most sell linears. Important to have radio tuned and matched to Amp. Don't pay more than about a dollar an amp. I can transmit as far as I can recieve most times. As with anything else be careful with too much power. The truck computers may not be shielded well enough for more than 1000 watts or so.

[fredw]

it has been almost a year now that i have been using the pasport, and to date no more tickets, let me say that again, no tickets since, we figure we have dam near payed them off allready, and as for insurance premiums skyrocketing, i am very happy of my choice, we have had no problems to date with both, have a third one on backup, still in sealded box, good investment for the fast driver :D :D

[a64pilot]

FWIW,
Don't place two detectors in close proximity to each other. The reason is that the superheterodyne circuitry, I think it's called, actually produces the same frequencies that LEO radar operate on. It's this that may cause other detectors to false, more importantly it may cause the detectors to interfere with each other, without setting off a false alarm, so that you may/will not get an accurate reprensation of detector sensitivity. It's this "leakage" of RF that radar detector detectors rely on. I believe that with the magnesium case and other features the V1 is so well shielded that it is virtually undetectable and while it may not interfer with other detectors it may well be interfered with.
Photo radar is any band of radar that is used in a photographic radar setup, very popular in europe, and yes it would take a picture of your front liscense plate and your surprised face through the windshield. You would get the ticket in the mail with a copy of the picture :mad:
Headlights may help interfer with laser, the logic is there. However with a low profile vehicle, like a vette, the headlights if up will significally increase the RCS ( radar cross section). You see they will focus and return the radar or laser signal. A Japanese sport bike with two headlights will be detected before a dresser Harley if the Harley has only one. Old motorcylist test from years ago I believe.
Any jammer that you can buy legally is junk. In order for a jammer to jam it would have to transmit on the same frequency that your detector is looking for. So if your jammer is on then everybody's detector within range will be alerting.
JMHO

[NWDmax]

V-1 is my friend!
Love the directional indicator as its nice to know which way to look for those "bogeys". :D

[bearman]

I just bought a Passport 8500 and I sure do like it. Already saved me one ticket this morning smile.gif .
Cheers
Bear

[NWDmax]

Got my wife one of those.
It picks up the radar as good as the v-1 but I do like dem arrows!

[TxDoc]

One nice benefit of the Valentine One is the update program. I had one on the shelf that was circa 1991 vintage. I entered my serial number and checked on what updates were available. I essentially received a new Valentine One for half the price of a new one. So, once you buy it, you won't have to pay full price for the newest technology, when it comes out.

http://www.valentineone.com/lab/detectortests.asp

Imagine a radar detector that never gets obsolete. Here's my plan.

Continuous Improvement:
Valentine One was new in 1992. Since then, every part inside the magnesium case has been improved, several times for many of them. Continuous improvement keeps Valentine One the top performer; Car and Driver confirms that our margin over the others is wider now than ever.

We'll Upgrade Your Earlier Model:
Since 1994, whenever we've made a performance breakthrough, we've offered it to our past customers in the form of an upgrade. The price varies, depending on the parts required. Included is a one-year warranty, same as new.

No Planned Obsolescence:
Other detector makers want you to throw away your old detector and buy new. Not me. Nine years after the first Valentine One, I'm still working for that customer, because every Valentine One we've ever made can be upgraded to the latest technology.