Leveling kit for 2500hd

[gregmican]

Have any of you guys heard of the leveling kit for the 2500hd? It replaces the cams that turn the torsion bars up. The holes that the torsion bars stick in to are offset more than the factory cams, so just by changing the cams out it makes the truck sit 2" higher in the front. No more having to adjust the torsion bars. Ride quality is a little smoother and the torsion bars do not have to be in a bind to get the front end level. A local shop in Victoria Tx is selling this kit for $200 installed. What do you guys think?

[TooMuchMuscle]

Greg, Fabtec sells a 3" spindle which will level it out maybe even give you a little lift up front. Also RCD makes a good leveling kit. Best of luck

[gregmican]

Toomuchmuscle, the spindles are for 2 wheel drive trucks only, not 4x4s. Thanks for your input though! smile.gif

[mackin]

Here is one...
=>http://www.hill4wheeldrive.com/

In saying that I've heard that FORD PART# XL3Z-5B328-CA only cost 50 bucks and does the same thing ????? I've been tempted to try........


MAC :D

[CanadaKev]

Greg,
I ordered my leveling kit from hill4wheeldrive.
All they are, is replacement 'pork chops'(torsion bar keys). $149US IIRC
Raised my front end 3". I likey smile.gif
Unfortunatley you won't see it in my pics, 'cause they weren't installed yet when I took 'em.
Kev

[ 12-07-2002: Message edited by: CanadaKev ]</p>

[LA DMAX]

CanadaKev,
How has the leveling kit affected your ride compared to stock? Stiffer? About the same as stock? The web site says that the higher you go the stiffer the ride. Is it true? Thanks

LA DMAX

[CanadaKev]

LA DMAX,

I didn't notice any difference in the ride or stiffness. Seems the same as before the adjustment.
Kev

[DmaxMaverick]

Hey guys! Who needs a squeegie sharpener? Got plenty for sale.

These "pork chops", "leveling kits", "torsion bar keys", whatever. They are torsion bar preload cams. You already have one, and they will do what these $50, $150 "widgets" do. If all you want is to increase the preload of your torsion bars, and the OEM cams don't go far enough, install a longer bolt, or shim it. Seen it done dozens of times for a $2.00 trip to the hardware store. All you are doing is putting more twist on the bar. I've even heard of a couple guys advancing the index 1/6th turn in the cam. Instant 4" lift at its lowest preload.

Cheap or free? There is a MUCH higher price to be paid here. CV joint angles. Getting a 3" lift just on the torsion bars WILL cause them to fail very fast, and possibly take out the front diff. Boots split, dirt gets in, BANG! That is if they don't overheat and cook first. The further you go, the risk increases exponentially.

I turned my bars up 4 turns to accomodate my 285/75/16's on 16X8 wheels. It lifted the front end approximately 1.5" - 1.75". This, in my informed opinion, is very close to what may be the "safe threashold", and still makes me a little nervous. 2" would certainly be max before detrimental effects could start to occur.

Be a stastistic, or learn from them. There has been some debate as to the real meaning of HD. One thing that I can confirm, HD stands for "High Dollars" when something breaks.

Flame on, but have your wallet ready. Cheers.

[hdmax(mike)]

gregmican POSTED
posted 12-07-2002 06:39 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Have any of you guys heard of the leveling kit for the 2500hd? It replaces the cams that turn the torsion bars up. The holes that the torsion bars stick in to are offset more than the factory cams, so just by changing the cams out it makes the truck sit 2" higher in the front. No more having to adjust the torsion bars. Ride quality is a little smoother and the torsion bars do not have to be in a bind to get the front end level. A local shop in Victoria Tx is selling this kit for $200 installed. What do you guys think?

What do you meam, No more adjusting the torsion bars? That is exactly what you are doing by replacing the stock torsion bar keys! $200 is highway robbery.

As for the spindles, If they work on the 4x2, They work on the 4x4. The suspension is the same, minus transfer case, front differential, and half shafts. (From everything I have read)

Anyone going more then 2" by way of spindles of torsion bar adjustments (and that includes replacement torsion bar keys) are on barrowed time. That is just too much of an angle for the half shafts.

[gregmican]

hdmax POSTED:What do you meam, No more adjusting the torsion bars? That is exactly what you are doing by replacing the stock torsion bar keys! $200 is highway robbery.
You don't understand. The holes where the torsion bars slide into the keys are offset in a different position than the stock keys. Meaning, you achieve lift on the front with the bolts that adjust the keys backed all the way off. If you crank on the bolts that twist the torsion bars with the stock keys to get it level, you put a lot more stress on the torsion bars themselves. After a period of time while under stress, metal tends to relieve itself, which causes the torsion bars to weaken. This can cause the front end to actually sag to relieve the stress. Although this may not happen to people who only give the bars a few cranks to level their trucks, I have seen it happen to people who bottomed out the bolts to run larger wheels and tires. I was just asking for advice, not a smartass. :eek:

[DmaxMaverick]

Easy now, boys (straight from the "smartass")

gregmican
Rethink your logic. In order to get X amount of lift at the wheel, you need Y amount of torque on the torsion bar. Period. I find much truth in your post, but it doesn't address the issue.

The torsion bar doesn't care what is at the cam end. It only responds to the amound of preload torque, or the rotation of the cam end of the bar. How you get it there makes no difference. Twist is twist. That is not the issue. The issue is still axle shaft/CV joint angle. If a person were to insist on over lifting with the torsion bars anyway, I offered an alternative that won't drain your wallet. It's your money, buy the kit, and a couple spare axles, oil pan, front diff, tie rod, spindles, radiator, intercooler, etc.

Respectfully,
Smartass

[Jelisfc]

I have heard that the HD's suspension is designed different from the 1/2 and light 3/4's. Yes there's more beef but the geometry is different so you can turn up a stock system to get a 2" lift without bottoming out anything, screws, cams, etc. Putting the CV angle argument aside. The Hill lit my be of less value to HD owners than people with 1/2 tons. An HD can take it but it's probably a good idea to change keys on a 1/2 ton.

Torsion bar tension determines ride height until somthing major like spindles are changed. The key profile just sets the cam angle different putting a higher initial preload in the system.

[SoCalDMAX]

I have to agree with DmaxMaverick. The torsion bars are under the same amount of load (namely the weight of the front of the truck) whether at stock height, cranked up 1.5" or using "Hill leveling keys". The only way to change the load on the torsion bars is to add or remove weight from the front end. The only way to change the spring rate is to change to a different dia. torsion bar.

The Hill keys are Ford keys, with the part # ground off and the price jacked up. The only thing they will do is allow you to go higher with less bolt adjustment. One could re-index the stock keys, shim up the bolts, use longer bolts or simply adjust the stock bolts up 1-1.5" which is gonna level it out to begin with.

I adjusted my torsion bars up about 1.5" and leveled it out. With 33" tires it looks much better, but it's still surprising how much inner fender is still showing with that large of a tire.

Regards, Steve

[hoot]

So Cal is right,

Turning up the torsion bars only rotates the bar which in turn raises the truck. If the truck was not allowed to be raised, only then would you be "twisting" the bars more than they already are.

The leveling kit sounds like a waist of money. Like SoCal said, if you run out of threads just get longer bolts.

I was able to raise mine plenty with the stock bolts.

Ford parts on my GM truck....... no way ;)

[DMAXDiva]

Aw jeez, now y'all have me worried... :(

Could this 300-plus pound RH front-end replacement be causing more harm than good? This thing provides incredible protection (especially on Houston freeways ;) ), but at what expense? Should I consider a larger diameter t-bar to accomodate the added weight?

As always, thanks for any input...you guys are great. :D

[CanadaKev]

OK guys,
I guess I got suckered into buying the "ford" keys from Hill ;)
But I like what the 3" lift has done for my truck.
As far as, the change in shaft angle, either taking out the u-joint or the front diff; I sincerely have my doubts.

I will put a protractor on it(the next time I have the truck over the grease pit), but by eye,(climbing under the truck), the angle is less than 5 degrees. If a u-joint can't handle a 5 degree angle then something is wrong.

A PTO driven farm implement, has a shaft that turns, up to 30 degrees while in operation, and the u-joints can handle it. That's what they are there for.

I would really be shocked if GM's u-joints were adversely affected by my 3" front end lift.
But I guess it's my nickle to risk eh? ;)
Kev

[big dipper]

jelisfc is correct.
1/2 tons need a different cam to obtain the gain.
3/4 tons can gain an inch with 4 turns.

Longer bolts CAN NOT be used. The cam actually will bottom out (actually top out) on the crossmember. Also, if you turn them up that high, if you were to drive over a piece of pavement that would make the front end drop or extend, it feels like the front end is going to drop out violently.

[01F350SRW]

Ding Ding Ding,

I couldn't resist, but I'm gonna chime in on this one. As you can see from my Sig, I have the Torsion Bar keys, cost me 50 bucks, not 200, and they're exaxtly the same thing you can get from Hill4whelldrive, from truckinsuspension.com. It lifted the front of my truck 3 inches measuring from the bottom of the airdam, and was a measured 4.5 degrees on the cv angles. If this truck can't take 4.5*, then Im sorry its not heavy duty. This truck is still new to me, as you see I still kept my first beast, cause even though I love it, it is my first GM product, so far so good. The reason I added the kit is because I added 3500 3 stage springs with add-a-leafs in the rear, the 2500HD 2 stagers were just to rough and couldn't hold the weight I was carrying. (A total weight on the DMV scales 25,275 lbs) :eek: The new springs lifted the rear so much something had to be done, it was funny looking for about a week. So I turned my T-Bars, gained a measured 2", ride to rough, lowered it back, and had the keys installed. Turned the bars one time to make it ride "like a truck" can't stand the car ride. Measuring from the bottom of the airdam the truck sits 4 inches higher than stock. Still have the 245's, looks like a Dodge with all that truck and no tire. :D

By the way, I can fit a 35" tire, but I need a HIGH load rating. Any ideas?

[kanton1]

01350SRW,

Which keys did you order from truckinsuspension? The only ones I see listed are for the 88-98 trucks.

Thanks for the info

[Professor]

01F350SRW

Nitto 305-70-16s have a 3500lb rating. Only 33in however.

[01F350SRW]

Kanton1,
your right, on the web-site they only list the ones for the 88-98 C/K's :confused: :confused:

I have a copy of their catalog and it lists the 2500HD 3500 keys.

Thanks Professor, I might end up going with 33's even though they're gonna look kinda small, I've fitted 285's underneath it to see what they look like and boy there still is a lot of wheel well showing, front and rear. 35's would be nice, and they won't fill it up to much either.

[ 12-13-2002: Message edited by: 01F350SRW ]</p>

[Bass_on_tap]

I have the same ones that they sell at "Hills" for my 2500HD, only I paid $100.00 for them plus $15.00 shipping. Dave

[ 12-13-2002: Message edited by: Bass_on_tap ]</p>