DRW vs SRW vs 19.5

[biker Wayne]

Other forums have discussed the pros/cons of DRW vs SRW vs 19.5 wheels when pulling a heavy 5th wheel. At sometime in the future I may trade my travel trailer for a 5er that weighs about 15,000 pounds with 2800 pounds of kingpin weight. A 15,000 pound 5er should have 15 to 20% of the trailer weight sitting on the king pin. This means between 2250 and 3000 pounds. A 2500HD is supposed to handle up to 2500 pounds of kingpin weight. I've got Air Lift air bags on the rear axle, so I can haul the 2500 to 2800 pounds from a capacity standpoint. I can also add a third stage leaf spring setup like a 3500. I'm still under the gross rear axle rating, even though I'm over the GVWR. Some people say that the DRW gives much more stability and better ride than SRW when loaded. DRW is also MUCH BETTER in the event of a rear tire blowout, although 1 dual can sometimes take out the other dual. People with SRW say they have been hauling 5ers for 35 years and never had a blowout. People with the 19.5 inch tires say that they handle the weight and stability much better than LT 265 75 16 E.
Anyone have real world experience or have knowledge about what would work and what to stay away from?

[Colorado Kid]

All of the above will work.

I for one feel comfortable when I'm under my Gross Compbination Weight Rating and all Axel Weight Ratings, even if I'm over on GVW.

Having said that, 2800# is a mighty big load to add to the back of a 2500HD. It would put mine right at the rear axel weight rating (when added to the weight of the hitch itself anyway).

2,000# of hitch weight, when added to familly and gear puts me over GVWR but leaves a lot of room on both axels. I'm comfortable with that. Some are not.

[sonofagun]

Biker,

I just sold my '01 2500HD and ordered an '04 3500 dually. I pull a 13500# 5th wheel with three slides and 2800# on the king pin. I was very close to the GVW and pushing the tire capacity. I also had a 43 gal aux. tank in the bed to augment the lousy sized 26 gal factory tank. I like to carry lots of stuff for my fishing trips to Utah. When I weighed it all it was really on the tire capacity line and over the GVW. The real truth on weight is to load it up and take it to the scales. The results can be MUCH higher than you thought.

My reasoning for going to the 3500 was:
I could rely on the airlift bags to carry the extra weight, no problem and I could go to 265s to take care of the tire issue, no problem. BUT at the end of the day I was outside GMs specs. If I had an accident and anyone weighed my rig (not too likely but..) would my insurance cover it? If I pushed it too far and hurt my family? Just decided that the extra capacity of the dually made it safer all around. The new (to GM) SRW 3500 is just a 2500HD with bigger tires and an extra spring and I already had that. Will a 2500HD do it? I think so (I pulled to Utah twice) but in Oct. the new ride will be here and I'll be more at ease. Gotta relearn to drive a tank thought (been a long time since VN).

Good luck,
Bob

[Colorado Kid]

This insurance company angle comes up once in a while and I don't understand it. . . has it ever happened to anybody that the insurance company didn't pay because of being overloaded?

The guy that hit and totalled my Volvo while my family was in it was at more than twice the legal blood alcohol content and his insurance still paid for my car and his, not to mention our medical bills. I don't expect that any time somebody violates a speed law or traffic signal they become self-insured so what's so sacred about the GVWR?

OK, I'm off my high horse and in my nomex suit.

[wushaw]

Biker,
My fifth wheel weighed 15320 last trip to Colorado and my pin weight was 3920.
Your truck will pull it without any problems...panic stops and mountains are your only worries.

[mdrag]

biker Wayne,

Hopefully Mav will post a reply to this topic. He's been on the road and busy with the move from Alaska.

Mav towed 'heavy' as a hotshot with his 2001 3500 with the stock wheels and tires, and then converted to 19.5". He also has a 2500HD. Plenty of experience with near back-to-back towing with the different configurations.

[Jayhawker]

Biker,

I made the mistake of weighing my 2001 2500HD 4x4 and 5th wheel in May. I was well over the tire ratings. After considering the same options you are now, I bit the bullet and traded for a 2003 3500 (with 2x4 to help keep the weight down).

If you have wide towing mirrors, you will soon get used to watching your fender flares as you go through drive-throughs, etc. I am beginning to feel fairly comfortable with the dually now. Switching from 4x4 to 2x4 also helped in parking lots . . . it turns sharper. (Yes, I know there will be times I will miss having 4x4.)

[biker Wayne]

I've done a few mods and really don't want to part with my 2500HD because its set up the way I want. I've found a company called Arrowcraft that makes wheel adapters, front and rear, for dually rims. They also make dually fenders that can be sanded and painted. Anyone see a problem in this approach? Anyone heard of doing this to a 2500HD? Essentially I would be converting a 2500 to a dually. I know of a spring place that could easily add the 3rd stage overload springs. With the air bags, I should be all set.
Is a dually really more stable while towing, or is it a safety factor having 2 rear tires on each side instead of 1?
Other than 6 wheels instead of 4 and 3 stages of springs instead of 2, I don't know of any other differences between the 2500HD and the 3500. The brakes, frame and differential should be the same on the 2500HD as on the 3500. Any other differences I don't know about?

[mdrag]

biker Wayne,

Arrowcraft is the company that made the adapters for my 19.5", and they are great to deal with.

mdrag

[sonofagun]

Biker,

I almost went with the conversion to dually deal too. It should be fine. My signature shows a lot of good conversions too. I found a guy willing to pay for the extras on my truck, made the move easier. The 3500 DRW advantage is the extra carrying capacity of the extra two wheels, tires and additional spring. I wondered how hard it would be to sell a 2500HD dually at a later date. I am considering pulling the extra spring and relying on the airbags to replace them (much better empty ride without that slapper spring in place). My truck was a SWB CC and I might like to convert to a true air suspension in the rear. Couldn't find a decent product for a SWB unit. The biggest problem is keeping a $40k plus truck from becoming a $50k plus truck :rolleyes:

Colorado,

My insurance co. (USAA) cautions against pulling loads over vehicle specs. If they do that do they care if I file a claim? If it's the other guys fault no one cares what you were doing or pulling. Like I said, I pulled over specs for the last year and didn't find the truck at all uncomfortable. That said, if it's about safety....
It only takes one trip where something goes wrong to cause incredible grief. I'd rather have an extra 1000# of rated capacity than be 1000# over.

My 2c anyhoo,

Bob

[Jayhawker]

Biker,

Converting to a dually or going to the 19.5" should work great. There is one consideration. A state DOT employee said you can modify your truck all you want, but only the truck manufacturer can change the GVWR and GCWR. ("Did you change the frame, brakes, etc. . . I don't care if they are the same as the manufacturer's 1-ton, only the manufacturer can certify that.")

I probably would have converted my 2500HD anyway but with all the rebates available from GM, I got a really good deal on a trade and eliminated the cost of the conversion.

[a64pilot]

biker Wayne,
Wouldn't you have to replace all six wheels plus the front hubs? I kinda think that the expense involved plus the possible devaluation of your current truck may cost more than selling it and buying a Dually.
You don't have a CC SB 4wd do you? Those things were selling so hot, I got my 2wd Dually for less.
Was thinking that you could sell your current truck and get into a comprable Dually for not much money, I don't know.
Another thought, try to find a Dually bed, sometimes they are removed by people and replaced with custom beds. I know it would be smarter to buy a cab and chassis, but when I was a contract welder in Oklahoma (years ago)several people did it.

[MAV]

I towed with my 2500HD on stock rubber and my 3500 on stock rubber and with the 225/70-19.5. The 19.5's are by far the best for stability. There is a increased stoping distance due to trying to stop more rolling mass but not much. I could feel it in the pedal. Tires in the 19.5's range in into the low $200 but will last 80 to 100K. Stock 16's you know about how long they last. For towing maxed out, the 19.5's rule.

[Ltrainracing]

MDRAG-sorry to bother, but may i ask where you purchased the alcoa wheels. thanks

[mdrag]

Ltrainracing,

I purchased the entire 19.5" package less tires from ARROWCRAFT.COM (http://www.arrowcraft.com). Bob @ Arrowcraft designed and machines the adapters and they are a work of art.

SOUTHWESTwheel.COM (http://www.southwestwheel.com) is another place to check for Alcoa wheels and accessories.

mdrag

[mdrag]

Maverick,

Glad to see that you are back on line after the move. Let me know if/when you are in the area.

mdrag

[biker Wayne]

Mav,
You said that the 19.5s are by far the best for stability. What about blowing a single rear 19.5? I've heard several people say that blowing a rear tire on a heavily loaded SRW can be severe. Others say that it is very unlikely to blow out a tire these days.
How do the 19.5s compare to Bridgestone Revos for ride comfort, quietness and especially traction on wet roads and in snow? What is the best brand in 19.5 tires?
Thanks for your input.
This forum is great for sharing the wealth of information.

[MAV]

I did shove a rock through the tread on the drivers inside dual when it was pretty much new. It was shaped like a spear head. No tire would have survived. I ran for several days without noticing it. Granted it was not a blowout but still ran serveral loads of freight on 5 tires and didn't know it. I don't believe I have seen a blowout in the last 10 yrs. Tires have come a long way.
Choice of tires? I only ran the Michelin XDE-MS. I sold the dually with 123,000 miles and the 19.5's had 45,000 on them. There was easily half thread left. All I can say to prolong your 19.5's if you get them is get a set of balancers from www.centramatic.com (http://www.centramatic.com)
They are awesome. Got go to Tomahawk shortly. Will try to get on late tonight.

[mdrag]

Check out the RICKSON TRUCK (http://www.ricksontruck.com/matchmount.html) site to read how they balance their 19.5" wheels/tires @ only $37.50 - $45.00 per wheel/tire :eek:

Dynamic balancers such as CENTRAMATIC (http://www.centramatic.com) or BALANCEMASTERS (http://www.balancemasters.com/trucks.html) cost about $90 - $100 PER AXLE. I choose to get the Centramatics since I did not know about the BM at the time.

mdrag

[MaxACL]

While delivering a tri-axle 5ver to Texas I had a blow out on my left outside tire. If I'd had a single wheel axle... who knows. Glad I have a dually. smile.gif

[Rick T]

I recently had a complete failure of an inner rear tire on my dually. Led me to consider 19.5" tires as well as spacers to permit a larger 16" tire, both options serving to provide greater single tire capacity in case of an undetected rear tire failure. The 19.5" setup is quite expensive and, despite owner comments to the contrary, is likely to have a pretty stiff ride when running empty. I'm just not comfortable with spacers despite the great care with which some of the makes have been fabricated.

I would go with the 19.5" setup in a heartbeat if I were towing heavy full time: my truck is towing a large (13,500 lb.) horse trailer only about 25% of the time.

I am serious considering tire pressure monitoring. A system to monitor my 6 truck tires and 4 trailer tires is about $600. This might be cheap insurance, especially since horse trailer tire failures are frequently undetected and result in a severe overload of the remaining 265/85R16E tire.

Rick T