Injector failure!

[338]

Ok, i'm coming to you guys for help. I just got a call from the service manager at the dealer, and my 2004.5 LLY has a bad #2 injector(only 12,000 miles on truck). The dealer said injectors are on national back order and doesn't know when they'll get any in. He told me to ask my friends(YOU) if they could get me one.
Anyone?

[jeffbentleyreich]

As of Monday of this week, I'm in the same "boat". Apparently, there are no dealers with these in-stock as they are allocated by VIN # on a first come first serve basis. I was told by GM cust. serv. that they are having a problem with some dealerships replacing injectors with the older style - which may be in-stock. The one thing I don't understand is why more people on this web site don't complain about GM not providing a rental car... for the back ordered parts??

[338]

I can, and will get a free rental. I just don't like the fact that my $42,000 truck is sitting waiting for 1 injector while I make payments on it.
I talked with a GM engineer this afternoon and found out there are serious supply issues for LB7 injectors but NOT LLY injectors. He actually said there is a surplus of LLY injectors right now. He verified this by making some calls for me. My hands are kind of tied right now because I need to get in contact wtih the Duramax quality manager, but he is on vacation till next monday(21st). So I probally won't have any resolution until then.
I can tell you per the fuel systems engineer I talked to, that the problem is bigger than the injectors themselves(LLY only). He told me they are working on a calibration program for the PCM, but dealers are just told to replace the injector thats out of spec.

[OC_DMAX]

The one thing I don't understand is why more people on this web site don't complain about GM not providing a rental car... for the back ordered parts??

Forget about the rental car, GM should do a recall and replace all the defective parts (yes - in each and every truck). That way people are not stranded for four weeks waiting for parts too show up. What a mess people are up against.

[jeffbentleyreich]

I would get a free rental within the 3yr/36k but not w/ the 100k on the engine. I feel bad for the guys that use it as a work truck - they're a little more expensive to rent... A service mgr at a large dealership just told me that he thought the '04 injectors were being used on the '01-03 trucks (LLY)?? I thought the '04 re-design was not compatable w/ the earlier heads. Anyway, the p/n of the injectors that are on national back-order is 97729095.

[OC_DMAX]

The LLY and LB7 use different injectors. Remember, the LB7 was produced for a period of time in a 2004 model truck. So technically, he is correct - 2001 to 2004 (LB7). Then mid-year a switch to LLY (2004.5 to 2005)

[338]

Update, my LLY injector is on its way to the dealership as I type(supposedly). Plus my truck got put on top priority for when the injector comes in. So I could have it back by tomorrow. Don't let your dealer feed you a line of crap! There are LLY injectors avaliable. According to my source, quite a few of them.

[lafrance]

338,
Would be interested to know what symptoms you had with the faulty injector. I also have an LLy which is currently running ok except for a some what unstable idle (in gear only and during warm-up only).
Thanks Lafrance

[Mac1234]

I had the same problem with my 04 LLY. Massive black smoke and rough running on the freeway doing 65 mph. Stop, turn the engine off for a minute, start it up and she's fine again, back on the freeway, no problems. This has happened twice now and it has only 450 miles on it. The dealer replaced the # 7 injector, but I have little confidence this will prevent this from happening again. There is something seriously wrong with some of these LLY's, as to many of us are experiencing this same problem. We will probably just have to wait for GM to sort this out.

[338]

lafrance, The symptoms you are describeing are exactly the same ones I have/had. Truck would rough idle when engine temps were between 160-180 with truck in gear and foot on the brake. It definitly sounds like you have a faulty injector.

[338]

Mac1234, I can tell you that GM engineers are very serious about getting these problems sorted out , and they are VERY aware they exist. I know they are working on a PCM update that is suppose to correct alot of these problems, but I was told its not due out for a few more weeks.

[lafrance]

338
Were these the only symptoms that you experienced and if possible can you tell me what criteria the injector failed on as far as dealership testing.My current dealer tells me that this is somewhat normal. I sure hope the GM engineers pay attention to this board as I will not tolerate any long term problems with this truck after owning a 94 6.5 that had 8 injection pumps replaced in 9 yrs of ownership.
Thanks Lafrance

[338]

Yes, those were the only symptoms I had.
I was told by the service manager that the #2 injector was out of range(I belive their suppose to be within a range of -6 to +6), and intemitintly sticking wide open. I don't actually have my truck back yet. But when I do i'll post exactly what the recipt says was wrong.

Don't feel bad, I had a 6.5TD that needed 2 injection pumps within 50,000, and that was as long as I owned the truck. I got smart and sold it for a problem free(put 100,000 miles) big block. If this d-max keeps doing the same thing then i'll probally have to buy a big block again.

[nampadmax]

I had an interesting encounter at the fuel pump across from my GM dealership. I meet my service rep. fueling a new GM3500 HD D/A--I asked if I could look at the LLY--which started an interesting conversation.I have the 03 2500 HDD/A with 12000--he said a lot of LB7's are coming in for injectors, some starting as soon as 70 miles-he feels the LLY will have much less problems--I'm not so sure--I asked if he'd heard the rumor that GM was considering discontinuing the Dmax-he said it wasn't talked about at his level--he felt that most LB7's would experience injector problems sooner rather than later in the life of the engine

[338]

Good news!, I have my truck back and it seems to be fixed 100%. It idles so smooth now.

Here is what they said.

12607 FAULTY FUEL INJECTOR #2 J5650 2.3 CHECKED N FOUND NEC
TO REPLACE #2 INJECTOR PER P0302. FOUND 14.7 MS INJECTOR
BALANCE RATE ON #2 INJECTOR WHILE MISFIRING. FOLLOWED FLOW CCHART FOR P0300. CLEARED CODE N TEST DROVE 8 MILES OK AT THIS TIME

[rickdlance]

I have an LLY that has 5 weak injectors according to the balance rate test. My dealer says they are on backorder.

[338]

Your dealer is wrong. My truck was diagnosed (wednesday) with a faulty #2 injector and its sitting in my driveway fixed today (friday). I work at GM and was in contact with the duramax fuel systems engineer, who then contacted the supplier, and was told there is actually a surplus of LLY injectors right now.

[ 08-20-2004, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: 338 ]

[OC_DMAX]

338 wrote: I work at GM and was in contact with the duramax fuel systems engineer, who then contacted the supplier, and was told there is actually a surplus of LLY injectors right now

338 - Just curious what this fuel systems engineer's thoughts are with the LB7 injector issue. Is it under control with the new style injectors they are installing? Or is the injector failures that are popping up on the DMAX just the "nature of the design"?

[lafrance]

Just left the dealer with my LLY which shows no 7 injector is bad. Received a phone call back stating that technical assistance wants all injectors flow tested. I was told a 30 day wait for lly injectors is more than likely. I hope this does not indicate problems in the future.

[letsgo]

Forgive ME for my sarcsm;;;;;;


Forget about the rental car, GM should do a recall and replace all the defective parts (yes - in each and every truck). That way people are not stranded for four weeks waiting for parts too show up. What a mess people are up against.
But do you mean as in the GENERAL replacing all of the tail gate supports, we are almost into the third month for replacement parts, all I can say is

GOOD LUCK

[quadrunner500]

I'm so depressed and disappointed in GM. I waited months for the re-designed dual mass flywheel, and still don't have it.

I remember reading where GM stated the Duramax diesel was the most extensively tested engine in the company's history. What am I supposed to believe, that they just got lucky with old reliable 350 small block V8?

And now, they are not handling the injector issue honorably. They know they installed and sold defective injectors, and rather than do the right thing, which is to recall the trucks and replace them, they offered me a piece of paper saying they extended the warranty for certain types of failures (not all). That is just unsatisfactory.

Mostly, I am disappointed in reading about how GM has handled some of YOUR claims. My 2001 Dmax had 46,000 miles, and zero injector problems, but under the circumstances, I believe it is not a matter of if, but when.

It's been said that GM reads this forum. I doubt they pay too much attention, but on the chance they are, it is with regret that I unloaded my 2001 Silverado 2500HD Duramax LS Reg Cab ZF-6spd last week, on the principal of the matter.

I'm not crying crocadile tears...nobody cares, and individually I don't matter.

[OC_DMAX]

Letsgo,

From my perspective, GM sold me a truck with a DMAX engine that they proudly had written up in magazines indicating a 200,000 miles life expectancy between major repairs (and yes I consider $5,000 to replace 8 injectors a major repair). Due to design problems with injectors, the engines they produced in 2001-2002 are only making about half of what was advertised. I believe that by 100,000 miles, the "average" DMAX produced in those years will have an injector problem. Obviously, by offering this extended warranty on injectors, GM must also believe they fell way short of their goal. From my perspective, the extended warranty needs to be for 200,000 miles period (delete the 7 year restriction). If that is unacceptable, then just replace all the defective parts now and be done with it. Not likely to happen when you sit down and figure the total cost and trucks involved. Probably not enough mechanics around to do the job. Good analogy with the tailgate strapes.