View Full Version : What does it honestly take to run a 14.0 with a Duramax?
Manual? Automatic?
Full weight.
Assume a 1.9 60' time.
Is it something that can be done on the stock turbo, stock injectors, stock internals?
Propane or Nitrous?
140 ADDITIONAL RWHP....CHIP( edge, TST, quad,tts reflash) WILL DO IF YOUR TRANNY WILL HOLD IT........ONE 6 SPEED HERE WITH A 14.1.........A COUPLE OF 13'S WITH AUTOMATICS.........USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION..........welcome to the show :D dave
McRat,
I ran a 14.1 on the stock tranny with a Hot Juice and 40 HP Predator tune stacked. I also have the K&N intake and 4 inch exhaust. The launch and traction were the biggest problems. That was with a 2.168 60 time, so if you could pull a 1.9 60 I think you would be there.
See the details here:
http://forum.thedieselpage.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=006119
The stock Allison will not handle that kind of power... for long...
A reg cab 2wd with slicks IF you can hook up, would be your best bet.
I'm pretty sure I could coax that kind of time out of mine at 7500# plus, but haven't tried yet.
Definitely possible on #2 only with the right setup.
Thanks for the replies!
So with the Auto, some tires (traction), a 4" exhaust, and a hipo tune (chip) should get me close?
Would I be better off with a Manual trans if I expected a daily driver truck to knock off (3-5)14.0's about once a month?
I think repeated bang shifting required to click off such times would take an early toll on the dual mass flywheel assy and clutch.
yup. auto would be alot easier to be consistant with. You may have a faster time here and there with a manual but it is hard to nail the shifts every time. It is very hard to be smooth with the zf.
Yeah, I'm pretty good with a manual, but I can't see a 7000lbs truck liking 2500 rpm launches too often or speedshifting. But then again, I don't really know.
Wheelhop might be another issue with a manual.
I guess I'll order the auto.
a64pilot
08-19-2003, 07:05
Question, isn't Michael Tomac in the 13's with a stock exhaust?
Might want to get suncoast to do the tranny before it's abused any, I think it's alot cheaper that way.
ah64pilot,
Suncoast to do the tranny? What do you base this on? What do you know about suncoast? What is wrong with keeping everything stock and enjoying the benifits of a long life for your truck?
the allison will not hold above 125 additional rwhp without slipping or going into limp mode.....it has to be beefed up........suncoast and a few others offer this performance improvement :D dave
Dog,
What is wrong with keeping everything stock and enjoying the benifits of a long life for your truck? I think the question was asked,
There is nothing wrong with leaving a truck stock.
But I'm shopping for a diesel so I can tow/commute M-F, then race it occassionally on weekends. Currently, it's easier to go fast in a diesel than a gasser (with the exception of the lightduty 2 passenger Lightning).
a64pilot
08-19-2003, 09:41
Bigdog,
Nothing, and that is probably the best thing for the majority of people.
However if you want to run a 14.0 1/4 mile I don't believe it's possible to do it with a stock tranny or at least not very many times that is. I also believe that it would be cheaper to beef up the tranny prior to adding any power to the engine. Since you are going to have to modify the tranny anyway you may as well do it for less, not more money.
Take me for example, I've slipped mine enough I believe that the only real option open for me is the $4,000 upgrade, eventhough I've only limped it once.
I've got a lot of experience with the old generation (mechanical) tranny's and with them the installation of a shift kit would often make a weak tranny worse. With them the only way to be sure was to start with all new friction material and unglazed/flat steels. I'll bet the Ally is the same
apilot
I still don,t get the big deal with drag racing your truck for time? Most kids get over this by 19 or 20! Tell me, do you spin the rear tires on your truck to impress your friends? I say stay stock and enjoy!
welcome by the way .......just hangout and read....use the search functions....you will figure it out. Lots of us here are just like hd nate we all have the desire for a bigger and better mouse trap..........to each their own :D dave
dmaxalliTech
08-19-2003, 09:57
stay stock :eek: :eek:
No such thing on this board, NOBODY in here is STOCK. NOBODY...
Some might think they are but they put synthetic in the last time they changed the oil....
I can tell you that my clutches and steels were in pretty good shape. Daily driver with Hot Juice and at least 7 or 8,000 miles with the HJ/Predator stack. Joe even asked if I had ever limped the tranny since they were in such good shape.
I have only limped the tranny once. I always started slow with the power addtions and always gave the Allison many days to learn shifting with the extra power. I have ran the truck balls out at the track many times with sometimes ten or more runs a day.
The 14.1 runs were with the stock tranny and high Georgia heat/humidity. (all #2, 7300 plus pounds, 2WD launch also) On a cool day I think I could have broken out of the 14's with no trouble. The truck did not limp and like I said the clutches and steels were pretty damn good.
I always was aggressive with fluid and filter changes and it was holding fine. I got the Suncoast upgrade because I knew I was at the highest level I could go without a stronger tranny. Maybe my stock one was not as sensitive as some others out there, who knows.
I think that would be ok to start with the stock tranny and then upgrade before your warranty goes out if you are really wanting to race a good amount. You can run mid 14's all day long on the stock tranny with the Hot Juice and not cook anything.
If you want to get into the 13's right out of the gate then get the tranny. :D
ratlover
08-19-2003, 10:26
Bigdog
I'm 22 so does that mean its ok that I want a mid 14 sec truck or am I now too old for that? :rolleyes:
Just because some like to drive fords dont make em wrong. To each his own, do what makes you happy and I will do what makes me happy.
What do they say about a Harley thing again? :confused:
Originally posted by BigDog1:
apilot
I still don,t get the big deal with drag racing your truck for time? Most kids get over this by 19 or 20! Tell me, do you spin the rear tires on your truck to impress your friends? I say stay stock and enjoy! Well, I'm 43 and both me and my wife dragrace as a hobby. I used to desert race, and drag bikes as well. I also AutoX. I've been racing since 1975. Hopping up tow vehicles has been a tradition at the track since they first started towing their cars.
I don't spin the tires on the Van to show-off, but I do slide it around corners and have been 70mph on dirt fireroads in it. Many a hapless hunter has refused to get in a truck with me after their first ride. ;)
You should go to the track once and check it out. It's good clean American fun.
a64pilot
08-19-2003, 11:09
Dog,
If you want to stay stock that's fine. Freedom of choice is one reason I'm proud to be an american. There must be many people that don't want to stay stock or there wouldn't be so many aftermarket parts. No I don't spin my tires for my friends, never had the truck on a track, too heavy for that. I mainly enjoy the fact that I can if I want to. Last year I put a NO2 system on the old Camaro LT1 because the old lady's new SS LS1 would eat it's lunch. I'm still on the original bottle. Hardly ever use it, but I can if I want too :D
Better mouse trap is probably a good analogy. Besides it's My money I'll spend it however I want too. Tinkering is fun to me, some people enjoy buying lottery tickets. I think ther'e wasting their money, I'll even tease friends about it, but, bottom line, it's their money and if it brings them enjoyment, then maybe it's money well spent after all.
a64pilot
If you want to go that route, ok! By the looks of your profile I see that you are a Military Pilot? Is this true or are you just a Crewchief (mechanic) that wants to fly? Why do you not get some JetA from work and see if that helps! I still say stock is best!! The life of your engine will suffer!!!!
[ 08-20-2003, 10:49 AM: Message edited by: BigDog1 ]
Silver Bullet
08-19-2003, 13:02
I agree with BigDog...stay stock! I will like my truck better if it is exactly like every other pewter CC D/A driving down the road. I am going to start my restoration today!!! :D
I'll check 'em off as they get restored...
Truck Mod 1 - K&N Air Charger
Truck Mod 2 - Westin Nerf Bars
Truck Mod 3 - Tahoe Carpet Floor Mats
Truck Mod 4 - Front Windows Tinted
Truck Mod 5 - Rhino Spray-in Bed Liner
Truck Mod 6 - 285/75r16 BFG AT KO
Truck Mod 7 - OEM Bed Caps
Truck Mod 8 - Automatic Headlight Override
Truck Mod 9 - Pro Comp Pre-runner and "Rolling Daylight"
Truck Mod 10 - Fog Light Controller
Truck Mod 11 - Homelink
Truck Mod 12 - Fumoto Valve
Truck Mod 13 - GPS Mount
Truck Mod 14 - Invinca-Shield
Truck Mod 15 - Painted Grill Bowtie Lt. Pewter
Truck Mod 16 - Custom Fog Light Brace
Truck Mod 17 - Orange DRL's
Truck Mod 18 - Custom Paint under the hood
Truck Mod 19 - Rims...Weld Outbacks
Truck Mod 20 - 38 watt fog light bulbs
Truck Mod 21 - Valentine-1 Radar Detector (hard wired)
Truck Mod 22 - Rancho Steering Stabilizer
Truck Mod 23 - Dynomax muffler
Truck Mod 24 - Outerwears for K&N
Truck Mod 25 - Stereo Upgrade
Truck Mod 26 - Rancho RS9000 Shocks
Truck Mod 27 - Tekonsha Prodigy Brake Control
Truck Mod 28 - Velvet Ride Shackles
Truck Mod 29 - Allison Cooler Scoop
Truck Mod 30 - Dynamat in doors
Truck Mod 31 - B&W Turnover Ball
Truck Mod 32 - Pillar Gauges
Truck Mod 33 - Sylvania Silverstars
Truck Mod 34 - Unleashed power...Quadzilla Power
hey bmdmax welcome to the no slippin 5th club
You know it Super Dave! The only slippin and bangin I got goin on is......Um, well let's just say its not my tranny. :D
SoCalDMAX
08-20-2003, 08:53
Come on, Silver Bullet, don't lie!
By the time you get down to #34, you're gonna be so bored you'll put it all back on again!
Regards, Steve (Totally stock)
Silver Bullet
08-20-2003, 11:55
SoCal,
You are correct, sir! I had the thing about 1/2 restored last night and decided I just didn't like it as much, so I put it all back on!! :D
I even have one more mod lined up...adjustable wastegate...like the Bighead, but for a fraction of the price. After that I would say I have caught Mdrag...no more mods on the wish list!!! :cool: :D tongue.gif
chevmeister
08-20-2003, 13:32
stock??? isnt that what they call a truck gm forgot to add all the cool stuff to???
ratlover I pass the torch you may be the youngest member with a dmax ill be 23 end of august.
Alli-max
08-20-2003, 20:51
so whats next Aggie boy? Other than my Longhorns whipping your ARSE!!
You need.... you need...... PROPANE.
a64pilot
08-21-2003, 06:40
Dog,
Tried posting a reply yesterday, but it wouldn't post or let me on the BB again, is it just me or has the BB had problems lately?
Anyway what have I said or done that got you going? Of course engine life will suffer, drive train as well. I don't know maybe it will go from a 400,000 mile life to a 200,000 mile life or something. The old Z28 I speak of currently has 150,000 miles on it and has been run hard. I burnt a rear end and tranny out in three years on the Autobahn around Frankfurt. Engine runs strong and uses no oil. IMHO prevantitive maintenance is more important to a long life of an engine / drivetrain than hot rodding.
Jet A is basically kerosene, very similar to pure winter Diesel, as such it's BTU output, (specific heat it may be called but I'm not sure) is less than #2. Therefore you would get lower fuel mileage and less power than from regular Diesel. You wouldn't need a fuel heater in your filter though. Jet A is a very dry fuel, I don't think it would be very good for injectors.
As to what I do. I'm a retired military test pilot with 3,000 + hours in the AH-64 A&D. I currently work as a contract maintenance test pilot at the test activity at Ft. Rucker al. I did start my military career as a crew chief (something I'm proud of BTW) and am one of the very few test pilots that has his A&P liscense.
What do you do for a living?
Silver Bullet
08-21-2003, 06:55
Alli,
Adjustable wastegate...it is the last item on the list...I have the parts, but just have not installed.
Damn T-sips...GIG EM!!! :D
Originally posted by BigDog1:
apilot
I still don,t get the big deal with drag racing your truck for time? Most kids get over this by 19 or 20! Tell me, do you spin the rear tires on your truck to impress your friends? I say stay stock and enjoy! :eek:
Dog, did you just crawl out from under a rock???
Most NHRA drivers are well into their late 30's 40's and 50's.
Why is it when some people don
apilot
I am very impressed (if you are telling the truth about being a Test Pilot). What do you test? I think the Army makes you do things "By the book", is this still true? If what I have been told about Army Test pilots is correct, you just get to make sure they fly ok after repair! As far as what I do, I manage over 20K acres of the finest farmland Georgia has to offer. We are mostly into Peanuts with some cotton this year! I'll tell you! This old farm boy could teach you a thing or two about basic mechanics and long term reliability. I hope those helicopters don't get your tender loving upgrades to enhance their performance!!
Greg McCall
08-21-2003, 11:25
Originally posted by Silver Bullet:
I agree with BigDog...stay stock! I will like my truck better if it is exactly like every other pewter CC D/A driving down the road. I am going to start my restoration today!!! :D
I'll check 'em off as they get restored...
Truck Mod 1 - K&N Air Charger
Truck Mod 2 - Westin Nerf Bars
Truck Mod 3 - Tahoe Carpet Floor Mats
Truck Mod 4 - Front Windows Tinted
Truck Mod 5 - Rhino Spray-in Bed Liner
Truck Mod 6 - 285/75r16 BFG AT KO
Truck Mod 7 - OEM Bed Caps
Truck Mod 8 - Automatic Headlight Override
Truck Mod 9 - Pro Comp Pre-runner and "Rolling Daylight"
Truck Mod 10 - Fog Light Controller
Truck Mod 11 - Homelink
Truck Mod 12 - Fumoto Valve
Truck Mod 13 - GPS Mount
Truck Mod 14 - Invinca-Shield
Truck Mod 15 - Painted Grill Bowtie Lt. Pewter
Truck Mod 16 - Custom Fog Light Brace
Truck Mod 17 - Orange DRL's
Truck Mod 18 - Custom Paint under the hood
Truck Mod 19 - Rims...Weld Outbacks
Truck Mod 20 - 38 watt fog light bulbs
Truck Mod 21 - Valentine-1 Radar Detector (hard wired)
Truck Mod 22 - Rancho Steering Stabilizer
Truck Mod 23 - Dynomax muffler
Truck Mod 24 - Outerwears for K&N
Truck Mod 25 - Stereo Upgrade
Truck Mod 26 - Rancho RS9000 Shocks
Truck Mod 27 - Tekonsha Prodigy Brake Control
Truck Mod 28 - Velvet Ride Shackles
Truck Mod 29 - Allison Cooler Scoop
Truck Mod 30 - Dynamat in doors
Truck Mod 31 - B&W Turnover Ball
Truck Mod 32 - Pillar Gauges
Truck Mod 33 - Sylvania Silverstars
Truck Mod 34 - Unleashed power...Quadzilla Power Damn....I'm feel so inadequate with my couple add ons :( I dont even know what some of that stuff is Silver Bullet.
a64pilot
08-21-2003, 11:39
Alright Dog,
Where in Ga.? Peanuts and cotton Huh, must be some where in South Ga.
Do you have any idea what is required to track and balance a rotor system? didn't think so
BTW who do you think makes sure the engines etc. operate to spec. on the Acft the XP's (Chuck Yeager types) fly.
Back to where in GA., Albany was home to me, a lot of south Ga. is within my local flying area.
What does it take to do 14.0? 2 things for me.
I have gone 14.098 @ 92.5 mph with my 2001 Sierra 2500HD D/A SLT Longbed. My mods:
1) Hot Juice
2) K&N filter
That is ALL the mods I have. Stock exhaust, tires, everything. This was in 90 degree weather at NHRA dragstrip Gateway International Raceway in St. Louis, MO on July 11, 2003.
60' in 1.8's generally.
It would be quicker and faster but defueling on shifts, and some powerdown when it detects trans slippage, limits things. ET's were from 14.3 to 14.0 on 4 passes that day.
Had gone 14.24, 92.5mph with Juice 3.5 and BD PowerPlay module stacked, would bump up BD after 70mph otherwise could get trans slip.
SoCalDMAX
08-21-2003, 12:18
Originally posted by Alli-max:
so whats next Aggie boy? Other than my Longhorns whipping your ARSE!!
You need.... you need...... PROPANE. LMAO! SB, you gonna let him get away with this?
There are 2 easy ways to get him good. Sneak over the night before and stuff a rag in the rain gutter. then laugh and tell him you didn't think it was all that effective anyways.
Or drain a 1/2 QT of coolant out of his system. He'll have it down to the dealer so fast for a headgasket replacement it'll make your head spin. Don't tell him you drained it till after, though. ;)
Have Fun! :D
BigDog,
Everyone has their opinion, most people on here have chosen to add a few mods, I'm sure they realize added power decreases engine life to some extent.
Have you seen any posts by peanutgrower? Now there's a peanut farmer with a serious problem with modifications. ;) Multiple boxes, propane, wheelhop, shredded tires, broken tie rods from
4WD launches. He even bought a spare motor. Either to tinker with or to replace the one he's trying desperately to blow up. :D
PS: I get 1 or 2 phone calls a day from some maniac on his cell phone, more often than not he's telling me how he's doin' 100+ mph and just got done eating some Cummins, or Ford, or sports car owner's lunch. He's not a young 'un and I'm not gonna say he's the model of maturity or wisdom, but he sure is having fun from the Heart of Dixie!
Regards, Steve
Originally posted by a64pilot:
Alright Dog,
Back to where in GA., Albany was home to me, a lot of south Ga. is within my local flying area. I can see it now....... Apache in full spread over BigDogs peanut patch....
Roasted peanuts anyone
:D :D
http://pao.hood.army.mil/21CAV/21cav-photo/ah64a/a43.jpg
[ 08-21-2003, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: hoot ]
Crimiee! I'm 55- ready for the casket! Somebody look under there and see if that thing's got a 5"
exhaust will ya?!
Old zip :eek:
Silver Bullet
08-21-2003, 13:38
Greg - Shoot me an e-mail... :D
SoCal - I was thinkin' the same thing...lay down a few miscellaneous fluids under the truck and watch him run!!! I let him poke at me for being an Aggie, but it sure beats being from the land of granola eatin', tree huggin' sandel wearin' liberals in Austin!!! :D
Hoot - LMAO...roasted peanuts! :D
Desert Diesel
08-21-2003, 14:41
I'm on my 3rd set of tires and only have 26,000 on the odometer. Is that a bad thing? ;)
:D I KNOW THAT TIRE FEELING :D
Dog,
I would not even think of trying to demean a64, he is the real thing.
-- Wanna fight? Pick one with me. :D
How many times can you turn those cotton/peanut fields?
Burner-----> :D
SoCalDMAX
08-21-2003, 22:51
Originally posted by Silver Bullet:
Greg - Shoot me an e-mail... :D
SoCal - I was thinkin' the same thing...lay down a few miscellaneous fluids under the truck and watch him run!!! I let him poke at me for being an Aggie, but it sure beats being from the land of granola eatin', tree huggin' sandel wearin' liberals in Austin!!! :D
Hoot - LMAO...roasted peanuts! :D you haven't seen Granola eatin', tree huggin', sandal wearin', bunny luvin', "free healthcare and welfare for illegals", eco-terrorist, gun control, "I voted for Doofus Davis", "politically correct" knot-heads until you've been to SoCal. You have no idea how unpopular being a gun totin' oil burner makes me... somebody even called in to the CARB and reported my Toyota diesel as a gross polluter! Then I checked off the box for "diesel" and they left me alone.
Wait till CHRISTMAS time when they have the "Holiday Party" at work. I take great pleasure in calling it the CHRISTMAS PARTY. Just to watch all the PC squirm. ;)
Regards, Steve
Dear ahpileofit
Do you think you can get to me with simple threats! Roasted Peanuts sound good to me! You boys seem to get a little flustered when someone questions your choice of modifications, whats up with the sensitive natures? Apache pilots need to be tough guys, not some soft, old retired crybabies. You should leave the flying to the young guys that can back up their words! Get over it!!
PS Stay stock!!
BIG DOG I realize you are new here but read the topic of the thread you are posting to "what does it honestly take to run a 14.0 with a duramax"that was the question. Anyone who knows anything about these trucks know that is Impossible stock. We all have made choices and concessions(longevity,tire wear,lower fuel economy) for the modifications we have made. If you dont agree thats fine make your point and move on to a thread about how long do stock tires last on stock trucks or how to change a fuel filter but dont come here trying to pick a fight because you dont agree. Just give us a break. ANd when you see a white dmax come by you, with a trail of black smoke, on one of those georgia highways that I frequent regularly Just know It was probably me.......Chevy makes a great truck people like Edge, and Suncoast just make it that much better :D dave
a64pilot
08-22-2003, 07:54
Well, I really didn't think the pig farmer would answer.
No threat Dude, I didn't post anything about Roasted peanuts and I'm sure Hoot meant that only as a joke. I am very concious of my rotor wash and don't hurt anyone's plants, I would never affect anyone's living. My point was I could fly over your pig farm if you really didn't believe I was for real, as long as you are in my local flying area. To go outside of it requires a reason and I don't think this is enough enough ;)
The point is though that this kind of retoric is outside the realm of the question that was asked, you know off topic, wasting time. If you disagree then how about starting your own topic on how great it is to be stock or something.
There's nothing wrong with that, and if you make your living with your truck it's probably the smart thing to do.
Some of us however have no real need for our trucks, we have them primarily because we like them, the're our toy's. We enjoy putting useless items on them to dress them up, maybe hot rodding them and discussing them with others of the same interests. If for some reason that bother's you, well get over it.
ratlover
08-22-2003, 08:40
Originally posted by blue:
What does it take to do 14.0? 2 things for me.
I have gone 14.098 @ 92.5 mph with my 2001 Sierra 2500HD D/A SLT Longbed. My mods:
Schweeeet! I think thats about the best I have heard with just the juice. Makes me think/hope low 14's wont be hard with my reg cab :cool:
Now I just need 3 things to happen....snow so I can replinsh my toy fund, the juice to come out with the controller, and me to hit 10k. Wonder wich will happen first? The way its been going I think I will still be waiting on the edge :rolleyes:
I wonder if he is a troll, a major pot stir type, or just stupid? :confused: Its like walking into a biker bar and yelling Harley sux and wondering why every one is giving dirty looks. You go to a web site that is populated mostly by guys that are into truck modification, walk into a thread about modification, and spout off about how one should stay stock. I can see if he was just curious and being diplomatic and just asking a question but that dont seem to be the case.
If you dont like to mod your vehicle then stick to the posts that dont deal with it. How hard is that??? Is this some difficult concept to grasp?
Hey bigdog,
You had to pay to be able to post to this board. My observation is that so far, you are wasting your money.
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