RivNuts

[felpa41]

Based on the comments I have seen about the convenience of this hardware, I want to install RivNuts in the fender liners of my truck.

Problem is, I am unfamiliar with exactly what I need to buy and where I can but them. I live in a small town and no one has ever heard of them or knows where to get them. Evidently there is a tool that is required to install them and then you need stainless steel screws and perhaps washers to complete the installation.

I would sure appreciate it if someone would be kind enough to give me the specifics of exactly what, how many, and where to purchase this hardware.

A store name, web site, or telephone number with the details of exactly what I need to purchase is what is needed. I hate to try to purchase this stuff and find that I have guessed wrong as to what I need and end up getting the wrong thing.

I have a Mega Filter Kit from Kennedy Diesel and I will need to be removing the fender liner on a routine basis to get at the fuel filter.

Thanks for any help, and please excuse my ignorance!

John Kennedy:
Why not offer this hardware (and the required tool) as an option with your Mega Filter kits? It would be a real convenience if you did that.

[ 04-24-2003: Message edited by: felpa41 ]</p>

[a64pilot]

Rivnuts as used for aircraft are a nut that is held or secured by a bent piece of sheet metal. The bent piece of sheetmetat is usually secured by two small solid rivets. This allows the nut to be held so that no backup wrench is required to install a panel screw etc. I assume this is what you are talking about. The only installation tool you should need is a drill and a cheap pop rivet gun should work as it does not have to be air worthy.
I should imagine that any good hardware store would carry them.

[Bud]

Search with Google. You will find many suppliers
Good Luck
Bud

[woundedbear]

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=1210

Just about to order myself one.

[SoMnDMAX]

Fastenal is probably your best source.. The closest branch to you is in Hutto, Texas according to the store locator on their website. Avdel Cherry (Textron) makes the fasteners- page #349 in Big Blue Book volume 3...

www.fastenal.com

[pinehill]

What size Rivetnut is used for the fender liner application?

[CntrlCalDmax]

The part a64 described, we call a nutplate. A rivnut (or nutsert) is a hollow threaded rivet that is installed with a special tool or you can get an adapter for a poprivet gun. Some have a tappered lower end that when installed slides into the upper part and expands the upper part solid in the hole. Others have a head and when installed the part just under the sheet metal expands like a tubing bead. A genuine aircraft rivnut isn't very good. The hardware store nutserts are much better especially when installed with a little epoxy. I tried a 10-32 (3/16") rivnut and the existing body holes are too big so I think we will need to go to a 1/4".

[jbplock]

I got the tool and a box of 1/4 Aluminum Rivet Nuts from JC Whitney (looks like the one on harbor freight). The JCW tool is OK but I don't think it's going to last too long using it with 1/4 Rivnuts. I would like to find a better one. The metal used for JCW tool is quite soft. The 1/4 in size RivNut is the size to use but it requires the holes in the body to be opened up slightly with a drill. Be careful with the hole under the coolant overflow tank. On mine there wasn’t enough clearance to drill without removing the tank. I reused the plastic fastener on this one but I plan to replace it with a clip-nut the next time I remove the liner. Using some epoxy is good idea too. It would prevent the Rivnut from becoming loose smile.gif

[ 04-24-2003: Message edited by: jbplock ]</p>

[a64pilot]

CntrlCalDmax,
I stand corrected sorry. Don't you think that a nut plate would be better for this? A nut plate will allow for some misalignment and be less likely to loosen up wouldn't it?

[CntrlCalDmax]

a64,

You are correct. I think a nutplate would be the best. Especially a floating nutplate (easier to start the screws). It will last longer and then you could stay with a 10-32 pan head screw for sufficent area under the head. It also uses a selflocking nut to prevent the screw from loosening. The only drawback is you have to be able to access the back side to install it. With a rivnut you can install it from the working side only. That is the only benifet from using a rivnut that I can see. Next time I have the fender panel removed I plan to check out the access to the back side.

BTW, one major drawback with a rivnut is if it wears out, strips or starts to spin in the frame it can be a real b.... to remove.

Leo

[a64pilot]

CntrlCalDmax,
Why couldn't you install the nut plate with a cherry lock rivit so that you would not have to have acsess to the back of the nut plate? That way you don't have to buck a solid and a cherry lock or cherry max is I believe more than strong enough.

[CntrlCalDmax]

a64,

Cherry rivets would be an overkill, but could be used if you can find them small enough. The problem is the nutplate is designed to be installed on the back side of the structure just like a standard nut goes on the back side. If you install it on the front side, the piece it holds will not fit flush up against the piece with the nutplate and also all of the force will be through the rivets. The rivets only function sould be to hold the "nut"plate in place until the screw is installed and toruqed.

Hope this makes sense.

Leo

[a64pilot]

Leo,
It makes perfect sense. I have not looked but surely there is the 1/8 of an inch clearance or so required for a nut plate. If not then one would have to be very careful about screw length when using a rivnut.

[CntrlCalDmax]

a64,

You are right about the screw length. I've seen a $.02 screw that was too long do $thousnads of damage and down time. A quick look behind to be sure and all should be fine.

Another fastener idea would be to install cowling quarter turn fasteners, kinda like camlocks but the newer ones like on the Cessna twins. That would be really fast. A quarter turn on each and off comes the liner. Plus if you install them with the ring clip they stay mounted in the liner. Kinda expensive though. About $7.00 ea. set.

[jbplock]

I also looked in to

[FirstDiesel]

You guys are WAY over engineering this thing. It's a fender well not the Space Shuttle.
All your looking to do is replace the fastners that GM used. Space is not a problem, length of screws are not a problem. Working area is not a problem. This is a simple thing. Use whatever you want it's an easy job. The RivetNuts work fine with some 1/4-20 screws and a washer under the head of the screw to spread the load.

[ 04-26-2003: Message edited by: FirstDiesel ]</p>

[a bear]

FirstDiesel,
Thats just the way I installed them. Used the 1/4" aluminum rivet nuts W/SS bolts and 1/4" X (5/8 or 3/4 OD SS stove washers). There is a lot of thread on these and they should last a long time if not the life of the truck. If they by some chance go bad the alum drills out easily for a new one.
Like Bill said, just be carefull when drilling the top one under the coolant bottle.

[TBC]

A good hardware store that has open bin hardware should have the nutplates. They slip over the edge of the metal and come in long and short lengths. The hole edge distance determines which one to use. They are simply a piece of metal bent over with the threaded part punched to accept sheetmetal screws. There is another type that you use as a nut but is not secured to the metal so that it will stay in place. The local True Value hardware store here in Hurst has them. They appear to be the same ones I have used on aircraft. They are about $.05 each. They don't have to be riveted in place.
http://www1.thomasregister.com/ss/.75627262222/catalog.cgi?uuid=THpihq&sid=75627262222&search_type=product&search_string=Fasteners&az=68770627&seq=9&pn=0022920&st=&pdm=&sort=&ph=

Go to the threaded fasteners and scroll down to the stamp spring nuts for info and picts of the slip on type nuts.


Tom

[ 04-26-2003: Message edited by: TBC ]</p>

[jbplock]

I just bought a Marson MAR34501 from a local fastener
supplier. It's smaller than yours but very strong. It has cast head vs.
the stamped sheet metal type I bought from JC Whitney. I don't think
the JCW tool would last through one box of 1/4in Al Rivnuts
as the mandrel bent on the first one.
I used RivNuts on some blind holes when installing
my J&J millennium boards this week. They worked great!
smile.gif

[ 09-25-2005, 03:25 AM: Message edited by: jbplock ]

[hoot]

I work in the aircraft industry. It's our company tool.

[Kennedy]

A-HA!

Now I see what you are talking about...

I have an old Nutsert kit from Kar Products. It involves a screw that pulls the nutsert and expands it while you hold a pipe looking handle that keeps the insert from rotating.

Dunno if these are still available.


Personally, I have a can of CRC spray dielectric grease that I shoot my plastic pins with before re-installing. I find that they come out quite nicely this way...


BTW, that Riv nut tool that Hoot has looks to be MUCH faster!

[ 05-16-2003: Message edited by: kennedy ]</p>