View Full Version : "Hot Juice" Feedback !
Toddster
09-26-2002, 16:56
Well, the Big Brown truck showed up today (No, DJ wasn't driving) and with him he brought my new Hot Juice and heavy rain till at least Saturday afternoon ! DAMN IT ! No sense in taking a level 4 rip or getting my clean truck dirty. To my suprise I had been running a 4.2, thought it was a 4.3, what is the major difference between the two just for future reference ? So, Hot Juice Studs and Studettes, watcha think ? Any tire melting burnouts, Cop calling neighbors, $700 speeding tickets, Devorce ? Lets hear it !!
Toddster,
Now don't be getting the cops all angry around here yet !!!!! You know if they see a black flash there coming right to my house first !!!!!! Seems I stepped into a technicality in my Juicy Juice showing up....Just as well since it's raining ........
MAC :(
Lets go you know who, times a wasting, get that delivery truck at my door step!!!!!!!!! :eek:
Feels pretty good. Sure is a big jump from 3 to 4. :D Puff of smoke and your gone. :D :D :D I just wish it didn't defuel as much on the shifts :confused: . I'm happy.
Pete
Toddster
09-26-2002, 17:27
Thats what I was afraid of.....My 4.2 defueled big time at shift points, that SUCKS !
Run T/H with level 4 and you won't have to worry about defueling between shifts.
Mine seems to defuel more in T/H. Once when it shifts then again when the the converter locks up. Felt my trany slip a tiny little bit in 5th gear after it was all locked up, only once. :D
After making a half dozen full-throttle runs, mine quit defueling with 4.0.
Blaine
damn all hurricanes and tropical depressions.............spin spin spin i cant win. :mad: dave.........what was that 70's song by ELO......?mister blue sky?.....come on blue sky and dry pavment
[ 09-26-2002: Message edited by: sdaver ]</p>
with v3.5 on level 4 I get a slight pause (defuel) between shifts
with v3.5 level 4 using T/H there is no pause (defuel) between shifts, it just gets up and goes banging gears along the way
Super Juice should be here tomorrow... Last test & tune of the season so I'm going to the track.
can anyone explain how to make the allison go into quick learn or relearn?........have heard it mentioned just never new how....thanks dave
Toddster
09-26-2002, 18:12
Does the "Hot Juice" raise governed RPM ?
no not that im aware of.dave
Toddster
09-26-2002, 18:23
Funny, seems anyone creating these box or ECM "programs" and is claiming say over 100 hp is raising redline by about 200 rpm.
ok kennedy or juice give us the skinny as mac says and maybe answer the trans question.....please....dave
MadDuraMax
09-26-2002, 18:35
sdaver,
Check the drive train forum. Seems the forced Alli relearn may be a myth. You need a TechII.?
Mark
sdaver ,
If you didn't all ready find out it's easy...Here Tiss the SKINNY !!!!!!
Find yourself a deserted road...
Bring her, him ,whatever, up to 50-60 mph.......
Take foot off throttle.......
At the same time drop that baby down into first gear....... :eek:
Let it cost till it makes it's final shift into first.....
Repeat....
Repeat......
DRIVE IT LIKE YOU STOLE IT !!!!!!!!!
Have fun guys !!!!!!!!! This is the fast learn !!!!!!! Memory eraser !!!!!!
MAC
:D tongue.gif :D
Toddster,
NOPE !!!!!!!
[ 09-26-2002: Message edited by: mackin ]</p>
Alli-max
09-26-2002, 21:39
NO!!!!! Dont listen to mackin!!!
Wait.. maybe he is finally right... I think he is... ;)
That is the correct way to drop your tranmis... I mean to quick relearn. SERIOUSLY... It works. The 1st time I tried it, I thought, 'man, I will be getting a tow to the dealership in 5 minutes.' NOPE! It works. Done it myself about 10 different times in a tranny friendly 80,000+ miles. IF you hear a clunk noise, call jackassin'.... I mean mackin :D :D
You guys aren't paying attention here.
Dropping the shifter to first does absolutely JACKO! to the transmission's upshift learn process.
Raising the RPM limit doesn't do anything more than allow a higher top speed. The HP peak comes DOWN when the boxes are applied, as evidenced by the dyno numbers posted by Clint. Now some of this is programming, but a lot is based on air/fuel delivery capabilities.
BTW, Edge has issued a liability disclaimer to be signed so any "Hot Juice" addict that goes out and tears up his/her truck doesn't get nasty with them. Good idea from where I stand...
[ 09-26-2002: Message edited by: kennedy ]</p>
JK
So you say the only way to reverse memory is to??????It will remember most current driving habits, then learn no more till a visit to a Tech 2 ???? Not in a constant learn mod ???? Just a little confused since when my POWER is pulled away cold once it makes one hard a shift it smoothes out fairly quickly with out additional temp, or it seems to anyway......So in theory I would think couple of forced downshift then some aggressive driving techniques (launches)would scramble the current memory......Or are you saying skip the down shifts and just drive like a friggen maniac and she'll learn,such as I do.....Want to elaborate a little......Your under no obligation......
MAC
:D :eek:
Quote=>BTW, Edge has issued a liability disclaimer to be signed so any "Hot Juice" addict that goes out and tears up his/her truck doesn't get nasty with them. Good idea from where I stand...
:rolleyes:
[ 09-27-2002: Message edited by: mackin ]</p>
KompressorMan
09-27-2002, 05:10
About fast learn and droppin the trans. I AIN'T doin it again. Once was enough. I did exactly as described and the only thing that saved me from eatin the steering wheel was the shoulder belt. It nearly tore out the drive train. WAY TOO ABRUPT. It went into first at about 27-28 MPH and WHOA. My mechanic at the stealership says the easy way is to disconnect both batteries, then tape hot and neg. cables together on both sides and let sit overnight. He says that was offered at a tech meeting. No More D to 1st. 4 me.
Herb smile.gif
Read this thread:
http://forum.62-65-dieselpage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=004000
I'm no Allison expert, but IIRC, there are multiple shift adapts:
1-2
2-1
2-3
3-2
3-4
4-3
4-5
5-4
AND commbine that with 3 seperate APP groups Light, mid, and full pedal???
Doing 3 downshifts at "0" APP may, in fact adjust the downshift characteristics at light throttle, but not much more...
LV TURBO BUICK
09-27-2002, 10:22
does anyone know the torque increase with the new hot juice? i know the hp is 125 but didnt see any torque numbers?
Toddster
09-27-2002, 10:51
I read 300 somewhere on this site. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I hate to repeat mis-information !
saw my buddie @ the buick place he reset my allison for fast learn took about 7 or 8 minutes.....then the programmer says it takes several passes through the gears to relearn......super juice seems to be smoother and less defueling between shifts(than 3.8).......and after the relearn even smoother. there seems to be a noticeable increase between 3 and 4(3 being the old level 4 and 4 being 125)the truck really moves.......hope to test and tune next thursday....maybe bust into the high 8's in the 1/8th :D :D :D
hdmax(mike)
09-27-2002, 13:14
If I understand this right, The 125 hp juice don`t give you 125 hp more then stock.
What it does is give 125 hp more then what stock does at 2500 rpm. And the same would go for torque. Correct?
So if the Duramax puts out 250 rwhp at 3200 but only 200 at 2500 rpm the hot shot gives about 75 more hp. But at a much more friendly rpm.
Am I on target here?
MadDuraMax
09-27-2002, 14:30
Ok, if you don't want to trust JK here's a cut an paste from a contact I have at GMC (his name, email, etc. removed by his request).
"The LCT1000 as set up in the GMC product will not enter the fast adapt mode through a gear selector routine. In order to enter fast adapt learn mode the tcm must be cleared and the process started using a Tech 2. There is a series of service bay shifts to be performed and then aprox. 12-14 additional shifts while driving to complete the "fast" stage of the relearn process."
I TRUST this guy and respect his request for privacy and keeping away from a flood of emails, otherwise I would post his name etc.
Mark
Foiled again !!!!!! But hey I learned about the fast learn here ...... ;)
Now I'm gonna have to stop in Ted's place again.....Well they'll proly going to want and see the NEW (I signed the waiver) SUPER "HOT" JUICE I installed just in time for the rain to start again today...... :mad: Plus I'll see how the dyno is coming along.....There's always tomorrow.....
MAC :D
MadDuraMax
09-27-2002, 16:46
Mac,
Not a slam at anyone on here, I've heard the "forced relearn" thing for months both on TDP and on other forums. This guy is an old business contact, not a friend or anything. He's worked in drive train and power transmission engineering at GM for god knows how long and I was suprised his email still worked.
I'll say one thing for him, with 10 years or so of working with GM as a corporate customer (105 vehicles a day) and as a supplier. He's been the ONLY engineering contact that has consistantly given me help and the straight scoop.
He has the same opinion of GM's corporate BS that most of us do. I wrote to him about Mike G's situation, but his reply is that he wouldn't even know where to start!!
Anyway please don't take anything in my post as a slam, I just got it on the board in a hurry and didn't explain much.
...now about your friends in Black and White... :D
IIRC it's sumtin' like this...
The" FastLearn" procedure is a series of tests that are run to allow the Transmission Control Module (TCM) to "Learn" (Adapt) to the characteristics of the clutch packs within the transmission. As each clutch packs data is learned, "FastLearn" stores the information in the adaptive cells for each clutch within the TCM. "FastLearn" will allow a repaired Allison 1000 Series™ transmission to be road tested after completion of the repair in as near -fully-adapted state as possible. This will allow the technician and customer to drive the vehicle in the adapted mode and reduce the number of technician and customer concerns after a transmission repair. The "FastLearn" procedure consists of four (4) steps (modes).
[ 09-30-2002: Message edited by: Mic ]</p>
Installed my HOT JUICE :D :D Today!!! tranny didn,t have to learn much as i ran my 3.61 juice
in level 4 all the time ...
Well ya step on the brake and bring up the boost
and smoke the tires and try to keep the rear wheels from passing you up, hang on look out rear view Big cloud of black smoke , look at speedo and
POOF 98 mph !!!!!!
:D :D :D :D
car of the week
09-27-2002, 19:00
MAD-MAX--
Did you notice any other differences between 3.61 and the 4.30 super? Less defueling? more low end power? anything? I am sending mine in Monday to do the 4.30 upgrade and the super. Any info would be appreciated.
Thanks
Ryan
[ 09-27-2002: Message edited by: car of the week ]</p>
can,t say anything about anything but the hot mode ..haven,t run it in anything else yet...
Hot mode is just like the 3.61 except more power and more smoke...in about all the same places :D
he mic thats what my(buick ) buddie did it takes as long to read it as it does to do it...................good post.
............dave :D
I have not had much time on the new Hot Juice yet, but have tried both level 3 $ 4 and can say that the 4.30 90HP level is a good improvement over the 3.61. More like the original 3.0 but smooooth! Now level 4!!..... Da#$! it's prabably a good thing it defuels at the shifts or things may get broken! Tranny mods are in our futures for sure. Aaron did warn me and probably others...here is the HOT version.. you asked for it...now it's your responsibility!
car of the week
09-27-2002, 20:09
" HOT JUICE" THAT IS WHY OUR TRANNYS HAVE WARRANTIES... ;) ;)
Thanks Mic,
I thought about posting that, but the little symbol at the bottom...
Thanks MaDura,
That should save me some time having to prove it!
KompressorMan
09-28-2002, 14:25
SDAVER, Where in the Heart of Dixie are you from boy? Oh yeah, how's ye mama and them?
Herb smile.gif
originally from Montgomery Alabama now reside in Northport.......dave :D
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