Duramax injector replacement expectations

[More Power]

Let everyone know what you think about truck ownership and Duramax injector replacement expectations.

[Turbo Al]

As a sidenote to the poll, I remember before the Duramax even came out that it was being billed as a 200,000 mile motor. Thus I am/will be fully prepared to rebuild or replace the motor at that time -- it will not be a BIG surprise to me if it goes south at or just before that mileage.
Is my memory faulty or does anyone else remember the 200,000 mile thing?
Al

[hd90rider]

Do not remember that,however after in the shop 3 times for injector related prob.starting at 215k it let loose at 282k & had to replace the engine.

[Diesel Brad]

Originally posted by Turbo Al:
As a sidenote to the poll, I remember before the Duramax even came out that it was being billed as a 200,000 mile motor. Thus I am/will be fully prepared to rebuild or replace the motor at that time -- it will not be a BIG surprise to me if it goes south at or just before that mileage.
Is my memory faulty or does anyone else remember the 200,000 mile thing?
Al Al,

GM's original target with the Duramax 6600 was at least 200,000 miles before any major component failure.

That can be interpreted a number of ways, and it's not to say they didn't exceed that target. I wouldn't necessarily call it a "life-to-overhaul" rating. Of course, depending on which "major component" fails I guess a complete overhaul may be necessary.

Brad

[Bigwheel]

quote from chevy reviews.com
http://www.chevyreviews.com/chevy_reviews/02_chevrolet_silverado_2500hd_3500_driv_imp.html

"The new Duramax 6600 diesel is smooth, quiet, and powerful. It punches out an amazing 520 lbs.-ft. of torque at just 1800 rpm. GM's Duramax diesel engine is built in Moraine, Ohio, but was developed with Isuzu, one of the world's largest manufacturers of diesel engines. The new 6.6-liter Duramax offers improved fuel economy over the old 6.5-liter GM diesel it replaced. The Duramax was designed for a 200,000-mile operating life, according to GM engineers, and for easy serviceability. Half of heavy-duty truck pickups are sold with diesel engines".

"As good as the six-speed manual is, the optional Allison five-speed automatic is one of the most impressive features of these trucks. We highly recommend it for its responsive performance. Available for the Vortec 8100 and Duramax engines, the Allison is designed to last 200,000 miles; GM engineers said it's "over-designed," meaning it's heavier duty than it needs to be. But it's also sophisticated and keeps in close contact with the driver and the engine with full electronic control. It adjusts shifting according to driving style. The Tow/Haul mode keeps the transmission in gear longer to reduce hunting and heat buildup. This transmission senses when the truck is going downhill, senses when the driver is applying the brakes and downshifts, reducing wear on the brakes. This grade braking feature works great; just touch the brake pedal as the truck is going down a grade. On a practical side, the Allison transmission is set up to make it easier to attach power take-off (PTO) accessories. It downshifts crisply as the truck comes a stop. The Duramax and Allison combination does not come cheap, however".

The one and only one readson I bought my dmax was to last at least 200,000 miles, as did the reviews state from GM engineers. Don't understand what happened to marketing and engineering??? :eek: :rolleyes:

[Jomar]

I`m glad to see that my vote is right in there with the majority. If they are going to say that it is designed for 200,000 miles, then they darn well oughta warranty it for that much. I realize though that there is that small percent of buyers that can tear up a crowbar.

jomar

[OC_DMAX]

From the poll, the expectations seem to be:

1. At least a 200,000 mile service life from the injectors.

2. A cost slightly above to $1,000 to replace the injectors.


The DMAX product reality seems to be:

1. Somewhere around 100,000 miles, injector work will need to be done.

2. The cost is from $4,000 to $6,000 for replacement.


I wonder if General Motors would care to comment on their customer expectations versus the product reality? Maybe they have with their extended warranty offer on the injectors?

The extended injector warranty really addresses the first issue, mileage expectancy (missed by a factor of two from customer expectations). The extended warranty does not address the second topic though, which is cost to have the injectors replaced. The DMAX product missed customer expectations by a factor of roughly four on cost. So GM has additional work to do on this issue. Drive down the cost of injector replacement!!

I am also a little confused by their extended injector warranty, why only 7 years. If it is 200,000 miles, then it should just be 200,000 miles, with no time limit (JMO).


Alan

[ 06-10-2004, 05:04 AM: Message edited by: OC_DMAX ]

[MaxACL]

Hea Bill...hd90rider

What'd the new engine cost? And how's Marion?

Mike (in Spain right now:))

[Turbo Al]

Thanks Big Wheel for the post. Maybe if everyone did the amount of research I do before buying big ticket items there would be a lot less complaining afterwards. I do relize that faulty injectors were NOT forseen by GM or Bosh. It will be the year 2021 before my truck see the 200,000 mark tongue.gif
Jomar I do have a broken crow bar which is almost totally useless now but I still keep it. :rolleyes:
Al

[MAV]

Did anyone else get a letter from GM with your truck VIN on it saying the warranty has been extended to 7 yrs and 200,000 miles on my Duramax engine? I did.

[OC_DMAX]

Reference this thread:

http://forum.thedieselpage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=007761

People with 2001 and 2002 model year trucks received the letter you mention.

[MAV]

I seen that after I posted. I only get to get here every 2-3 weeks or so.

[VA_Dmax]

Is it usually labor costs that keep the injector replacement high? Maybe GM is trying to do a little to drop the cost. I might be mistaken but I thought they made them accessible without removing the valve covers for the LLY. Hopefully that will help reduce the bill for future owners, but not us LB7 owners

[hd90rider]

MAX Acl, Marion is still getting richer,although our rate is .97 now. The new engine installed was just over $11,000. Hurry home . Bill

[56Nomad]

The article says:

"designed for a 200,000-mile operating life with 10,000-mile oil change intervals"

What caught my eye with the oil change intervals.
Is there anyone using dino oil changing it near
10,000 mile use?

:eek:

[Commuter Cop]

Does this extended warranty also cover the 2003's???? Isn't it essentially the same motor????? :confused:

[dieseldog62]

MAV , you need to look at that letter closer. GM is only extending warranty on injectors not complete engine, & only for problems related to high fuel return rate, which is not the only way an injector can fail .

dieseldog62

[Brucec]

I have the 2001 and did not get any letter stating my engine warranty was extended to two years.

[Turbo Al]

Dieseldog, I think they (GM) have just about got any problems with the injectors covered --
"(SES) light illumination, low engine power, hard start, and/or fuel in crankcase, requiring injector replacement, as a result of high fuel return rates due to fuel injector body cracks or ball seat erosion." I really can't think of much else going wrong with them except plain wearing them out.
Al

[deuce]

As luck would have it, I lost another injector (first one crapped the bed last August) two days before I got the letter from GM about the injecter Service Bullettin extended warrantee. This time is took out the return line seal and was blowing fuel into the crankcase. What a mess. Anyhow, dealer replaced all 8 however my fuel millage didn't recover. I had been getting 18 highway (73 MPH) and 10 towing (~7000lbs also at 73). Now I'm getting 15 and 8. Anyone else seeing this type of dropoff?

[dieseldog62]

There are other ways for an inj. to fail that does not fall under guidelines, such as inj. leaking from tip or stopped up . In these cases the SES may or may not come on. Also only certain codes are covered. I just put 4 i***. in drivers side for a guy that were not covered. One inj.had high balance rate (+12 mm3)& did not affect return rate or rail pressure. GM is verifying inj. for high return flow rate. If you don't meet criteria , you pay. Otherwise we could be charged back.

[More Power]

Thanks to everyone who voted in this poll.

http://www.thedieselpage.com/images/injectorpoll.gif

The results are certainly interesting, but I'm surprised so many people think a set of these injectors could be replaced for less than $1K. The labor alone would be a big chunk of that amount.

I predict that eventually, LB7 injectors will become available through diesel injection service companies. Once that happens, prices could fall dramatically. Also, many owners with an out of warranty engine might be willing to do the R&R themselves. Then, it'll likely be doable for under $1K.

New replacement and performance nozzle components are already available through the aftermarket. We'll be discussing some of these in the upcoming 2004 Rendezvous coverage.

Thanks again,

MP

[YZF1R]

I voted for the 1k to 2k figure figuring on the labor. I however noticed the votes for the less than 1k too. Depending how you read it, I'm wondering if some thought it was the cost of a set of replacements vs. the cost of a set of replacements, replaced.

Steve

[OC_DMAX]

I was thinking $2000 for the whole job myself at around a 100k - 150k mile interval. From my perspective, that would be acceptable. When we start talking $4K to $5K, that is starting to become a serious repair bill. At that point, you might be better off trading the truck for a new one.

Another aspect the LB7 design is once you pay the price for the service tech to open the cylinder bank up to replace a bad injector, you might as well get the other 3 on that same side. The labor at this point cannot cost that much more.

In my opinion, the key in all this is to get the cost of the injector way down. GM needs to minimize the interal GM organization mark-ups. This would go a long way on restraining costs. IT WOULD BE REALLY INTERESTING TO KNOW THE ACTUAL COST GM PAYS BOSCH FOR ONE INJECTOR.

[quadrunner500]

You're seriously scaring me now. I have 47,000 miles on my great looking '01, no injector problems so far, but...

1.) GM did hype this as a 200,000 mile motor.
2.) The dual mass flywheel problem did happen a month ago. They advised against repair at that time, that GM engineering was working on a fix.

I'm losing faith. I may unload the truck and GM forever.