Duramax Burned to the Ground

[Albee]

My son in laws 02 Duramax pickup caught fire and burnt to the ground. His extension cord he used to plug in his block heater shorted and caught the factory wiring under the hood on fire and up she went. Fire inspector said everyone should use a GFCI when plugging in your truck. If ya don't have them already in your garage, then you can buy GFCI extension cords to use. Apparently the extension cord shorted and the circuit breaker did not trip, higher amps were sent through the cord and caught the factory cord on fire. I always figured that a household circuit breaker would trip on a short like that, but it didn't. Thought you all would find this interesting.

[markrinker]

Sorry to hear that. At least it was an accident without human cost.

My GFI outlet in the garage started tripping when I was plugging in #1 earlier this season. It was the first sign that the block heater needed to be replaced. When I plugged it into a non-GFI outlet, it still heated, but not 100%. Something internally had corroded and it was shorting out.

My theory for now: If your truck trips a GFI, heating or not, replace the block heater, not the GFI or plug you use. There is a reason.

[More Power]

This is what, the second or third report of a Duramax fire. Upon re-reading the lead-in post, I saw that the extension cord was the culprit for this fire.

Sometimes we forget how dangerous some of the common items we use can be.

MP

[ 02-03-2005, 01:59 PM: Message edited by: More Power ]

[rjschoolcraft]

I've heard of this on Powerstrokes in the past... My UPS driver said he would never own another diesel because his F250 went up in smoke from a shorted block heater. Showed me pictures...it was ugly.

I posted in another thread on this subject about using GFCI outlets and was soundly whipped by another member, but I still think it is very good advice. At least the fire inspector agrees with me.

[More Power]

I'm with you Ron...

Perhaps it would be better if block heaters were designed as GFCI....... instead of relying on the public to do the right thing.

MP

[dcalex]

I'm sure sorry to hear about the fire and I hope the insurance comes through alright.
About the GFCI's. Guys, you gotta be careful here. Too many folks think that a GFI is the end-all and cure-all of electrical failures and they're not. As the name implies, they are good at detecting "ground faults". Their main use is to protect "us" when we become part of the electrical circuit to ground.....shock....electrocution.
Many failures are not of this type. A clean short circuit to ground in the case of the fire would have tripped the regular circuit breaker and there's a good chance that a GFI wouldn't have done any better. Many faults are disguised as normal load and a 20 Amp circuit will create a LOT of heat before an abnormality is detected. Think of your toaster. A GFI would not detect that as a failure, yet when you think about it, that's what it is....a controlled electrical fault.....in this case its the load on the circuit.
The inspector was wrong if he implied that a GFI would have definitely prevented this fire. Bye-the-way....as a rule, the average Joe Jones fire inspector has no special expertise in electrical matters. They have a lot of education in tracing fires to their origin....often electrical in nature....but it usually stops there because thats as far as it really needs to go for them. So don't take what he said as the gospel. How do I know this.....38 years in the Fire Service.
Try this scenario in your mind....the cord for the heater is tucked away in the frame.....rubbing on it as you drive...insulation becomes worn....thin....maybe broken.....you plug it in....there's a voltage leak....not a lot since really the vehicle is not grounded....slow accumulation of heat....Circuit breakers feel the load but nothing out of the ordinary...they're doing their job (there is no clean, clear fault to ground nor is there an abnormal load) grease, oil and other combustables abound.....combustion begins....grows....sustains itself....you now have a free burning fire.
I wouldn't begin to say this is what happened. I use it only to illustrate how a fault can occur and not be detected.

[rjschoolcraft]

Many of these situations do occur as a result of a short to ground, not to neutral. In fact, I would argue that is the most common situation encountered. In that case, a GFCI outlet will protect the equipment. In the case of an internal short to neutral, only a ciruit breaker will protect that.

So, is it bad advice to use a GFCI outlet? No. Do I know how GFCI outlets work and what they protect against? Yes.

It is rather difficult to establish an outlet specifically for the block heater protected by a circuit breaker with a trip amperage just greater than the heater requires. That circuit would be useless for much of anything else. On the other hand, modern electrical code requires GFCI outlets in garages and other areas where shorts to chassis ground are common.

It is a very wise decision to use a GFCI outlet when plugging in a block heater, regardless what else is said or implied about this subject.

I didn't respond before in the other thread when it was implied that I was ignorant on this issue...

Second time, though...

[DmaxMaverick]

Sorry to hear about the fire. Glad no one was hurt.


What's the bottom line here? GM!!

Maybe drastic, but everyone should STOP using their heaters and bombard GM with complaints until a proper remedy and recall has been done, by GM. I'm not much of a gambler, but I don't like the odds, and the possible price to be paid. What's GM going to do? Wait for people to die before they do something?

I haven't used my heater, yet. I won't until the problem has been eliminated. Just too much at stake.

It IS a design problem. I've used (and used up) several heaters on all other Diesel light truck engine heaters with NO issues, nor have I heard of others having problems (not including normal failures).

[mdrag]

Originally posted by Albee:
...His extension cord he used to plug in his block heater shorted and caught the factory wiring under the hood on fire and up she went...Doesn't sound like this one is GM's fault? :eek:

[Jake99Z71]

My buddy's truck burned up while plugged into a GFI outlet. So this doesn't always protect you. Wiring was checked by the fire inspector afterwards to be good on the GFI outlet.

[More Power]

Short term recommendations.....

1- Make absolutely certain you never plug your truck's block heater into anything other than a tested and known good/operating GFCI outlet using a UL approved extension cord with the proper amperage rating for the circuit breaker.

2- Check the condition of the power cord connecting to your engine's block heater. Check for frayed wiring, cracks in the insulation, and that the removeable cord is plugged completely into the block heater.

3- Route the block heater cord directly away from the engine and over to the frame, away from fuel lines, ATF oil lines, other wiring, or anything that might be flammable. Use nylon safety ties to secure the cord in ways that prevent chafing, wear and other hazards that might deteriorate the condition of the cord.

4- If you use the block heater, check for a heat buildup in the wiring or odd electrical smells within an hour of plugging the truck in.

5- Install a smoke detector in your garage.

6- Don't use the block heater if your garage is connected to your home.

Maybe you guys have a few more.....

MP

[dcalex]

Ronniejoe: I absolutely agree with everything you said. No way would I want to detract from the value of a GFI. My fear was that folks would think of it as the absolute cure-all for any electrical fault and I've seen enough electrical fires from GFI protected circuits to know this isn't always the case.
You know I've been wondering about these heaters. Anyone know if they're U.L. tested and rated? They might not have to be since they're part of an assembly rather than sold as a single unit....just don't know. I would assume that an aftermarket unit would be though.

[OC_DMAX]

The GFI breaker measures the current on both the line and return (neutral) of an AC circuit. If the difference in current between the two is not very close to zero, it trips the circuit.

The only situation I can think of where a GFI breaker would perform similar to a regular circuit breaker is if the line and return (or neutral) are shorted together. In this case, the differences between the two still cancel out and the GFI portion of the circuit breaker thinks everything is OK. Where in reality a short circuit condition exists, along with a fire potential. In this case you would have to exceed the capacity of the breaker (typically 15 or 20 amps) before the circuit is interrupted.

Any other situation where current is seeking another return path besides the normal neutral, will trip the GFI portion of the breaker.

So in post above, if the short in the extension cord was to ground, the GFI would have helped. If the short was directly between the line and neutral, a GFI breaker would have acted just like another breaker.

Typically, an extension cord will not just short together. Something must have sliced the cord or the current handling capability of the extension cord was exceeded (ie. they used an 18 gauge extension cord where a 12 gauge cord should have been used).

[madmatt]

I know this is hard for some to swallow, but your owners manual tells how/when to use your engine coolant heater and gives recommendations for extension cord and outlet useage. Also there is no indication that there is a known problems w/ D-Max heaters causing fires when used properly.

[Tough Guy]

These few incidents of fire make wonder how long the trucks were plugged in for....

If you plug in your vehicle use a GFCI and also a TIMER, your vehicle should not need more than 3 hours on the coldest of nights/days..

Cheers

[Idle_Chatter]

I'm with Tough Guy. I have my cord plugged into a high-amp timer and a GFCI outlet in my garage attached to the house. It kicks on at 4:30, I usually roll out the door around 6:00 and if I decide to play hooky the timer trips off the heater at 7:00.

[urcndust]

I'm with both of you. I have the truck on a timer, comes on at 3:00 am and shuts off at 6:15 am when I leave for work.It is plugged into a gfci circuit and I also made sure I used a high amperage extention cord. I was using a lighter duty cord and noticed the plug was getting hot, changed it out and now it is as cool as when I plug it in. After being plugged in for the 3+ hours, the attitude reads the temperature at 133 degrees F.

[royalglen]

Picked up 05 Duramax 2500 the other day and there was excessive road salt on transmission, transfer case, engine etc. This not from delivery to dealer because the frame, steering parts,shocks,etc were totally clean.Is it possible that road salt gets in electrical plugin ports and corrodes over time and when moisture builds up it starts to short to ground????When the engine is so badly coated salt all the ports must be exposed to problems.This problem happens before engine,transmission,etc are installed in the truck.Any ideas???

[crafty]

I bought a little gadget at a farm show a few years back that takes all the guess work out of testing or knowing if the block heater works. Check out this web site. http://www.elliotlake.com/plugrite/

It sells for $30 or $50 depending on which model you order. (prices are in Can$)

I had the above posted on another thread and I thought maybe I'd put it here as well. I don't know if this device will show when a block heater is going bad but I do know it tells me that the heater is working. I've had this for about 6 or 7 years. :D :D :D

[Showgood1]

Along some of the same lines as what dcalex said. I am a licensed electrician. Here's how a GFI works.....GFI's measure the current "comeing and going" on the hot and the neutral if there is any deviation between the two it will trip. IT WILL NOT PROTECT AGAINST OVER-CURRENT!!!I'm not saying GFI's are not a good idea like dcalex said they are not the end all cure all to prevent fire as many would have you to believe. They can do and will go bad. I've replaced many over the years. Dirt, heavy use and just plain old age like anything else takes its toll and they ware out. Often when they are going bad they will trip under any load, so you might or might not have a bad heater. In fact if one was tripping on a block heater I'd start at the GFI before the block heater. Make sure that the cord you are useing is big enough to carry the load and is in good shape. Do not use more than 100 feet of cord at a time, don't daisy chain 2 or 3 cords together. No garantee but occationally check the end of the cord that the heater is plugged in to for excessive heat after it has been running awhile. Also if you have the old Federal Pacific panel in your house or business have a qualified electrician replace it as soon as you can afford it. Any breaker can fail but these perticular ones are notorious for it. The origanal company went out of business because they lost ther UL listing.

[carco]

I owned a 74 firebird and lived in Lafayette In. back in about 1979 cold in the winter and wife drove it to work so I instaled an inline heater hose heater. Went out early to start car, dark and cold, started right up idled great, turned on the headlights but none came on!!! Started looking, the front fiberglass and plastic bumper was charred away to ashes, cord or heater had shorted and burned! Old time screw in fuse still good in fuse box in garage. car was within 18 inches of the wood garage sideing! no charred sideing! New front end parts good as new. Now rollback sets in garage plugged in every night at the house and is on a GFI breaker. bob...

[tanker]

I'm wondering how many plug in the block heater with the cord still wire tied? :rolleyes: We all should know that cords in knots or tied together is a no-no. This creates heat which can and will melt the insulation and start a fire. Also what gauge wire and how long is the extension cord being used? :eek: Those nice blue or green or yellow extension cords look nice, but check the amperage it will carry. The shorter the cord, and the heavier guage, the better you are. (I'm not an electrician, just cautious) ;)

[n3qik]

A good way to check your block heater is to take a meter and mesure ohms from each prong of the cord to frame ground.Both hot and netureal should show no readings. Ground I can't rebember if it is to frame ground or not.

[rsgs]

I had a similar thing happen to me, but my truck didn't burn down. I ran conduit underground to a post with a weatherproof box. In the box, I had a GFI. I made a pig tail of 10 gauge wire about 4 feet long to connect the plug from the truck to the box. Came out one morning and found the cord from the truck melted back about 1 foot. The GFI did not trip, but the circuit did. One more trip to the dealer and, of course, it was not a warranty issue. They claimed I must have had faulty wiring in the box. Checked the wiring all the way back to the house and it was fine. If I had a dollar for every warranty issue the dealer has wiggled out of, maybe I could pay for my next "warranty" trip.

[The_SHADOW]

First always use a good quality cord rated to handle the wattage or amperage for it's intended use. The cord if it is too light, or too long could have high enough resistance trying to carring the load but heating itself in the process.

Second there are newer type breakers called "ARC Fault Breakers", these have an electronic circuit, which sees the "ARC" signature and responds by switching itself off.

The actual plug was probably the culprit in most instances, cords which are being used on a regular basis, they will tend to loose their grip with many repeated plug and un-plug cycles. Then as a heavier load is placed, an small arc (not seen because it's inside the female plug) will heat up slowly at this loose connection. Heat will continue to rise to the ignition temperature of the cords insulation or other combustable!